Confused

[Chippiepat]

I have asked this question before but can't find the thread in the archives. I am an English registered ( one man band ) builder living in England with a holiday home in France.I am enjoying renovating my own place and would like to take on works for other holiday home owners or residents, properly invoiced from England & paid in sterling.From what I understand this would be illegal & I would be classed as working on the black,however I recently met a chap who has been doing this for years & says it is totally legal, there is also an english paper published locally in france in which many english registered builders advertise.Now, not doubting the advise from this forum what is the best authority to contact to get to the bottom line on this.
Kind regards to all,
Pat

[Will]

LAST EDITED ON 06-Mar-04 AT 10:07 AM (GMT)

I think it's a very complicated subject. The people here who are always ready to assume that if you're British you are probably working illegally will tell you that all work carried out in France has to be done a business registered in France and paying French tax and social security. That may well be quite correct.

However I don't necessarily see that you would be breaking any law if your contract is with somebody British, you are paid in sterling, and you pay tax etc on the profits in Britain. Phrases like restrictive practices come to mind.

I'm sure you'll be told to go to either the Chambre de Commerce or the Chambre de Metiers (probably the latter as it's building type work you are interested in). But surely they will only be able to give you an answer from the French point of view, not the wider European picture.

I can see a likely disadvantage for your clients because only French invoices are allowable against capital gains tax.

I suspect residency and domicile for tax purposes might come into play, but then so should the supposed free movement of people within Europe. I guess only a qualified specialist lawyer could really advise. I'd be interested to hear the outcome anyway.

I agree that plenty of people seem to be doing what you describe, legally or otherwise, and a lot of them seem to advertise in publications like French Property News. And before people get hot under the collar, I'm not condoning illegal workers - it's just that I'm as curious as Pat.

Will (50)

[Teamedup]

Phew......

Could I ask a question, this bloke who told you this, is he resident in the UK?

[Chippiepat]

Update;
I wrote to the Centre des Impots Des Non-Residents, explaining that I wished to carry out renovation works for clients that have properties in france.I explained that I am resident in England & asked them what legal or other obligations I would have to fulfill to comply with EU &/or French regulations.
From my translation of thier reply, under article 14 of the convention between France & U.K., as I do not have registered premises in france then my income will be subject to English tax, thats all.So it would appear to me that is o.k. to take on work in France, OR, are there other hidden obstacles somewhere ( I'm sure someone will throw a few in )
Pat.

[Robert58]

I came to France five years ago to work for a dealer selling construction and agricultural equipment. I had been self employed in the UK for six years doing this and had all the neccesary connections with the Revenue, NIC and so on. When I came, my new boss and I agreed that for the first six months, I would continue with my UK self-employed status, just in case either of us decided that the new arrangements weren't working out. That way, either of us could terminate the arrangement without all the messy hassle imposed by French employment law. I was just a sub-contractor, offering specialised services. Each month, I invoiced my "customer"/employer for an agreed amount which my boss was able to deduct from his tax calculations, and I settled my Tax and Insurance liabilities with the UK authorities.

As it happened, everything did work out, I am happy to say, and I am still here. Neither my boss nor I paid any cotisations for me during that time as I was contributing to the UK system. I paid no French Income Tax, even though I submitted a Dclaration de Revenues the following year. They seemed to take the view that I only became their concern from the moment my employer confirmed that I had passed from UK self-employed status to French employee status. Everything was done in full respect of all the legal requirements, as my boss was a stickler for having things done according to the rules.

So, I reckon that if you are properly registered with the relevant authorities in the UK, you can work in France with no problems, assuming that you can find the work to do and as long as the French side of your work doesn't become your principal occupation or France becomes your main place of residence.

After all, how do Costains get on when they tender to build a new dam or airport? The difference is only one of scale.

As regards those people who commented about having a sige social in the UK but working in France, I don't think that is legal unless you are actually resident in the UK and only working in France on a temporary basis. Once you are resident, then you have to play by the local rules.

Best of luck.

Robert