AnOther Posted April 6, 2009 Share Posted April 6, 2009 HADOPI commethProvision of Internet access for Gite or B&B guests is now to risky to allow and if you have kids you can't even let them lose anymore [:'(]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lya8_jKX3FE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Théière Posted April 6, 2009 Share Posted April 6, 2009 Scary, what are you not allowed to do? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugsy Posted April 7, 2009 Share Posted April 7, 2009 [quote user="teapot"]Scary, what are you not allowed to do? [/quote]Anything deemed illegal by the government ...................... thats a narrow field then, not.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Théière Posted April 7, 2009 Share Posted April 7, 2009 Don't do as I do, do as I say? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clair Posted April 7, 2009 Share Posted April 7, 2009 The Act aims to curb illegal downloading of music and / or films. To dothis, the text establishes a mechanism of "flexible response" under theleadership of the High Administrative Authority. When someone illegally downloads a musical work or film from theInternet, he will be called to order, first by a warning email, then, in case of recurrence, by a letter, and finally suspension ortermination of their internet subscription.The opponents are numerous, from associations of users and citizens to French MEPs andlawyers ... The European Parliament also voted on April 10 a resolutionwhich "calls on the Commission and Member States to avoid takingmeasures which are inconsistent with civil liberties and human rightsand the principles proportionality, effectiveness and deterrence, suchas the interruption of Internet access. " In France, the CNIL and Arcep have also spoken against the bill.ARCEP arguing that the principle of "flexible response" puts theInternet service providers (ISPs) in contradiction with severalexisting contractual obligations(the obligation to "ensure uninterrupted access to emergencyservices" for example). CNILconsidered that, legally, the law would pose a problem of"proportionality between the infringement of privacy (mass collectionof IP addresses, denial of Internet access) and respect for property rights (the protection of rights). "The suspension of Internet access concentrates critical opponents ofthe text. The latter in fact consider this "disproportionate", since itwould imply a "electronic social death" of the user referred to by thesanction. Another problem is that tracking the pirates is to be made by private companies. The rights-holders and producers will identify the offenders on the Internet site.Such investigations are currently jurisdiction.Third point of tension, the law gives judicial powers to the solely administrative Hadopi authority. However, constitutionally, only thejudicial authority is able to investigate and adjudicate criminalmatters. Currently, pirates who download illegally are fined up to 300 000 eurosand risk three years in prison. Another obstacle, and not the smallest, is at technology level: the Internet service providers (ISPs)are not, yet, able to filter the entire network. Yet it is from the ISPthat Hadopi wants to retrieve the pirates'coordinates.Source Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnOther Posted April 7, 2009 Author Share Posted April 7, 2009 I think you might well find ISP fees rising too as it is they who will be expected to police their customers activity.EDIT: I stand corrected on this point by Clair.Frankly this is a seriously flawed piece of legislation made by those who absolutely do not understand what they are talking about. If you have read the article you will note that when asked about P2P and BitTorrents, the 2 prime methods of illegal file sharing, very few even really knew what they were.It will be interesting to see how this develops, especially considering the shameless way it was prematurely and opportunistically voted on and passed by a mere 12 delegates out of 16 who were in parliament at the time out of a possible total of 577.I'd also like to know what cultural media they profess to be trying toprotect as France is not exactly at the forefront in producing worldclass music and movies and they have no mandate to be the worldsInternet police. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Théière Posted April 7, 2009 Share Posted April 7, 2009 Oh so it's meant to protect the seriously rich music and film industry, silly me thought it maybe to stamp out paedophiles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnOther Posted April 7, 2009 Author Share Posted April 7, 2009 [quote user="teapot"]Oh so it's meant to protect the seriously rich music and film industry[/quote]As ever teapot, as ever [blink] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugsy Posted April 7, 2009 Share Posted April 7, 2009 This legislation is not just France....it's the whole of Europe.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnOther Posted April 7, 2009 Author Share Posted April 7, 2009 Not in UK it isn't nor Germany so where did you get that from ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clair Posted April 7, 2009 Share Posted April 7, 2009 Where does it leave the MacDonalds and other public hotspots? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Théière Posted April 7, 2009 Share Posted April 7, 2009 Exactly what I thought this morning Clair. We were thinking of supplying wifi but not any more. Even free wifi couldn't tempt me into that place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clair Posted April 7, 2009 Share Posted April 7, 2009 I have been looking at a range extender to make it easier for paying guests, but I'll hold back for a while. