RHD cars in Euroland?

[Timesearcher]

Please forgive me for posting this enquiry on this Forum, but I have been advised that this is a sensible place where I am likely to get a sensible, considered reply!!

I have not been able to get a satisfactory response elsewhere to what I consider to be a matter of concern.

We are actually moving to Central Portugal in 2009 from Scotland and are members of a Forum similar to this one. A thread regarding the use of a RHD car in Portugal was posted by a member- as follows -

"I met someone yesterday who had just come from

his Portuguese insurance office and he had asked about bring over a UK

plated car, insuring and matriculating it.

According to the insurance company it will soon ( no time was

mentioned)be no longer possible to matriculate a RHD car in Portugal,

other foreign plated but LHD will be allowed."

I had hoped to take my RHD MG to Portugal when

we move to Tomar in 2009, and so have an interest in this topic...

We'll be buying a LHD car locally for everyday use!

I have done a very extensive search of the www and can only find

what I term as either speculation or downright spoof. The nearest that

I got was for someone who stated that this had been seen on 1 April 2005 and had probably been seen in a similar form a year earlier.

I thought that the 'rules' in the EU were fairly uniform and wondered if there had been anything similar heard of in your part of the universe?

Kind Regards,

Martin Jackson [ in a very cool Crieff, in the foothills of the Scottish Highlands]

[Nick Trollope]

I think you have answered your own question there.

 

[AnOther]

"I have been advised that this is a sensible place where I am likely to get a sensible, considered reply!!" Hmmmm, you were doing well up until the !! [:D]

I don't know about Portuguese insurance companies but French ones are notorious for dispensing bum information.

Franky I don't believe such a ban would be permitted under EU law but you need to find a more authoritative source.

Good luck with the MG. I have my MGB GT in France and it's terrific being able to actually enjoy driving again.

[IMG]http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p123/biskitboyo/mgbgt.jpg[/IMG]

[Sunday Driver]

According to similar rumours, it will no longer be possible to import and register RHD trucks in France................[8-)]

EU Whole Vehicle Type Approval was introduced under the EC framework directive 70/156/EEC (last amended by 2001/116/EC) and allows approved vehicles to be registered in any EU member state without additional inspection or modification (other than lights and mph speedo for the UK).

I can't imagine that the Portugese or anyone else could refuse to comply.

 

[woolybanana]

Belgian registered RHD had never been allowed with the exception of old 'uns.

[Sunday Driver]

Not true - according to the Direction des Immatriculations des Véhicules/Dienst voor Inschrijving van de Voertuigen (DIV). .....[;-)]

 

 

[woolybanana]

Lived there twelve years, asked any number of times because they are seen as a "danger permanent" (not old ones of course), unless the rules have changed recently.

[Sunday Driver]

See EU reference above.....[8-|]

 

 

 

[f1steveuk]

The most obvious comparision would be left hand drive vehicles in the UK. It happens all the time (usually for "disabled" drivers, my aunty was given a lhd car by mobility because of a weakened left wrist), and there is never a problem, and much though it tries not to appear that way, the UK is in the EU.................

Just an observation!

[Kevinmc]

Seems the rules have moved on. 5 years ago you had to fit the correct headlights and an mph speedo. For my last 2 MOTs, I've been passed with a kph speedo and sticky bits on the headlights for my Zafira.

[Sunday Driver]

Rules for importing cars into the UK are still the same.

[url=http://www.direct.gov.uk/prod_consum_dg/groups/dg_digitalassets/@dg/@en/documents/digitalasset/dg_10028409.pdf]VCA Mutual Recognition Procedures[/url]

 

[Will]

[quote user="Kevinmc"]Seems the rules have moved on. 5 years ago you had to fit the correct headlights and an mph speedo. [/quote]

Not necessarily so. We had an originally-French car 6-7 years ago which had French instruments and tape on the lights, and valid MOT certificates.

 

[PaulT]

Thanks for the replies - I am the one who suggested to Timesearcher that he try this forum as on this subject some of you seem to have a Europewide knowledge and that Sunday Driver can quote chapter and verse..

