SteveH Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 We're in the process of buying some land but the builder we'd got in mind said he's no longer prepared to do new builds.His advice (he's actually got a very good name & does some excellent work) is to stay away.I'm informed that the latest set of regulations are making it very hard to build & to pass all sorts of tests for airtightness does anyone have any experience or am I being scarred off ?There's more to it than this but hopefully someone can advise please Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolybanana Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 Well, not to be a Jeremiah, this issue has been around ever since the last Housing minister passed regulatons that noone can conform to as they are too strict. She was a CathoGreenCommie who has sabotaged the entire housing market as far as I can see..Builders round here are also pleading for some relaxation, especially in the anti-earthquake regulations which are adding huge amounts to the cost.Under these circumstances, it might just be more economical to get an older place and modernize it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catalpa Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 RT2012 regulations.Yes, if you buy an existing house (more than 2 years old) that is in reasonable nick and doesn't need the major work like a new roof, new electrics, new plumbing, etc, it is probably more cost-efficient than new build at the moment. Or wait another year or so for the regulations to be relaxed. They've already been eroded by various trade lobbying in the industry.However, if you want to renovate a barn or a garage, say, that wasn't previously habitation, RT2012 kicks in again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quillan Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 [quote user="Catalpa"]RT2012 regulations.Yes, if you buy an existing house (more than 2 years old) that is in reasonable nick and doesn't need the major work like a new roof, new electrics, new plumbing, etc, it is probably more cost-efficient than new build at the moment. Or wait another year or so for the regulations to be relaxed. They've already been eroded by various trade lobbying in the industry.However, if you want to renovate a barn or a garage, say, that wasn't previously habitation, RT2012 kicks in again.[/quote]Sorry to go off topic a little but if you have an existing house (say 10 years old) and you want to change the use of the garage which is integral to accommodation use will these regulations be applicable to the garage?Have you got a link to RT2012 so the OP can have a look and is there an English translation available? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveH Posted January 22, 2015 Author Share Posted January 22, 2015 thanks for your comments,,Could you please clarify something for me?I presume 2012 refers to the date of the bill.Do you know if they've become more strict or "upgraded" for 2014 & then again for 2015? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolybanana Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 Doesn't it refer to a bill or clause number? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quillan Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 [quote user="SteveH"]thanks for your comments,, Could you please clarify something for me? I presume 2012 refers to the date of the bill. Do you know if they've become more strict or "upgraded" for 2014 & then again for 2015?[/quote]You can Google 'RT2012' for the French version and you can Google 'RT2012 in English' for some information in English. RT2012 is the actual name of "the Bill" as it were although in reality it refers to the specification as laid down in French law. This may well get upgraded or amended but there is no completely new version like RT2014 etc, well not at the moment anyway, and there probably won't be, it's FRance, who knows. [;-)]This specification basically makes you build a 'passive house' or pretty near to one. The idea is to keep the cost of heating and cooling to a minimum thus reducing the Co2 footprint. A friend of mine has just finnished building a new house and all he has is one log burner to heat 150m2. He actually 'down sized' his log burner because the house got to hot. Obviously the cost of this type of specification is very high and most French simply won't pay the price so very few new houses are getting built. There are benifits if you are tax resident in France and your builder does all the work which may help offset some of the costs. If you Google 'RT2012 in English' there are some sites with links that tells you how these rebates and grants work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pommier Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 Well, houses are still being built in our town at a furious rate! All new builds since January last year have to be to BBC (batiment basse consommation) standard. We had our house built in 2013 to that standard, and our energy bills are tiny, so it pays off eventually. Our builder said it added about €30.000 to the build cost. A fairly basic house can be built for less than €120.000. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quillan Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 [quote user="Pommier"]Our builder said it added about €30.000 to the build cost.