House lighting

[woolybanana]

Does anyone have those lights set in the ceiling, either direct mains or low voltage ones? Height restrictions in my reshaped hall suggest these are ideal as they do not ontrude. But, a mate says they are rubbish, always breaking down, bulbs don't last etc. Any thoughts and feedback would be welcome svp.

[BIG MAC]

You can get mains or low voltage recessed downlighters..bulbs tend to last about 3 or 4 years in either in my house in the UK..

If I was to do the job again I would look at recessed downlighters with LED lamps which should last longer than incandescent lamps.

[DerekJ]

We've got 12 volt 50w  inset lights in our UK kitchen and onsuite bathroom.  Very pleased with them.  Lighting is fine and the bulbs have proved to be long lasting.

[cooperlola]

When these were first around, Woolyb, I agree they were total cr*p with the halogen lamps expensive and unreliable.  However, I'm told they are now far better but  have no first hand experience to impart, sorry.  As Mac says, LEDs should keep costs down also.  Keep me posted if you go this route, old fruit, as I have a couple of places where they would be great, if any good.

[woolybanana]

Good lord Poopsie, you need lights in those areas now?

Thanks guys. Just another thought; twelve volt or full mains? Apparently you can't have LEDs on 12 volt.

[cooperlola]

Nothing like a bit of subtle lighting to improve the experience, o wooly one!

Funny about 12 volt and LEDs, given that I see new models of car using them extensively (Audi in particular comes to mind.)

[just john]

 leroymerlin.12v LED's don't listen to em Wooly, 12 volt LEDs are the way to go . . . [:)]

[Sydney and Huggy]

We have put mains ones in the high ceilings in both upstairs bedrooms, on the sloping ceilings on the stairs and in the bathroom.  They are all mains voltage and have had no problems with them.  They have all been fitted with fire hoods, either integral or supplementary and the bathroom ones are rated for zone 2.  They came with a strange small rubber appliance that we were a bit baffled by at first[8-)], then discovered its for putting the [I][I][I] into the fittings[I]!

[Bob T]

I have 12 volt MR16s and MR11 LEDs all over the place. I also have 230 volt GU10 and E14 LEDs. Best place to buy them is ebay, they normally come from the far east at about €5 each including P&P.

[crossy67]

We have 12volt halogens in our loft, have been going strong on dimmers for 8 years now, not used all the time but still going.  You watch, now they will go pop.  We have the capless type bulbs in the Kitchen display cupboards and they are rubbish, gone through 4 bulbs in a year, we only have 4 in total.

[BIG MAC]

Lidl...often sell these in sets...I bought about 20 sets of 6 lamps...at £5 a set 4 or 5 years ago...taking a bit of a chance as halogens were supposed to be being phased out in favour of LED. Now you can get LED lamps which fit...tickety boo

[darnsarf]

I agree the new LEDS are miles better than they were and last for ages. However, many people use downlighters with a dimmer. LEDS will not, as far as I am aware work with dimmers (i.e. they are either on or off) and this is why many people don't swap/ For places like a kitchen though, where maybe dimmers are less useful, LEDS have a role. Against halogens is the heat that they produce. I've had lots of smoke and near fires with them and had to reduce wattage.

[cooperlola]

Darnsarf, with completely new fittings and wiring etc, could you get around this problem by having two seperate sets of lights on different switches? - yes you'd only have the choice of half or full lighting but maybe this could work?  I'm no electrician it's just that I will hopefully be using similar lighting and wanted to toss a few ideas around!

[sid]

Hi darnsarf

Are you saying the LEDs produce heat? I couldn't follow your last couple of sentences.

We will be faced with a change of lighting and I was wondering about LEDs for the kitchen. The G10 halogens currently in use here are very good and have lasted over 5 years, but the bulbs will eventually be phased out. Do you need twice (or three times) as many LED's to replace one G10 50W? The light output aspect of these economy type lamps has always been a stumbling block, but a change is inevitable. 

Sid

[darnsarf]

LEDs produce virtually no heat. Halogens tend to produce lots of it!

I have two switches in my kitchen to produce a 'half light effect' i.e. half the lights on, half not, or all on or all off! it works fine for a kitchen and may be OK elsewhere but it's not really the same as dimming. That said, I have seen what they call dimmable LEDS bulbs recently though I suspect they achieve this by switching off some of the diodes (I may be wrong).

The choice of LED is really important. Firstly, to avoid the blueish light, called 'cool white' (which is for me near impossible to read from) you need warm white but even some of these vary enormously. It depends on the number of diodes each bulb has (and some have ridiculously few). I bought mine from ultraleds.co.uk (no association). The more diodes, generally, the higher the cost. You can buy GU10 versions from about £3 but up to £20 each for some. Ideally, it's best to see some before buying the whole array. The equivilence to halogen/incandescent wattage is usually shown but the LED will normally be about 5W.

Hope this helps and sorry if I confused anyone!

[Bob T]

I use cool light coloured LEDs as my bedroom reading lights because I find they are much better to read with.

If you want powerful GU10 LEDs then buy the ones with 3 or 4 high power LEDs instead of the ones with 20 or so 5mm LEDs.

[sid]

[quote user="darnsarf"]....sorry if I confused anyone![/quote]

Thanks, understood now!

Sid

[pachapapa]

Some criticism of the cheaper LEDS has been expressed in the french media today, 25/10/10.

The ANSES report on which these journalistic comments is based is available at the following link ( 310 pages).

http://www.afssa.fr/Documents/AP2008sa0408.pdf

[woolybanana]

I am working on a hall, so need a relatively warm light but very light (not a cold white though)

[pachapapa]

[quote user="darnsarf"]I agree the new LEDS are miles better than they were and last for ages. However, many people use downlighters with a dimmer. LEDS will not, as far as I am aware work with dimmers (i.e. they are either on or off) and this is why many people don't swap/ For places like a kitchen though, where maybe dimmers are less useful, LEDS have a role. Against halogens is the heat that they produce. I've had lots of smoke and near fires with them and had to reduce wattage.[/quote]

LEDS use low-frequency dimmers, the supply is DC so if it is switched on and off there is less energy/less light; of course at a frequency that the eye will not notice. The french use experimental LED dimming for street lighting at night, etc,etc. CSTB are currently doing a research project on the Metro.

[Quillan]

I just did a Google on LED Dimmer Switches for domestic use and there seems to be a few around. Aurora seem to be the favorite and they cost as little as £10 including VAT.

Aurora 1-10v LED dimmer switch

[darnsarf]

Here's a link to a suppliers of dimmable LED GU10s. http://www.ablectrics.com/product-3819-7Watt-LED-GU10-Equiv-to-50-Watts,-fully-Dimmable.-40,000-hours-warm-white.html

There seem to be quite a few of these coming onto the market now. Fairly expensive at the moment and the dimmer itself needs to be of high quality.

[pachapapa]

Try AliBaba Trading, they will supply many items at minimum lots of 10.

http://www.alibaba.com/

[pachapapa]

Or even easier log on to AliExpress, subsidiary of AliBaba, then do your order on line often with free delivery.[;-)]

http://www.aliexpress.com/

[pachapapa]

[quote user="darnsarf"]Here's a link to a suppliers of dimmable LED GU10s. http://www.ablectrics.com/product-3819-7Watt-LED-GU10-Equiv-to-50-Watts,-fully-Dimmable.-40,000-hours-warm-white.html There seem to be quite a few of these coming onto the market now. Fairly expensive at the moment and the dimmer itself needs to be of high quality.[/quote]

Traditional  SCR dimmers are in fact available for GU10 LEDs.