Paul

[AnOther]

[quote user="Kevinmc"]Seems the rules have moved on. 5 years ago you had to fit the correct headlights and an mph speedo. For my last 2 MOTs, I've been passed with a kph speedo and sticky bits on the headlights for my Zafira.[/quote]The rules are the rules as SD says but just as in France some people still seem to get through a CT with RHD lights and sticky tape at UK MOT stations it's down to the individual tester if he wants to bend the rules or not.

At my (now ex) local MOT station in UK both the guy who owned and the tester were drinking buddies and whilst I never knowingly submitted a car for test with faults occassionally something unexpected would come to light but they knew me and knew that I would always immediately fix whatever it was so would pass me anyway - so keep your man sweet [:)]

Similarly one of my local CT stations in France is known to be 'sypathetic' to classic cars and will also turn a blind eye to modifications which others would fail you for on sight [;-)]

[gosub]

[quote user="ErnieY"][quote user="Kevinmc"]Seems the rules have moved on. 5 years ago you had to fit the correct headlights and an mph speedo. For my last 2 MOTs, I've been passed with a kph speedo and sticky bits on the headlights for my Zafira.[/quote]The rules are the rules as SD says but just as in France some people still seem to get through a CT with RHD lights and sticky tape at UK MOT stations it's down to the individual tester if he wants to bend the rules or not.

At my (now ex) local MOT station in UK both the guy who owned and the tester were drinking buddies and whilst I never knowingly submitted a car for test with faults occassionally something unexpected would come to light but they knew me and knew that I would always immediately fix whatever it was so would pass me anyway - so keep your man sweet [:)]

Similarly one of my local CT stations in France is known to be 'sypathetic' to classic cars and will also turn a blind eye to modifications which others would fail you for on sight [;-)]

[/quote]

It's always been legal to have "taped" RHD headlights for the UK MOT.

http://www.ukmot.com/1-6.asp#Text_top

[Sunday Driver]

"Right hand dip headlamps can be temporarily altered for use in the UK by fitting masks or converter kits which remove the beam 'kick-up' to the right".

 Would two consecutive annual MOTs fall within the definition of "temporarily"....[Www]

 

 

[AnOther]

It's good to learn a little something everyday [:D]

Let's not risk embarrassing Kevinmc by asking why he's had 2 UK MOT's carried out on a car with RHD lights shall we [Www]

[Will]

Not wishing to appear pedantic, the extract quoted by SD goes on to say:
"A headlamp altered in this way is not a reason for rejection, if
a. the headlamp aim is not rejected for the reasons listed under diagram 1 (except that the top of the beam image will be a straight line)
b. the light output is not unduly reduced- not usually a problem with commercially produced kits
c. the mask or converter is securely attached."

So it would seem that most such 'temporary' alterations are not by themselves a reason for an MOT failure - or at the very least the rules are somewhat ambiguous and open to different interpretations.

I would suggest that perhaps by "temporarily altered" the MOT manual might mean "altered in a way that means it can easily be returned to dipping in the direction the designers intended", rather than implying a rather vague time limitation.

However, the French rules do (for once) seem rather clearer in that most vehicles will not get through the CT without the proper lamps. Though that again occasionally seems open to interpretation.

[Sunday Driver]

There seems to be no real logic to the UK headlamp rules for imported cars.

If you import a car up to ten years old, then in order to register it there, you have to obtain a VCA commission notice certificate. To get one, you have to supply an EU certificate of conformity and additionally certify that the lights dip to the left. 

If the car already has RHD headlamps as standard equipement, or LHD lamps which are capable of adjustment ("stickers, beam deflectors and other non-permanent changes are not acceptable"), then you just sign a statement to that effect. 

If not, then you have to replace them and supply garage receipts as proof.  If the car also has to be submitted for an MOT, it should now have the correct lights, so the use of tape/beambenders ought not be be an issue.

On the other hand, if the car is over ten years old then a commission notice is not required, so the only check of the lights is the MOT test.  However, according to the MOT information link, you can retain the original LHD lights and pass the test using those "stickers, beam deflectors or other non-permanent changes" which are not acceptable for younger cars......

 

.....temporarily, of course!     [;-)]