[/quote]Thats what, about 20 years worth of gas, oil or electricity for heating? I supose from a Co2 point of view thats pretty good bit if your retired at 60 and have a house built you may well be dead before you reap the benifits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pommier Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 But don't forget that the house is worth more if it's re-sold, plus it's more comfortable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catalpa Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 [quote user="Quillan"]Thats what, about 20 years worth of gas, oil or electricity for heating? I supose from a Co2 point of view thats pretty good bit if your retired at 60 and have a house built you may well be dead before you reap the benifits.[/quote]That's true but a house is around for more than the (say) 20 years of the person who has it built. The idea is to increase the amount of housing stock that is far more energy efficient than previously so it's a global benefit not just an individual's benefit. Plus, as Pommier said, while it may cost more to build it will retain that added value through subsequent sales. There are broader aspects to the regulations too - for eg, houses must be multi-fuel so an all electric (heating, cooking, hot water) build won't qualify but add a gas hob and a wood-burning stove and it will. The study done at the time of permission being granted states the materials and utilities that are to be used.Re your garage, Quillan, if you apply for full planning permission for it then yes, it will probably fall under RT-2012 regs but perhaps you can quietly renovate without an application? You must know a local builder so he'll be able to tell you.And re further toughening up of the regulations, yes, that is due to happen - I've seen a bar chart somewhere showing the increases in efficiency and I think the next step up is 2020. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveH Posted January 22, 2015 Author Share Posted January 22, 2015 Would you by chance know if the regs were tightened up in 2015 over 2012~2013? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoneySuckleDreams Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 off topic a little but still new buildThere has been a story in the press recently about an estate of 60+ houses recently finished near us. A little later someone needed some remedial work doing and had to chop out part of a pillar - all the houses had some sort of mezzanine floor supported by (supposed steel) pillars. It turns out the "supports" were just accro props and then boarded in. Apparently, all the houses are having to be demolished at the owners expense as the builder has gone t^^" upcaveat emptor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quillan Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 [quote user="Catalpa"] Re your garage, Quillan, if you apply for full planning permission for it then yes, it will probably fall under RT-2012 regs but perhaps you can quietly renovate without an application? You must know a local builder so he'll be able to tell you.[/quote]Not my garage, somebody else I know. Who will inspect the work afterwards to see if it complies with RT2012? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quillan Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 [quote user="Pommier"]But don't forget that the house is worth more if it's re-sold, plus it's more comfortable.[/quote]I don't have a problem myself with the new regs and when I build my retirement home I would be looking to build to the same type of spec of higher. The issue, if you can call it that, is technology, the newer the technology them more expensive it is. Wait a few years and the technology becomes cheaper. Triple glazed windows that not only 'black out' when an electric current is passed through them but generate electricity during the day, no nasty panels on the roof, still cost a lot of money but are half the price they were five years ago. The main thing after the build is to keep your running costs as low as possible i.e. well water for flushing toilets, water recovery systems, rain water storage systems, turning your waste in to fuel for heating etc, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suein56 Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 [quote user="SteveH"]Would you by chance know if the regs were tightened up in 2015 over 2012~2013?[/quote]No, it seems they have been simplified; and, as others have said, this regulation seems to be the most recent with the next major improvement in regulation deemed to be some years away.http://www.e-rt2012.fr/modifications-ajustements-rt2012-au-1er-janvier-2015/Sue Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveH Posted January 23, 2015 Author Share Posted January 23, 2015 Hi Sue,Many thanks for the info.It looks like my builder is/was scare mongering! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Judith Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 Or was just trying to find a way out of a job he didn't want? ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suein56 Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 [quote user="SteveH"]It looks like my builder is/was scare mongering![/quote]Perhaps not.If your man is a good builder - and you said he was - then as a breed the sound, but small-time ie not big, builder was struggling with the ever-increasingly-green requirements of the RT-2012 which also included small modifications added along the way.Perhaps he has not heard that the 'allègements' of 11 December 2014 might just be a slight relief to him.Sue Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.