Blackadder<IMG src="http:forums.livingfrance.comimagesline.gif"><BR>Blackadder<BR>Keighley and Creuse Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 We are in the early stages of renovating a structurally sound barn in the Creuse. We have done half the roof and put velux in and are to do the other half shortly. With regard to insulation, i had originally planned on using a solid board type material such as Kingspan. Well made, easy to use but expensive and time consuming to install, there are also issues with making wure we get at least 50 mm gap between the insulation and the tiles. A British builder (building here in Yorkshire) is using what is basically foil backed bubble wrap and says it is very effective, relatively cheap and easy and quick to install. Has anyone any experience of the foil and fibre roll that is about 100 euro at Castorama (15 m roll) it is supposed to have the same insulation value as 75mm of rockwool type 'traditional' insulation.Would 2 layers be equal to 150mm? We are wanting the best possible insulation euro for euro and ease of fitting is a bonus (stapled in place then boarded over)Where can i get details of French building regs with regard to u value of insulation?The first of many questions I'm afraid!Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iceni Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 We have used one of the foil and bubble wrap products with great effect and our French architect (who just drew rough final plans to get them signed off and passed) seemed to think we had done our homework. Having stayed in houses with other sorts of insulation which were great but even greater for the mice who seemed to be wearing hobnail boots and spent the night chewing and 'skiing' down the slopes in the roof we decided we wanted something that would not attract them and would be easy to use as we have a high pitched roof in the barn.Don't go to the local brico, go to a specialist builders merchant (one the trade use) and see some samples and get some quotes. Do a search for Tri-iso on the net - here is one for a start www.enigma-insulations.co.uk/triisohome.html and they have a downloadable PDf with further info. Not cheap but the money we saved on time doing the actual insulation made it very cost effective.This product was originally recommended by a UK architect and there were a lot of positive posts on LF but they will have gone to archive heaven I am afraid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Polo Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 [quote]We have used one of the foil and bubble wrap products with great effect and our French architect (who just drew rough final plans to get them signed off and passed) seemed to think we had done our hom...[/quote]DiI was also thinking of using this material i have seen it in brico depot, i have looked at a couple of leaflets and it seem it could take the place of rooffelt so you would save the cost of that. Practically speaking if you do this do you nail it down like rooffelt or is this going to make it leak. What did you find.RegardsPolo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cacknanty Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 We appear to have the foil/bubble wrap, covered with pine cladding in the roof of our 'mini' house, it is absolutely perishing in the winter. I believe the main reason is where the roof joins the wall, as the wind fair blows a hooley through there.On the plus side tho' it never smells damp when we arrive for our odd weeks of hard labour in the autumn/winter !A new roof is going on our farmhouse in November and would like to know if this tri iso stuff is available in France, as we are holiday homers we don't get a lot of time to browse around all the brico places.Incidentally we have found prices in Bricoman are considerably cheaper than all others we have visited, although they are not a big chain, yet.Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedunnes Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 Yes, Tri-iso is available everywhere. There are many variations that are foil and bubble wrap and some which the vendors claim to be even better which is multi foil layers with a kind of woll material stiched between the layers. The later is obviously not water proof because of the stitching, I would also not nail it as IMHO it would be hard work. Much easier to get an air compressor powered stapler. Sadly you have to do the rounds as sometimes you can find stuff on very good terms on "Promo".I have researched and re-researched what I am going to use and I am most likely to use Kingspan. It might sound mad, but as several neighbours are after someting effective and Kingspan is effective we are probably going to bring over an artic of the stuff which believe it or not if sourced correctly makes it quite reasonable. In fact it will be cheaper per sheet because of the bulk purchase than I can buy it for for say 20 panels here in the UK.Stephen (19) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackadder<IMG src="http:forums.livingfrance.comimagesline.gif"><BR>Blackadder<BR>Keighley and Creuse Posted September 17, 2004 Author Share Posted September 17, 2004 I don't think it should be used in place of the 'felt' there needs to be at least a 50mm gap between the insulation and the inside of the roofing tile/slate. Kingspan can be used as a vapour barrier but again it needs the airgap. If it doesn't have it, it is ineffective.Thanks for the replies, loads more internet digging now.Interestingly i spoke to a guy at the energy efficiency dept who says that in england, they don't recommend the foil and 'material' blankets as they didn't go throught the same tests as the english stuff such as kingspan.I'd love to use Kingspan but cost and transport put me off together with ease or lack of it, in fitting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Millwheel Posted September 17, 2004 Share Posted September 17, 2004 Hi,Has anyone had experience of using spray-applied polyurethane foam for insulating existing roofs? In the UK a company called Renotherm offers a service, & I believe that DIY packs are available from other sources. At first sight the spray concept looks idea for French barn roofs with irregular rafters & no felt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iceni Posted September 17, 2004 Share Posted September 17, 2004 [quote]Hi, Has anyone had experience of using spray-applied polyurethane foam for insulating existing roofs? In the UK a company called Renotherm offers a service, & I believe that DIY packs are availab...[/quote]Tri-iso is a French product.According to the posts in the archives, the reason they don't use felt is that it is far too hot in most of France and the stuff melts.As for using anything not commonly used in France - WHY. French rooves are far different from UK rooves and have different methods of build. I would not build an igloo which is very energy cost effective, in France, as the weather is not suitable so I would not use UK felt or other products for the UK market as this is France.Look at what your neighbours use to insulate their rooves - see what the regs are and even talk to an architect. We did this in both France and the UK and decided on Tri-Iso which is easy to use as it is stapled and taped in place.Kingspan may or may not be a mouse paradise - we need Charles of LF to confirm it is the product that he mentioned in the archives - but they have gone. But if it is, it will be a bit late when the mice move in and the noise begins.As for spraying under the tiles with polyurethane foam, I would not consider it unless it was a French company who did this all over France. This is a bit like the thread we had about a chap who got a UK double glazing firm in to do his windows and doors... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mysfloss Posted September 18, 2004 Share Posted September 18, 2004 this website might help www.actis-isolation.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Millwheel Posted September 24, 2004 Share Posted September 24, 2004 [quote]this website might help www.actis-isolation.com[/quote]Thanks for the advice.Recently I was discussing this with a colleague who is renovating a barn in UK. He recommends Actis Super9. Easy to handle & can be stapled on to the joists prior to battening & fixing plasterboard.Regards Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeauGeste<P><FONT face=Arial>Pat<FONT><P><P><FONT face=Arial>See us at <FONT><a target=_blank href="http:www.chez-robineau.com"><FONT face=Arial>http:www.chez-robineau.com<FONT><A><P><P> <P> Posted September 26, 2004 Share Posted September 26, 2004 Be careful about comparing foil insulation with rockwall etc. The manufacturers will often state an equivalency to R value or U value. But they work in different ways. The foil ins. is reflective insulation which is why they can't state an R value. The foil relies on an air gap between the layers of foil to work properly, so installation is also quite important.There are some good explanations on some of the American insulation companies' web sites where they seem to have been using these products for longer (you'll need to search a bit).I've used the more expensive multi layered insulation on the vaulted/pitched ceilings and the less expensive (I think 3 layer stuff) on the north facing walls. Probably didn't need it on the walls but when you get so far it seems worth making the effort.You can see some of what we've done on http://www.chez-robineau.comHave a look at the latest photos section, there's some foil insulation about half way down the page. While you're there you can have a look at what else we've been doing if it's of any interest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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