Rapid roll-out of vaccine? Yes, but not in France....!

[NormanH]

Covid..

https://www.lejdd.fr/Societe/vaccin-contre-le-covid-19-quest-ce-que-le-consentement-4015419

[mint]

Norman, have you really not noticed that nomoss is ...er....losing it a bit?[:P]

But I did find your link interesting and I also heard a tv discussion tonight where someone said we are the only country in the world that has a pre vaccine consultation with a doctor.  And then the bit about giving the Ehpad folk a written explanation.....!  For crying out loud, by the time the explanations have been read and understanding ascertained and signatures obtained, the occupants of the Ehpads might well have lost the will to live.

As they are making such a big thing of the vaccine, it's no wonder that more and more people are viewing it as somehow "dangerous".  As your article has said, why not just treat it as any normal "ordonnance" to be given to those whose health condition allows?

 

The phrase that comes to my mind from your link is from the doctor who said that "Les morts ne se rattraperont pas"

[nomoss]

[quote user="mint"]

Norman, have you really not noticed that nomoss is ...er....losing it a bit?[:P]

....................................  [/quote]

Sorry, I forgot the French don't always get British humour. (JOKE)

I have added some bold type and a jokey thing to indicate this to my post [:D]

[Catalpa]

I'm sure someone has already provided this vaccine tracker link (France has vaccinated about 7000 people so far - 5000 yesterday, on 5th January) but as a reminder, here you go:

https://covidtracker.fr/vaccintracker/

It certainly isn't 'rapid'.

Scroll down to see how other countries are getting on with their programmes.

[mint]

Excellent site, Catalpa, and it has made me more depressed than ever.

Today, I saw on tv that as many as 16 médecins have so far been vaccinated.  Do we put out flags?

No wonder that in this context, France is la risée du monde[+o(]  And, no, I didn't come up with that phrase.....

[Catalpa]

[:)] We will get there eventually, Mint... but yeah, the general thinking around the French vaccination plan is a bit odd - to this Anglo-Saxon brain anyway.

What I really can't understand is why France is so vaccine-averse. A country that is so wedded to its pills and potions... why? [8-)]

[mint]

Alas, Catalpa, getting there EVENTUALLY might not be enough.  The longer the dilly-dallying, the more time the virus has to mutate and reinvent itself and infect and KILL more and more.

The thing about the anti-vaxxers is that, the more the government goes on obtaining written consent, giving excuses, is that the antis have lots more time to tweet and post and spread their cynicism.  A verbal consent should be enough because, after all, we are not talking about major surgery and getting a general anaesthetic, are we?

[NormanH]

A very interesting site. Thank you.

I think there is the memory of 2009 in the mind of the authorities, plus the fear of "les gens prodéduriers"

In addition there is an innate  insistence on 'human rights' that doesn't fit with the cavalier attitude of Boris and co., but might be considered as "too much of a good thing" in the present situation..

[nomoss]

Thank you Catalpa.

[NormanH]

https://www.lefigaro.fr/sciences/covid-19-comment-prendre-rendez-vous-pour-se-faire-vacciner-20210107

[pomme]

Catalpa wrote: What I really can't understand is why France is so vaccine-averse. A country that is so wedded to its pills and potions... why?

In the 1990s hepatitis B vaccination was compulsory in schools. There were then rumours of increased multiple sclerosis cases and the vaccination was rapidly dropped. That caused the concerns. In 2002 the World Health Organization said “despite a slightly elevated odds ratio observed in the initial studies, none showed a statistically significantly elevated risk".

In 2009 the H1N1 bird flu vaccines was linked to (unproven) narcolepsy. The H1N1 also helped turn the French from vaccination centres to wanting to receive it from their own doctor.

A 2019 learned journal article "Why France is making eight new vaccines mandatory" gives more detail (2. How vaccines became controversial in France) https://hal.archives-ouvertes.fr/hal-01789212/file/Ward%20Verger.pdf

[Catalpa]

Thanks for the information and links, Pomme. Now I know what to research, it makes interesting reading and answers my questions.

[NormanH]

There was a Guardian article a couple of years ago. It mentions the 2009 vaccination  that I referred to as a 'turning point' but speaks of some earlier sources of anxiety also

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/jun/19/french-scepticism-over-vaccines-reflects-distrust-of-government

There is the review of a book on the History of the movemet "Antivax. La résistance aux vaccins du XVIII^e siècle à nos jours, Vendémiaire, 360 p., 23 €." 

Here :https://www.la-croix.com/Sciences-et-ethique/Sante/Antivax-longue-histoire-anti-vaccins-2019-01-08-1200993837

[Catalpa]

And a new Guardian article on the subject this morning...

https://www.theguardian.com/global/2021/jan/11/vaccine-scepticism-in-france-reflects-dissatisfaction-with-political-class

[nomoss]

I checked the site which was due to open today for the general public, previously for health workers only. [url]https://sante.fr/[/url]

It listed the infirmières at our local cabinet.

