Gluestick Posted February 25, 2008 Share Posted February 25, 2008 [quote user="Bones"] Or perhaps you're right and I'm giving him far too much credit. He'll retire early with Carla, sit around in his presidential underpants all day. [+o(][/quote]Boxer "Shorts", presumably? [:)]No one can forecast how anything to do with the public and politicians might pan out!Whatever, anyone tryin g to change the dynamic of the French status quo is in for muchos resistance and a fight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I agree entirely Posted February 25, 2008 Share Posted February 25, 2008 Much growth is stunted by too much prodding,Too eager tenderness.The things we love we have to learn to leave alone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clair Posted February 25, 2008 Share Posted February 25, 2008 [quote user="Gluestick"]Whatever, anyone tryin g to change the dynamic of the French status quo is in for muchos resistance and a fight. [/quote]I have been reading up on Mai 68 (written with a French accent!), as I was rather young when it was all happening and all I remember are names like Daniel Cohn-Bendit, sayings like 'il est interdi d'interdire" and "Soyez réalistes, demandez l'impossible"I remember seeing the barricades on the b&w telly, workers and students on the same side and most of all, I remember a French Lit teacher a few years later, who told us to call her Françoise and to say "tu" when talking with her!! To me, she represented all of Mai 68![:-))]No likelihood of that happening now! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gluestick Posted February 25, 2008 Share Posted February 25, 2008 I agree, Clair: a wholly different age.That said, the right of free demonstration is, I believe enshrined in the code of the Fifth Republic.As is the right to withdraw labour.Could well be some exciting times ahead! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gluestick Posted February 25, 2008 Share Posted February 25, 2008 [quote user="I agree entirely"]Much growth is stunted by too much prodding,Too eager tenderness.The things we love we have to learn to leave alone.[/quote]What are you on, Mate?Original recipe Absinthe in pretty serious volumes?[:D] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deby Posted February 26, 2008 Share Posted February 26, 2008 In 1957 when France signed the Treaty of Rome, circa 90% of its total workforce was engaged in agriculture. The results of that heritage linger still today.So it is up to the EU then to disband the CAP (Common Agricultural Policy) - if only they would! This outrageous, unfair, ridiculous, stupid policy has been re-worked over the years always in favour of the French. If someone was brave enough to say b u g g e r off - and stop giving the French handouts and work for a living, it might dawn on the farmers that they would have to become efficient and competitive! And god forbid they might put pressure on the french government to stop wasting money on idiotic bureaucracy and wasteful functionnaires.I am truly disappointed by Sarkozy's reforms - or should I say lack of. He is still failing to free up employment laws and offer small business incentives to help stimulate the economy in order to improve the buying power of its citizens.The restaurant in our village is now forced with closure as they want to increase their business turnover but need to employ people and simply cannot afford to do so due to the social charges/taxes imposed upon them. Being truly french they want a work/life balance as they have a young family and choose not miss out on their children's upbringing, which is understandable. They want a good quality of life, the other side of the coin is they are not entrepreneurial - whether this is part of their culture I do not know. They like to do the french thing in august and close the restaurant sometimes for 2 weeks which is their main season. They close it because they are French and it is August, it doesn not dawn upon them to close in say late Sept or October and have their holiday then? I am amazed by this, but then I am not French.Deby Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gluestick Posted February 26, 2008 Share Posted February 26, 2008 Deby:Employment in agriculture in France is now only circa 10% of total workforce.CAP is being dis-assembled: which is causing additional problems for already hard-pressed French farmers.CAP didn't just benefit the French: it hugely benefited Holland, Denmark and Germany too: as well as Ireland less well.You can thank Heath for the terms on which the UK joined; when the post WW II state of British agriculture was excellent due to self-provision due to the Battle of the North Atlantic.The sorts of change you list cannot be achieved overnight: as I stated before.For example, suppose Sarkozy cancelled the French Social State: and dropped Cotisations to peanuts level and told ALL French workers to self-provision pensions, healthcare and etc.They would therefore need 100% wage increases!As we now know from the much vaunted Thatcher "Privatisations, utility bills have zoomed and service levels have plummeted. Building societies and TSB et al have de-mutualised and now we have Northern Rock.And then there is British Gas!Simply switching from a sort of state collective to a market economy is not a magic panacea for all problems: empirical recent evidence illustrates rather the reverse!Surely, one reason for your local restauraters taking their annual vacation in August is because their young family are at school in September and October?Unlike the Brits who drag their brats off at all times of the year to far off climes, the French take their education a tad more seriously!All our local French restaurants employ people and survive: indeed, one has made a lot and owns mucho property.What's the core difference? