UK motorist flashed in France

[Martin963]

Friends who had been ski-ing for a week reckoned they were flashed on the way home. I don't know any details (what the limit was, what they were actually doing, where etc) but they asked me what the situation is now....

I'm probably wrong (hence the question) but my impression is that the mechanism was put into place (a couple of years ago...?) to seamlessly fine British drivers who are flashed in France, but that in fact even though the mechanism is now in place it doesn't seem to be being used....

If any of you driving experts can correct/update on this I'd be grateful.

[NickP]

No come back at all, same for French and EU drivers in the UK. Unless of course you get stopped by the mobile speed guns, then it's cash on the nail.

[Martin963]

Thanks Nick.   They will be relieved.

[YCCMB]

They probably won't be....but they CAN be.

https://www.service-public.fr/particuliers/vosdroits/F15097

I guess it just depends on how keen the authorities are to get the extra few Euros. The minimum fine being €45, they've probably worked out that generally the administrative costs are greater than the fine.

[NickP]

From Betty's link, Looks to me like they can't, unless I'm reading this incorrectly; if so I apologise in advance

"The offending driver, who has not been arrested in the

country where the offense took place, can be prosecuted in the country

where the vehicle is registered. This applies as much:

• for the driver of a vehicle registered in France guilty of an offense in another EU country (except Ireland, the UK and Denmark)
• for the driver of a vehicle registered in another
  European country (except in Ireland, the UK and Denmark), guilty of a
  traffic offense in France."

[AnOther]

They can forget about it as if it never happened !

[Chancer]

Thats about the size of it Nick,  I think all the EU countries have the similar wording in their law book.

 

Practically unless its a celeb, a politician or a terrorist they are not going to submit a prosecution case in another country, at the moment few countries even share the address détails or registered owners of vehicle, those that do like France and Belgium just send a carefully worded threatening letter that looks to a god fearing Frenchman like a  fine, all it is in fact is an oppourtunity to voluntarily pay a sum (not a fine) to avoid "a possible legal action" in their own country. Of course prcatically every French person pays up and they are all convinced that one day my door will be broken down and I will be taken to prison for not availing myself of their generous offer.

 

I have got more chance of seducing the Queen than someone has of being taken to court in their own country for being flashed by a speed camera in another one.

[woolybanana]

Did not the UK recently sign a treaty with France to enable fines to be recovered when visiting motorists break the law ?

[AnOther]

Enabling it to happen and it actually happening are two different things light years apart, just like the threats of the Dartford Crossing chasing French drivers for failing to pay, that's happening - not !

[Martin963]

Thanks for the further thoughts folks.

As I read it the Brits are still an "exception" according to that link.

Having said that, we have a Dutch friend who has had several PVs sent to his home in Holland for motoring offences that he's supposed to have committed in the Bordeaux area, but which he clearly hasn't because he's been in Holland at the time. They've had the usual threats that he has to pay before he can appeal. I'll ask him next time we're over what's happening, I think he did launch an appeal after paying the first one.

But I think it proves that the mechanism is in place at least for the Benelux countries, if that is the French are minded to use it.

[Gardian]

It definitely works in Belgium.

Our Belgian neighbour received two tickets incurred by his Mother when she was en route to the house down here. They were generated within days of the infractions.

He was less than amused, but also slightly incredulous because he reckoned that she normally drove at a snail's pace (correct!)

She actually got pinged in two of the 110kph sections.

[Chancer]

Mine came from Belgium.

 

At the risk of repeating myself these so called penalty charges are not fines,  they have no legal standing whatsoever, they are nothing more than an invitation to make a voluntary contribution to their coffers against a non existant threat of  a court summons in your home country.

 

The fact that France has the stupid culture of "if I say you must pay then you must pay and only then can you argue about it" makes compliance even higher, probably close to 100%

[Digital Editor]

In case you want to know the official laws about foreign motorists caught speeding in France:

An EU law came into effect in May 2015 that meant police in EU countries could access driver information from other EU countries in order to pursue foreign drivers caught speeding or committing other motoring offences.

The UK (along with Ireland and Denmark) opted out of the directive on the grounds that the cost of implementing the system would outweigh the income gained from penalty charges. They have been given until 2017 to implement the law.

[AnOther]

Official info: http://etsc.eu/faq-eu-cross-border-enforcement-directive

If the UK is no longer in the EU in May 2017 what of the scheme then ?

[Rabbie]

[quote user="AnOther"]Official info: http://etsc.eu/faq-eu-cross-border-enforcement-directive

If the UK is no longer in the EU in May 2017 what of the scheme then ?

[/quote]If there is a vote in favour of the UK leaving the EU there is a two year transition period while the terms of leaving are negotiated so technically the UK should comply but in reality who knows

[NickP]

Once again lots of ifs, buts and maybes, so to keep this post on track, the original question was about a situation that occurred before 2017 or whatever, so nothing will happen to the person involved.

[Patf]

An interesting discussion, but to me, although I don't like paying fines, much worse is the effect on license points. I should think that would be more difficult to apply - different no's of points for each offense etc.to say nothing of the admin problems.

[Rabbie]

When I was caught speeding in Ireland in a hire car I had to pay the fine as expected but no points were put on my UK licence. They took details of the U.K. Licence so if it was ever exchanged for an Irish licence the points could be applied. So no worries about points unless you are in your country of residence

[NickP]

[quote user="Patf"]An interesting discussion, but to me, although I don't like paying fines, much worse is the effect on license points. I should think that would be more difficult to apply - different no's of points for each offense etc.to say nothing of the admin problems.

[/quote]

Not just difficult Pat; impossible. In the UK they put points on your licence, in France they take them off. How would that work? Especially as there is not common agreement on how many points for specific offenses. Oh and another thing the wonderful system in France of sans permis. You cant imagine how much fun the lawyers would have with that. Well it's like this your honour, "My client lost his licence for being drunk in charge while on holiday", well in France believe it or not your worship, you can still drive a very small car even though your a pi55 head.

 No chance; it'll never happen. Mind you it would make a very good Monty Python sketch. [:D][:D]

[Pierre ZFP]

10 years ago now I got done for speeding in Luxembourg (fair cop Guv, no excuse) and as well as a fine I was told I would have 2 points deducted

Oh good! says I , that means I'll be on minus 2 :-))

They made me change my UK license for a Lux one as I was resident there, then took 2 points off   :-((