I phoned them, but was told they can't do Covid vaccinations, as they have no access to nor storage for the vaccine, and the only place available is the general hospital 30 km away, which doesn't even appear on the list.

[betise]

But the site does say "Attention, la réservation n'est pas encore ouverte au grand public.". It lists our infermière too. In fact, it looks an awful lot like the site linked to from the anti covid app for testing locations.

[nomoss]

[quote user="betise"]But the site does say "Attention, la réservation n'est pas encore ouverte au grand public.". It lists our infermière too. In fact, it looks an awful lot like the site linked to from the anti covid app for testing locations.[/quote]

Yes, that note has been there since the site opened, but the search facility was not there, and according to this article, published last Thursday (7th Jan) [url]https://www.lefigaro.fr/sciences/covid-19-comment-prendre-rendez-vous-pour-se-faire-vacciner-20210107[/url] 

"Les personnes âgées de 75 ans et plus, dans un premier temps, devront prendre rendez-vous pour se faire vacciner. Elles «seront libres d'aller consulter (leur) médecin traitant, mais ce n'est pas une obligation», a expliqué Olivier Véran.

L'inscription

pourra se faire par téléphone, via un numéro national bientôt

communiqué ou directement via le numéro d'un centre de vaccination. «Un centre par département a déjà été ouvert, a expliqué le ministre, et il y en aura 300 à partir de lundi (today, 11th Jan) ». Les personnes qui souhaiteront se faire vacciner pourront également passer par le site sante.fr, sur lequel une carte interactive s'affichera, avec la liste des centres disponibles"

I bookmarked the site and put a note on my calendar to check today.

Seems one has to recheck every day.

[NormanH]

This is the place that the  site says is our Vaccination centre [:-))]

https://www.google.com/maps/place/43%C2%B020'15.8%22N+3%C2%B012'56.0%22E/@43.3377393,3.2155146,3a,75y,48.85h,74.19t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1soXROGHFvdRW-K6u_OMae6w!2e0!6s%2F%2Fgeo2.ggpht.com%2Fmaps%2Fphotothumb%2Ffd%2Fv1%3Fbpb%3DChEKD3NlYXJjaC5nd3MtcHJvZBIgChIJlVN8K_QOsRIRJNj1y1kpP04qCg0AAAAAFQAAAAAaBAhWEFY%26gl%3DFR!7i13312!8i6656!4m5!3m4!1s0x0:0x0!8m2!3d43.337731!4d3.215568

[cajal]

And meanwhile Mac(r)on has been busy spending €600,000 on flowers for the Elysee Palace even though, as far as I know, it is closed.

You could certainly make a dint in the logistics issue with that amount of money.

"The country will be different with my leadership" 

Yeah, right.

[woolybanana]

Round here the centres seem to be only State hospitals, thus far. Seems a bit stupid really. Doubtless there will be more opened when less complex vaccines are available.

Also, it seems a sad time to announce this?

https://www.lesoir.be/348156/article/2021-01-11/restaurants-le-guide-michelin-devoile-ses-etoiles-belges

[nomoss]

Norman. I can't reply to your post, as the relevant buttons have disappeared off into the advert area on the RHS.

Anyway, maybe you can get your passion wagon serviced while you have your jab...............

[pomme]

It has been announced it will be possible for the over-75s to book a first injection appointment from Thur 14 Jan on sante.fr Various centres will be open from Mon 18 Jan to give the injections. Not all those centres will be open immediately to the general public but all should be open by the end of January.

[mint]

Yes, tried the sante.fr site a couple of times this morning and had the same experience as nomoss and betise.  Have not been able to try since as my reseau has been down.  Just come back on so won't check now until Thursday.

The Moderna vaccine arrived in France today and I saw on the TV that Marseille has received 5000 doses.

Would be good if everyone watches out and, for goodness sake, share the info on here?  Thanks[:)]

[NormanH]

https://sante.fr/centre-de-vaccination-public-et-international-de-beziers

If you look that address up on Street View you will see what I mean..

[NormanH]

[quote user="pomme"]It has been announced it will be possible for the over-75s to book a first injection appointment from Thur 14 Jan on sante.fr Various centres will be open from Mon 18 Jan to give the injections. Not all those centres will be open immediately to the general public but all should be open by the end of January.[/quote]

I can still only see

"

Lieux de vaccination COVID-19

 

La vaccination est désormais ouverte à l’ensemble des personnes

volontaires de plus de 50 ans ou présentant des comorbidités avec risque

de forme grave de COVID-19 appartenant aux catégories suivantes :

• professionnels de santé, y compris les professionnels libéraux ;
• personnel des établissements de santé et médico-sociaux intervenant auprès des personnes vulnérables ;
• pompiers ;
• aides à domicile intervenant auprès des personnes vulnérables.

Si vous êtes concerné, vous pouvez vous faire vacciner dès à présent

dans un des centres de vaccination ouverts. Attention, la réservation

n'est pas encore ouverte au grand public.