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allanb Posted February 26, 2008 Share Posted February 26, 2008 Gluestick writes: "CAP didn't just benefit the French: it hugely benefited Holland, Denmark and Germany too: as well as Ireland less well."Correction: it benefited European farmers. For people who buy and consume food (most of the population, as you may have noticed) it is a huge cost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benjamin Posted February 26, 2008 Share Posted February 26, 2008 Sarko's not too popular in the farming community at the moment.He chose an agricultural show on Saturday when someone wouldn't shake hands with him to deliver the immortal, almost Prescottesque words, "Get lost,you stupid bastard".Edit: the deleted word was b*st*rd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gluestick Posted February 26, 2008 Share Posted February 26, 2008 [quote user="allanb"]Gluestick writes: "CAP didn't just benefit the French: it hugely benefited Holland, Denmark and Germany too: as well as Ireland less well." Correction: it benefited European farmers. For people who buy and consume food (most of the population, as you may have noticed) it is a huge cost.[/quote]Agreed, but in response to the earlier poster's suggestion that it was mainly of benefit to France, I made the later suggestion.(Edit: Of course suggesting that CAP applied on a Pan-European basis is incorrect: CAP applies to what were EEC now EU members, only).I also stated that (sic) it "hugely"..............CAP had no early benefit to UK farmers: they did benefit later on from cashcrops such as rape. But not from sunflowers, for example.Luxembourg didn't benefit much. Spain's benefit, like Greece and Portugal came much later when the good days were history!A very wealthy Dutch acquaintance of mine retired with many millions thanks to CAP: he operated a fleet of reefers and fridge trailers and a vast cold store at Groenigon, mainly earned from shipping different food commodities for disposal after IBAP tried to clear down the mountains! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian Posted February 26, 2008 Share Posted February 26, 2008 [quote user="Gluestick"] he operated a fleet of reefers [/quote][:-))] It's one way to make your living. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chancer Posted February 26, 2008 Share Posted February 26, 2008 [quote user="Benjamin"]Sarko's not too popular in the farming community at the moment.He chose an agricultural show on Saturday when someone wouldn't shake hands with him to deliver the immortal, almost Prescottesque words, "Get lost,you stupid bastard".Edit: the deleted word was b*st*rd.[/quote]How did you get to that translation of "casse-toi pauvre c*o*n!"?I watched it on he news and Sarkozy was definitely not trying to shake hands with him, quite the opposite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gluestick Posted February 26, 2008 Share Posted February 26, 2008 [quote user="Ian"][quote user="Gluestick"]he operated a fleet of reefers [/quote][:-))] It's one way to make your living.[/quote]Seemed to work for Howard Marks! [Www]But in this case it's shipping trade jargon for "Refrigerated Vessel". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benjamin Posted February 27, 2008 Share Posted February 27, 2008 J.R. The report came from Expatica which is a normally reliable source and I reproduce the relevant section below: PARIS, Feb 26, 2008 - French President Nicolas Sarkozy said in aninterview Tuesday that he should have ignored a man who refused to shake hishand instead of telling him to "get lost" and calling him a "stupid bastard." "It is difficult when you are the president not to respond to an insult,"Sarkozy said in a question-and-answer session with readers of the popular LeParisien newspaper published Tuesday. "I should have not responded to him," he said. In the footage posted on several websites, Sarkozy is seen moving throughthe crowd at the annual agriculture fair on Saturday when a man tells him: "Oh no, don't touch me." The president, still smiling, responds: "Get lost,then." "You disgust me," the man says. "Get lost, you stupid bastard," Sarkozy fires back.But interestingly on looking back to find it I came across the following which seems to be saying that the Elysee Palace later tried to change a statement that Sarko had given: PARIS, Feb 26, 2008 - Nicolas Sarkozy's office altered an interviewpublished Tuesday in which the French president admits he erred when hecalleda man who refused to shake his hand a "stupid bastard," the editor said. In the amended version of the interview to Le Parisien daily, Sarkozy saidhe should have ignored the man instead of trading insults during his visit atthe annual farm show in Paris on Saturday. "I should have not responded to him," Le Parisien quoted him as saying. According to a transcript of the original interview, Sarkozy told a readerpanel from the paper: "I should not have told him to 'get lost'," withoutdirectly mentioning his use of swear words. Editor Dominique de Montvalon said in a television interview the changedsentence was added at the last minute by the Elysee palace.Again this is taken from Expatica. