BADLY BLOCKED TOILET

[Angie]

Our new holiday house has had several toilet blockages over the past year.  It stays clear for the first few days of our holiday and then backs up quite badly, so assume the blockage is quite a way down the pipe.  Because all the pipework runs underneath the house (from back to front) and then for about 80 metres to the road we (and 2 different plumbers) haven't been able to solve the problem long term.  We are always careful about what goes down the toilet so it may be something left in there by the builder.

A friend in the UK suggested using caustic soda (carefully I hasten to add and wearing all the appropriate protective equipment!) but swears by this method of drain and toilet clearing.  As we have tried everything else, branded products, auger and rods we are now thinking of going down this route.

Couple of questions to those of you in the know.  Is caustic soda available in France (doubt they would let us bring it on the plane!), has anyone successfully used this method and finally, would it damage our plastic drainage pipes?

Thanks very much.

[andyh4]

Yes caustic soda is available in France.  No you should not take it on a plane.

No it will not damage your plastic pipes, but unless the blockage is grease or fat it is not particularly likely to work.

[Val_2]

This may or may not be significant but my friend, after many years of an upstairs loo not running right and many interventions of different plumbers has discovered the problem. It appears because some of the pipework is running at a straight level from the loo along the back of the house until it goes down the vertical pipe into the drainage,that use over the years has caused a layer of thick waste to build up because there was not enough flush power to wash everything along the horizontal part until it starts to descend. It maybe that the pipes laid for this particular toilet are not installed correctly and giving the waste the descent it needs to evacuate completely and therefore it tends to block very easily nd quickly if people use a lot of paper etc. Water can't run uphill nor horizontal along pipes unless it has power behind it and half flushes on modern water saving loos certainly won't shift a lot. Most plumbers these days have a little camera they can put down troublesome pipes, our one did for my blocked outside drain and found the grease had all but blocked it up.

[Théière]

Quite right Val_2, Mary  if said toilet is blocking/backing up several times a year then get a drain surveyor to put a camera down. It could be anything from tree roots, to a partially crushed pipe etc. If this pie is shared with bathroom and/or kitchen are those sinks running slowly too?

Cristaux de Soude available in bricos

 

[Quillan]

To be honest if you have had two plumbers out and they, I assume, have either put rods or power washer down it to the main sewer then I fear that you will find it may be to do with the angle the waste pipe is at under the ground. Are there trees near the pipe run for instance as the roots can 'lift' the pipe or worse break it. Perhaps somebody has done some work outside your house, it is difficult to tell.

At the end of the day what you really want is a drain expert rather than a plumber. They will have all the kit and possibly even a camera so they can see exactly whats happening. Having said that I don't have a clue what these people are called with regards to looking them up in yellow pages as I have never used one but I am sure somebody will know. If you give a rough idea or where you live (nearest big town) perhaps somebody may know a good one they can recommend. You could also have a word with your mayor he/she might be able to suggest somebody.

Sorry I can't be of any other help and good luck.

Ps - If your lucky, and I am sure I am right, outside your property (like under the street/road) belongs to the 'council' so if the pipe is damaged there it may well be down to them if you can prove it (get a letter and facture from whoever does the unblocking and investigation). If it is inside your garden/house then it is down to you. If it is then do as you do in the UK get there written quotes and some references before choosing a builder.

[Quillan]

Sorry seem to have crossed posts but I think we are all saying the same thing basically.

[idun]

Or as was done on our estate, the builders never actually did the pipe work properly at all and the middle part of it was not there. Husband got out the devining rods and followed the pipe and the problem and he and the neighbours dug down and found that that pipe stopped and then started again about a meter away. We got the DDASS involved to be honest. The builder came and sorted it all out then.

Have you checked that something is coming out at the far end of the pipe?

[Alan Zoff]

We had a serious blockage a couple of years ago affecting the whole house. Caustic soda had no effect whatsover. It took a lorry producing enormous water pressure to shift the blockage which was about half-way down our drive.

They said in our case it was because the pipe run was quite long and shallow and we were not using the house often enough to keep the effluent wet and mobile. As soon as a small amount had dried out in the pipe, it gave something for other waste to cling to and eventually blocked the pipe completely. The first we knew was when it had backed up into the cellar - nice - by which time there was far too much to shift by DIY means.

We are now careful to slosh plenty of water through the system on arrival and departure and have not had any problem since. I think the lorry man charged us about 100 euros.

