jon Posted March 18, 2008 Share Posted March 18, 2008 My friend[French]lives in 33 like me...she tells me that many people in the area take home no more than 300 euros per week.I am looking for a gardener...part-time[paid by cheque-emploi] method and I have been quoted something like 200 euros for a days work[English people]Although I would be happy to pay someone this money...I actiually feel that it is not realistic in my circumstances and relation to the current climate.Surely I would find myself in deep trouble trying to make ends meet with a fincial commitmet like this.Maybe I have to stay with my French odd job person whos charges are more realistic for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clair Posted March 18, 2008 Share Posted March 18, 2008 The year 2005 income statistics for the Gironde state an average income of €16 832 per annum or €323 per week.http://www.insee.fr/fr/insee_regions/aquitaine/zoom/chif_cles/fregdep/fdep33.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jon Posted March 18, 2008 Author Share Posted March 18, 2008 yes, so thats about right.So I guesse we....British should not be too expectant? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panda Posted March 18, 2008 Share Posted March 18, 2008 JonIf you ask someone to quote who is a registered gardener you should expect to pay something like that for an 8 hour day, if you ask a passing local working on the black who won't know one end of a hoe from the other you will get away with paying less. You need to decide what you need doing and then if unskilled labour can do it. You can pay by cheque d'emploi if it's for you and not for the hotel or gites or whatever business you are setting up. If it's just for you you could surely get away with just one day every couple of weeks max, then it's not such a huge sum.What exactly are you after getting done, perhaps a registered gardener could say what they think it should cost.Panda Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jon Posted March 19, 2008 Author Share Posted March 19, 2008 Please do not get me wrong!The confusion I have is not related to what I know...it is mainly down to what I have learnt of the expectations of other British people who are looking for work attending to a garden[some knowledge...but not so much ]and are expecting 200 euros per day.The French seems to charge around 16 euro [inclu tax]So I feel that some people are not realistic about their concept of earnings.A chamber maid here in France will not earn 40 euros per hour here...and certainly not in uk.I know someone in the Midlands who is on basic pay....less than 6 pounds per hour!No holiday pay....... or sickness benefit....no tax paid.....very little pension.She remains in this job because there is no other job for her and apparently there is a queue of imigrant workers who will accept a slightly lower rate.Not exactly the same situation here in France is it.[no question mark...retorical ]Do your best...work as hard as you can...pay your taxes and you can not do any more than tryGetting down to the Nitty gritty here with the tax......I have NO intention of employing someone in the Black.I have known about chque emploi years before I moved here.My book will arrive at my bank in less than two weeks time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tressy Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 [quote user="jon"] Please do not get me wrong!......I have NO intention of employing someone in the Black.I have known about chque emploi years before I moved here.My book will arrive at my bank in less than two weeks time.[/quote] (my bold)How have you been paying the 'odd job man' you mentioned in your OP up to now, then?Don't get me wrong - I doubt there's a soul among us who hasn't paid for some goods (eg., wood for the fire) or services (e.g, odd jobs) without the tax people being informed by either party to the transaction, but aren't you intending to run a business? Is that OK on the cheque Emploi system? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jon Posted March 19, 2008 Author Share Posted March 19, 2008 When we first moved here we rented for a few months....did not need an odd job man...fire wood was added to the bill by the landlord.The odd job man has been helping for a total of 12 hours so far in the garden and is waiting[anxiously...I might add]to be paid with his cheque emploi.At this moment in time I am not running a buisness.....will be several months on from now.When I do I will employ a garden hand a few hours some weeks and a cleaner a few hours a week on my busy days.....If cheque emploi is not ok my accountant will advise me.....I will be seeing him a few times before I commence my buisness trading.So Tressy what problem do you you have with this?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony F Dordogne Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 Sorry John, you've already got the guy working for you and you haven't sorted out how much you're going to pay him? That's what it sounds like from your last message.I would ask him how much he needs in his hand - say 10-15 euros - and would then work out the costs of cotisations and that would give you your top line.Local people on the same scheme or those doing the work as part of their registered work would certainly want to pick up, after stoppages/cotizations, 12.5-15 euros an hour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jon Posted March 19, 2008 Author Share Posted March 19, 2008 Off you all go again!This chap worked for the previous owner and is not going to be someone who I will employ on an ongoing bases.I know what his net requirement is.He is not a gradener or someone who is really interested in gardens..... I want someone to work for me[in the near future]who enjoys gardening.I am still not doing anything wrong!As long as I pay the worker and the tax everything else is my choise.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony F Dordogne Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 I'm not suggesting that you are John. So, you asked how much - 12.5 to 15 euros in the person't hand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaligoBay Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 [quote user="jon"]As long as I pay the worker and the tax everything else is my choise....[/quote]Yes, running a business is REALLY SIMPLE in France, you pay your workers what you want and fill in a few numbers on the tax return in March, and Bob's yer uncle.LOL, jon, you're just being a bit of a troll, aren't you? [:P] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jon Posted March 19, 2008 Author Share Posted March 19, 2008 Running a buisness is not simple anwhere.No need for personal attacks on this forum..... .. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tressy Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 Jon, you have succeeded in confusing the hell out of me. Employ one of the people you mentioned before when you said 'The French seems to charge around 16 euro [inclu tax]' if you think other people are asking too much.I wouldn't expect your employee to 'enjoy' it though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jon Posted March 20, 2008 Author Share Posted March 20, 2008 Well Tressy do people in London enjoy getting paid about seven pounds per hours before tax [maybe less] stacking shelves in Tesco? 