Mike Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 Hi everyone, first post, hoping someone can help me out with some relevant advice hereI could hear the collective groan from all the established board members when they read the thread title [:D]But before you rip me to pieces… yes, I’ve used the search function and read just about every relevant post in the DRIVNG and MOTORBIKE forum, I understand about the ‘right’ way to do this and what being ‘resident’ actually means, but my situation is slightly unusual so I was hoping someone might be able to come up with a cunning plan…I have a 2002 Suzuki Hayabusa turbo which I think we can safely say makes a bit more than 100 BHP ([:-))])and a 1995 BMW M5 running a 2001 M5 engine. I’ve built both of these vehicles myself and they are both unique, legally UK registered, MOT’d and insured in the UK with full disclosure, the car is used daily and the bike is used when the sun shines (maybe 10,000 km a year)In the near future I will be spending quite a bit of time in France. This is the hard bit as I really am not sure what the near future holds for me, in the short term I will legally be allowed to keep the vehicles UK registered and insured as I will still be firmly UK resident and won’t be in France that much but I suspect that fairly soon my time in France will increase to the point that I need to register both vehicles in France. Now, I can assure you that unlike a lot of people who try to find ways around the system, nothing would give me more pleasure than to be able to legally register both vehicles in FranceHowever the problems are self-evident and any chance of any sort of manufacturer's certificate of conformity would be impossible I would suspect. The amount of time and effort invested in the vehicles is huge so the ‘just sell them in the UK and buy new ones in France’ answer is a bit less relevant in this instance as they are both unique and mean a lot to meThe only things I’ve read here that even offered a glimmer of hope were the French enthusiast who’d managed to keep a UK registration on his Healey and managed to insure it or declared it as a classic, and the number of UK kit cars that seem to exist and be insured in FranceI need to repeat here, NOTHING would give me more pleasure than to be able to register both of my vehicles legally in France, I am not looking to buck the system but bearing in mind the unique nature of both vehicles, does anyone have any idea at all how I could register them in France?Thanks [:)] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob T Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 Not sure, but I thought that if the vehicle spent more than 6 months here then it should be French registered, SD will be along soon to correct me. I cannot see much hope of getting the Suzuki registered without a lot of work and expense.Many French insurance companies will sell you insurance, but that is all they are doing, selling you something, they will not act as policemen and ensure that you are legal - not sure if they would even pay out if you were not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunday Driver Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 MikeWelcome to the forum! No need to rip you to pieces - you've got a special situation....The need to register is basically dependent upon your residency. If you are living in the UK and visiting France from time to time, then you can use your UK registered vehicles in France for up to six months in any twelve month period. During this time, the vehicles must comply with UK regulations, ie be taxed, MOT'd and have UK insurance.Once you become permanently resident in France, then you must import them and register them here - the final arbiter of 'permanent residency' in the 183 day rule. In practical terms, once your regular home is in France, then you're resident.Now to the type approval issues.The BMW is the simplest. It's too old for an EU certificate of conformity, so you'll need to apply to BMW France for a French national type approval certificate - an attestation d'identité. You provide them with a copy of your V5C and they identify the vehicle from the VIN number. If your model was originally commercially on sale in France, then they'll issue you with an attestation which will allow you to register the car at your prefecture. The engine change is immaterial because it's an 'M5 for M5' change. Only significant engine changes need to go through an SVA inspection.The bike is a bit more marginal. Under EU Whole Vehicle Type Approval (introduced in 2002), an approved bike can be imported and registered in any EU country without having to undergo any prior inspection or modification. If you contact Suzuki UK and they say it qualifies for an EU CoC, then with the UK issued certificate you can register it directly with your prefecture regardless of the power rating. If it's too early to qualify, then you'll need to obtain a French national type approval attestation from Suzuki France and they will insist on you restricting the bike to 106bhp before they'll issue the attestation.Note: EUWVTA was actually introduced for bikes in 2002 but the UK government waived the requirement until 2003 to give the UK dealers time to clear unsold stocks of non-compliant bikes (eg, MkI Yamaha Fazers). It's just possible that your Busa might scrape through, so a call to Yamaha UK is needed.PM me if you need any more info or help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Posted March 19, 2008 Author Share Posted March 19, 2008 Hi guys, thanks for the prompt responseSD, unfortunately the BMW isn’t so easy I suspect. I was not clear, the original 1995 M5 3.8 litre 6 cylinder engine has been replaced with the later model's M5 5 litre V8 motor, so I think it may qualify as a ‘significant engine change’. I suspect BMW France would have a heart attack if they saw it now [:D]And I have just come off the phone with Suzuki, I actually got a nice helpful person for once, she’s sending me out the forms tomorrow and she sees no problems with them issuing me a CoC, although I have no idea what questions are in the form with regards to modifications. She’s going to personally oversee the process, so even though I don’t actually need the CoC for a while (if ever possibly) I think it would be worth getting while I have someone helpful who’s willing to get it through for me. If I get it, will there be a problem with me sitting on it for a few months without using it in France?Getting the bike into France legally would be a major achievement, but the next and probably bigger problem is who on earth is going to insure me on it in France? Same applies to the car I suspect... [:(] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cjlaws Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 [quote user="Sunday Driver"]Now to the type approval issues.The BMW is the simplest. It's too old for an EU certificate of conformity, so you'll need to apply to BMW France for a French national type approval certificate - an attestation d'identité. You provide them with a copy of your V5C and they identify the vehicle from the VIN number. If your model was originally commercially on sale in France, then they'll issue you with an attestation which will allow you to register the car at your prefecture. The engine change is immaterial because it's an 'M5 for M5' change. Only significant engine changes need to go through an SVA inspection. [/quote]Just a query here.Mike says he has a 1995 BMW M5 running a 2001 M5 engine. The 1995 M5 had a six cylinder 3.8 litre 340bhp engine, whilst the 2001 M5 had a V8 4.9 litre 400bhp engine. Will the French registration authorities really consider that "immaterial because it's an 'M5 for M5' change"?Edit: Posted before I read Mike's second post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Posted March 19, 2008 Author Share Posted March 19, 2008 S'ok, I wasn't clear in my first post [:)] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tasng4 Posted March 27, 2008 Share Posted March 27, 2008 I've recently imported a 1975 MGB and a 1983 Honda, it was impossibleto get a cerificateof conformity for the MG and the Prefectaire suggested I get the car inspected by the DRIRE so thismay be a route for you.Incidently I found this --> http://www.howtobooks.co.uk/abroad/france/vehicle-import.aspHave fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunday Driver Posted March 28, 2008 Share Posted March 28, 2008 You can obtain a type approval certificate (attestation d'identité) for your MGB from:ABP 254 Avenue du President Wilson 93210 ST DENIS Contact: e-mail: abp102@wanadoo.fr Tel./fax: 01 34 73 48 02 mobile: 06 72 61 61 25 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tasng4 Posted March 28, 2008 Share Posted March 28, 2008 I didn't know ABP would do old cars I went down the Vehicule de collection route and registered with the F.F.V.E. - cheaper 50euro. I did get a CoC from ABP for my MG-ZT @ 180 euros. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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