squidge Posted July 4, 2008 Share Posted July 4, 2008 afternoon allwe're currently trying to sell our principale and maison secondaire here before relocating back to england at the end of the year.this afternoon we had a private viewing on the second home. we were after about 75-80k for it. the chap threw in a quite low offer of 70k but then said 58k would be declared as the 'official price' going through the notaire and then he'd give us a cheque for 12k when we sign the compromis. obviously sounds rather on the illegal side..... but does mean that we would save a couple of thousand as we wouldn't have to pay cgt (we paid 60k for it last october). what's in it for him? is it that he would save a bit in notaires fees? any thoughts?!thanks! squidge x Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Val_2 Posted July 4, 2008 Share Posted July 4, 2008 Be careful is all I can say.The fisc here have ways of knowing what goes on regarding property transactions etc as money leaves a trail. What is the cheque bounces, who can you complain to? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernice Posted July 4, 2008 Share Posted July 4, 2008 As you probably know it's totally illegal and you could both be in BIG trouble ....Bernice Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benjamin Posted July 4, 2008 Share Posted July 4, 2008 ..................illegal........bargepole.....................touch................wouldn't................[:D] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russethouse Posted July 4, 2008 Share Posted July 4, 2008 squidge, If you wait you could get a better offer and the more than make up for the CGT. Also if the notaire thinks you are under selling the house he could be suspicious.Please don't do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolybananasbrother Posted July 4, 2008 Share Posted July 4, 2008 This used to operate by the purchaser paying huge sums for the fixtures and fittings but the fisc will not have this anymore.The Belgians simply declare one sum and pay the balance in cash under the table.Don't get involved in any of it is my advice.(I suspect that the notaires are now in a different position, especially with second homes and CGT. At one time they did the calculations themselves and were not too fussed at letting some things get by. Now, the calculations are done by or approved by the company in Paris (licenced by the Fisc) which is much stricter. Now, does this mean they get their profit from the fees only or do they get a percentage of the tax take? And who owns the company? I strongly suspect that notaires have a large share, so that it is now in their interest to get as much dosh in as possible.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gastines Posted July 4, 2008 Share Posted July 4, 2008 Definitely asking for trouble. Ask for cheque for furnishing for 12K euros and get it cleared before signing perhaps but I don't think your buyer would fall for that side of the arguement. Once you sign for 58,you've signed."What 12?"Regards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gosub Posted July 4, 2008 Share Posted July 4, 2008 If your local commune think that it's a bargain price they may have first refusal on it, and buy it themselves for €58k. I believe that it's happened before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tj Posted July 4, 2008 Share Posted July 4, 2008 This is a common situation among french, happens all the time, just need to be careful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Val_2 Posted July 5, 2008 Share Posted July 5, 2008 [quote user="gosub"]If your local commune think that it's a bargain price they may have first refusal on it, and buy it themselves for €58k. I believe that it's happened before.[/quote]Quite correct, we have had properties come up for sale in our commune within a certain boundary of the centre which we then have to decide whether to purchase or not on council, usually the answer is no especially if its for a holiday home which the commune does not like having in the centre of the village all shut up most of the year but thankfully that dosn't happen often and the finances are needed elsewhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thebiga Posted July 5, 2008 Share Posted July 5, 2008 I know of three people that have been daft enough to do this and they have all gone a loser. Mostly its later been 'what money under the counter' and then thats a goner. Just don't do it as 99% sure that you will not be happy come the end.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Judith Posted July 5, 2008 Share Posted July 5, 2008 I wouldn't touch it with a bargepole - and for those not familiar with that term- it's illegal - don't even begin to consider it! Just to avoid paying a small amount of GCT and increased notaire's fees - it is simply not worth it!!!! Better to loose the sale than end up paying considerably more in fines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Val_2 Posted July 5, 2008 Share Posted July 5, 2008 Not only that, how can you explain a sudden deposit in your bank account to which the fisc and Trésor Public amongst many have access to whenever they like without your consent or knowledge and I speak from experience there too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squidge Posted July 5, 2008 Author Share Posted July 5, 2008 don't worry everyone - we didn't actually accept it!i was just wondering what was in it for the buyer? surely for their own cgt issues in the future when they come to sell, a seemingly official low purchase price would work against them. nothing in it for the seller (other than a tiny bit off cgt), but surely that's not worth the hassle and stress of the naughtiness..... so why do people want to offer in that way..... and why do sellers accept it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunday Driver Posted July 5, 2008 Share Posted July 5, 2008 By offering a seller a 'lower' official price for the house, then the rest 'under the table', the amount of the property purchase tax which the buyer has to pay is reduced. By accepting such an arrangement, the seller will have conspired with the buyer to evade this tax. As we all know, tax evasion is a risky business...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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