8 pounds per hour...[net of tax] doing work around the garden could be acceptable/enjoyable.Not everyone in Uk or here can demanad high earnings.You can be earning 200 euros an hour and if you do not like your work you may not enjoy it...Seems like this topic is over...a few of you are in a bad mood and you are letting off steam. Not too sure how many people have about 200 euros per day to spend on a gardener. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raindog Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 Carefull everyone, Jon's getting bristly again [:D][:D] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jon Posted March 20, 2008 Author Share Posted March 20, 2008 No Raindog...the drama queens are out in their glory looking for a little trouble.The neighbours cat is much more fun than you lot when you get moody. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panda Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 [quote user="jon"]Well Tressy do people in London enjoy getting paid about seven pounds per hours before tax [maybe less] stacking shelves in Tesco? 8 pounds per hour...[net of tax] doing work around the garden could be acceptable/enjoyable.Not everyone in Uk or here can demanad high earnings.You can be earning 200 euros an hour and if you do not like your work you may not enjoy it...Seems like this topic is over...a few of you are in a bad mood and you are letting off steam. Not too sure how many people have about 200 euros per day to spend on a gardener.[/quote]But Jon are you not suggesting paying this Frenchman, 2 euros per hour, i.e. 16 euros per day?? I think perhaps you have misunderstood what he is expecting, let us know how he looks when you hand over the cheque d'mploi. Either that or I'm in the confused lounge with Tressy, budge up they'll be more along in a minute!Panda Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jon Posted March 20, 2008 Author Share Posted March 20, 2008 16 euros per hour....you lot are enough to make anyone type the wrong info.It is time for the neighbours cat you have his lunch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cerise Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 What relevance has any of this to the original post. People quote you for work, they can ask whatever they like whether they are English, French or Japanese. You decide to employ them or not - your choice. Better off getting references than deciding purely on price. If someone gets all your work done in one day for 200€ then he is a better bargain than the guy at 100€ a day who takes 3 days. Obvious really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clarksinfrance Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 Jon, as you no doubt know, if you are to pay your gardner on Cd'E €16 an hour, the tax and cotisations deducted from your account after you have paid him are approx 70% which is another €11.20, making a total of €27.20/hr, on top of that you have to provide all tools and fuel. So for an 8hr day this comes to a total of €193.60. Time you add in cost of providing tools, fuel, depreciation, transport, insuration, it looks like €200 a day is fairly cheap; or have I missed the point?If you are talking about paying him/her €16/hr including all cotisations/tax then you are paying your employee the minimum wage of about €8.44 iirc. Got to be honest here, if I am running a business with all the admin, bureaucracy, cotisations, taxes, grief, unpaid work, advice, sourcing materials, unpaid factures, breakdowns, repairs, maintenance, huissiers and possible legal costs; I for one wouldn't want your work for €8.44 an hour. This posting isn't intended to cause grief or to insult anyone, but merely to state a few facts and imponderables with running a business, which can in no way equate to working on Cd'E system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jon Posted March 20, 2008 Author Share Posted March 20, 2008 You are not listiening...the chap is not a qualified gardener and he has no tools...except mine using his tools ......and he lives close by.When I have a gardener who works a a proffessional gardener I will expect to pay him more...and I believe that he bring his tools.That will be when I start my buisness I have run a successful buisness......stop talking down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jon Posted March 20, 2008 Author Share Posted March 20, 2008 What i was trying to type...I got destracted ...was....He has no tools he is using mine.He has worked twelve hours collecting leaves odd jobs like that.No , by the way it does not matter wether someone is French, British or Italian it is a matter of what I can afford and what a worker is ready to accept. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clarksinfrance Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 You are of course quite correct, that is a matter of choice, your choice as to what you wish/can pay, his choice as to whether he will accept. I just hope for your sake, that when you start your business, you don't find out how little people wish to pay you, or loose a lot of your work to some scally working au noir.But just to clarify your posting; your second missive in this thread, is saying a Frenchman wanting €16/ hr (the inference is working on Cd'E syatem) and a UK registered business asking €200 a day. Rightly or wrongly, you appear to be comparing apples and pears. What most people were trying to point out, including me, is that not just you,but everyone needs to compare like for like, a chap working on Cd'E may welcome €16/hr inc taxes, but a business person, of whatever nationality, would be hard pushed to make ends meet on €200 a day. Anyway thats my 2ps worth, hope I haven't upset or offended anyone, guess I'll now get back in my box. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jon Posted March 20, 2008 Author Share Posted March 20, 2008 A buisness person is hard pushed to make a living on 200 euros a day!Interesting...just interesting..how much approx does B and B take in a week? In a year.Not an arguement...just a questionSome of you surely must have a good idea of what is achievable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cerise Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 How long is a bit of string? How many months is the B & B open, is it a main income, how many rooms does it have, where is it situated? Our local tax office told me that the average declared income for a B & B was 5000€ per annum, but then many are only open for 8 weeks a year and have only one or two rooms and many B & Bs are not registered as businesses with all the overheads that entails. So nothing to do with the price of gardening!Still don't see what the problem is. If you don't like the price employ someone else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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