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Coeur de Lion Posted April 7, 2009 Share Posted April 7, 2009 Surely the easiest way to combat piracy is to make these movies and songs available to buy at a reasonable cost?I have maintained for years that 15 euros for a 90 minute movie is far too much, when most are worth at best 3 euros a watch. (Sometimes I feel they should be paying me to watch some of the crap they put out, but that's beside the point).If I could pay to download a movie for 3 euros (which means no need for the materials of a dvd, thereby much greener than now) in dvd quality (not avi or dvd rips), then I probably would.As for the music side of things, that has gone downhill majorly since the 90's and they deserve all the pirating they get because it is rubbish! They are scam artists, not pop artists.Some bands have already gone down this road with great success. I think Radiohead last year issued an album FOC to download and then people donated how much the felt it was worth after. I believe they made more money that way as they didn't have to pay any fat cat middle men.On the plus side of this secure your connection stuff, I have a livebox. It's hard enough for me to connect to the thing, let alone anyone else! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugsy Posted April 7, 2009 Share Posted April 7, 2009 [quote user="ErnieY"]Not in UK it isn't nor Germany so where did you get that from ?[/quote]Deleted as I posted the wrong bitEuropean Union Directive 2006/24/EC I think is the right one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny Posted April 7, 2009 Share Posted April 7, 2009 [quote user="Bugbear"][quote user="ErnieY"]Not in UK it isn't nor Germany so where did you get that from ?[/quote]Deleted as I posted the wrong bitEuropean Union Directive 2006/24/EC I think is the right one.[/quote]That directive relates to data retention by ISPs and telephone companies for 1 year to enable the Big Brother police state to take control of every aspect of our oops!! sorry - that is the other meeting in the paranoid room.... I mean check all our communications - emails, websites visited, phone calls etc. for possible illegal activities. The Loi Hadopi is a french law, designed - if it is possible to use that word for such an ineptly proposed law - to counter illegal filesharing of copyrighted material and protect the rights/profits of record companies and film companies or artists. Danny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin963 Posted April 7, 2009 Share Posted April 7, 2009 I wonder how this idiocy stands on Spotify.As far as I know Spotify is entirely legal, in that they pay fees to the record companies, and in my case I'm paying a sub. But I believe that Spotify works in much the same way as other sharers (ie your computer could be playing something it's stored to someone else) so it might *look* illegal from the ISP's point of view...? It's going to be a nightmare to police.Maybe I haven't understood it properly, but would wholeheartedly concur with the point above that if music and film were distributed at a sensible price piracy would be very rare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clair Posted April 8, 2009 Share Posted April 8, 2009 Loi Création et Internet adoptée en catimini Creation and Internet law adopted on the sly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clair Posted April 8, 2009 Share Posted April 8, 2009 Amendment:The subscriber whose internet access has been suspended as a result of illegaldownloads will have to continue paying the cost of the subscription.This had been successfully removed from the initial text approved by the Sénat last week, but a joint committee of senators and MPs has decided to re-establish the dual punishment of suspension plus subscription costs.Loi Hadopi : la "double peine" rétablie avant le vote définitifHadopi law: the "double jeopardy" restored before the final vote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Coeur de Lion Posted April 8, 2009 Share Posted April 8, 2009 Is this all to do with the 3 strikes and you're out as well? I thought that was deemed illegal by European courts.I watch a lot of football on line. I hope it doesnt include that. It's not like I can watch my team anywhere else as it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clair Posted April 8, 2009 Share Posted April 8, 2009 [quote user="LyndaandRichard"]Is this all to do with the 3 strikes and you're out as well? I thought that was deemed illegal by European courts.[/quote]As per my earlier post, the European Parliament voted on April 10 a resolutionwhich "calls on the Commission and Member States to avoid takingmeasures which are inconsistent with civil liberties and human rightsand the principles proportionality, effectiveness and deterrence, suchas the interruption of Internet access." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnOther Posted April 8, 2009 Author Share Posted April 8, 2009 Frankly I think this whole affair is ill conceived, shabby, and worthy of a banana republic not a supposed civilised country. I hope the EU parliament takes them fully to task.The current little Napoleon has some decent ideas but this is definitely not one of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clair Posted April 9, 2009 Share Posted April 9, 2009 Article in today's Times: France may ban illegal downloaders from internetAlso: Crackdown on piracy in France Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Théière Posted April 9, 2009 Share Posted April 9, 2009 If France do support the American film and music industry, I wonder if Microsoft will also pay up the money it owes the European union? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnOther Posted April 9, 2009 Author Share Posted April 9, 2009 I note that the basis of the functionality of this ill begotten scheme is the installation of a piece of software so I wonder what will happen if:A. one declines to install it orB. the hackers get their hand on it.I also note the absence of any mention of illegal downloading of software, just music and films. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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