  

[Angie]

I think that the problem is more likely to be similar to Alan Zoff's post as we saw the pipework laid and it was quite shallow but it seemed to have been done properly, so therefore we may have to go down the lorry blasting route.  Our driveway is very long too.   The house is away from the village so no-one else shares our pipework as such so guess its totally our problem.  There are no trees close by either fortunately so don't think they would be causing the problem. 

 

Thanks all for your advice re: the caustic soda.  Didn’t realise it only worked on greasy deposits! 

[Théière]

[quote user="Mary W"]

 

Thanks all for your advice re: the caustic soda.  Didn’t realise it only worked on greasy deposits! 

[/quote]

It doesn't, it will work on hair, skin, paper etc, it just that most drain blockages are fat/grease based.

[nomoss]

Caustic Soda (Lye) is very good for unblocking drains, but DO be careful when handling it, as it can be very dangerous.

Edit: I think it's worth trying this simple approach before spending money on special equipment, as you said the pipes are quite new and any reputable builder will have laid the pipes with the correct fall. The normal slope is 1:50, which may have looked shallow to you, but too much slope can cause almost as many problems as too little.

DON'T add water to the Caustic Soda, add the Caustic Soda slowly to the water.

See http://www.newton.dep.anl.gov/askasci/chem07/chem07255.htm

I use a plastic bucket and stir it with a long stick. Rubber gloves and goggles are recommended, just in case.

When you have a strong solution pour it carefully down the toilet and leave it until you have flow at the far end - I assume you have an inspection manhole somewhere down the line (regard, trou de visite) where you can observe this.

Edit: If you have no manholes in the line I would suggest adding one near the end of your property, and another near where the pipe exits from under the house.

It is called soude caustique in the brico shops where I have bought it.

 

 

[Angie]

Really appreciate this - will definitely give it a go before resorting to spending too much money.  We have two manholes; one by the house and one about halfway down the garden so hopefully we can sort it using this method.  Thanks again everyone.

[Alan Zoff]

Hope I'm wrong but I would be surprised if caustic soda will shift such a serious blockage, especially as you say 2 plumbers have already looked at it. We put loads down ours which had no effect whatsoever (apart from putting into the drainage system undesirable chemicals)

But having 2 inspection covers is a real bonus - we could find none in our drive. Had we had access, I would have tried rodding the drain first, although from what the lorry chap said, it would have needed even more than that to shift the size of the blockage in our pipe.

Good luck

[Théière]

[quote user="Alan Zoff"]Hope I'm wrong but I would be surprised if caustic soda will shift such a serious blockage, especially as you say 2 plumbers have already looked at it. We put loads down ours which had no effect whatsoever (apart from putting into the drainage system undesirable chemicals) [/quote]

Sodium hydroxide (caustic soda) sodium, hydrogen and oxygen pretty prevalent in our world and won't cause any issues. It will actually aid the drainage system by loosening deposits of fats and hair known to clog drains and in the process it will itself get broken down. 

[Alan Zoff]

Thanks for that T. Still learning!

[sid]

I'm thinking the title of this thread is wrong! The toilet appears to be VERY WELL blocked! [:D]

 

[Lehaut]

For what its worth, have been involved in two blocked toilet issues that had nothing to do with the pipes. One, in a holiday home, was caused by the plastic clip from a toilet cleaning block that was trapped in the actual toilet bowl, round the bend. Rodding pushed the paper etc clear, but left the plastic clip. The second was caused by a chap who drained his cat food over the toilet. A tin lid fell in (!) and when he flushed it away it also lodged in the the back of the toilet. It operated as a "flap valve", sometimes wide open, somtimes half shut. When rodding the toilet, the bendy spring went either side of the "hinged" lid. Both problems were solved by actually removing the toilet bowl and manually removing the obstruction.

[Angie]

You're kidding?  What's with some people?  No cats or toilet blocks in our property thank goodness!

[woolybanana]

Mary, you still blocked? Great Bobo, but you must be fed up with finding discreet bits of garden in the night..... if there are any left!

[Angie]

Hey there, strangely its cleared itself again but dare say it will reoccur.  Not due to go back for a long break until June whereby we will try some of the solutions mentioned here and let you know how we get on.   Have tried to track down a "plan" of our drainage system from the building company (no luck so far) so that we can try to rod method from various points in the garden!