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clair Posted February 27, 2008 Share Posted February 27, 2008 If you view the video clip, you can hear the man say in French:"Oh no, don't touch me" to which Sarkozy replies "Get lost then"The man then adds:"You're soiling me" (Tu m'salis ) and Sarkozy says "Then get lost, you ***" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bones Posted February 27, 2008 Share Posted February 27, 2008 The differences between English and French swearing precludes any truly accurate, literal translation.It's the attitude he adopted more than anything. You just can't see the same confrontation happening with Chirac, who, incidentally, must be peeing his sides... Sarkozy has opened himself up to this kind of insult, Mr unconventional; always there with a controversial soundbyte and matey demeanour. Since becoming the head of state he's supposed to be walking around with a general air somewhere between Gordon Brown and the Queen, instead he's John Presscot at his bellicose best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gluestick Posted February 27, 2008 Share Posted February 27, 2008 Oh I love that, Bones!So apposite!John Prescott at his bellicose..........[:D] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artsole Posted February 27, 2008 Share Posted February 27, 2008 ah swearing in french.....................it just rolls off the tongue[Www]Sorry, this had to go to protect the sensibility of readers of the French language... Like wipeing your 'artsole' with silk[:-))]Post edited by the moderators, as per the Code of Conduct: Users must not post messages which: Contain explicit language or vulgarities (whether written in French, English or any other language) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benjamin Posted February 27, 2008 Share Posted February 27, 2008 Gluestick I claim the prize for introducing the very affable John Prescott into this thread.This was not to poke any sort of fun at him because that was/is his nature to respond to goading but I don't think when they voted for Sarko they expected to get their own version of Johnny 2 Jags. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artsole Posted February 27, 2008 Share Posted February 27, 2008 [quote user="artsole"] ah swearing in french.....................it just rolls off the tongue[Www]Sorry, this had to go to protect the sensibility of readers of the French language... Like wipeing your 'artsole' with silk[:-))]Post edited by the moderators, as per the Code of Conduct: Users must not post messages which: Contain explicit language or vulgarities (whether written in French, English or any other language) [/quote]wow, that was quick.......................but it was only fun, the french arn't gonna be offended..............it's used here in france all the time here............why not let the french on here decide[:D]You want to protect the 'sensibility' of the french[blink][blink][blink][blink] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clair Posted February 27, 2008 Share Posted February 27, 2008 [quote user="artsole"]wow, that was quick.......................but it was only fun, the french arn't gonna be offended..............it's used here in france all the time here............why not let the french on here decide[:D][/quote]I am French and I decided [:)] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artsole Posted February 27, 2008 Share Posted February 27, 2008 [quote user="Clair"][quote user="artsole"]wow, that was quick.......................but it was only fun, the french arn't gonna be offended..............it's used here in france all the time here............why not let the french on here decide[:D][/quote]I am French and I decided [:)][/quote]So, one french person on here has the right for censorship[geek][geek][geek]it's like wiping your 'arts' with silk[kiss]Post edited by the moderators as per the code of conduct:Users must not post messages which: Contain explicit language or vulgarities (whether written in French, English or any other language) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bones Posted February 27, 2008 Share Posted February 27, 2008 [quote user="Benjamin"]Gluestick I claim the prize for introducing the very affable John Prescott into this thread.This was not to poke any sort of fun at him because that was/is his nature to respond to goading but I don't think when they voted for Sarko they expected to get their own version of Johnny 2 Jags.[/quote]Actually, I was going to graciously acknowledge that in my post but the sentences we're already long and rambling; very French in fact! (wilts under Claire's disapproving, all seeing gaze). [:P] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gluestick Posted February 27, 2008 Share Posted February 27, 2008 Affable.........................unless, of course, he has just punched you in the mouth![:D] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chancer Posted February 27, 2008 Share Posted February 27, 2008 [quote user="Bones"]The differences between English and French swearing precludes any truly accurate, literal translation.It's the attitude he adopted more than anything. [/quote]I have wanted for a long time to ask the question regarding the effective levels of translated swear words so I will start the thread in the language section.For this thread I just want to ask was he really saying anything outrageous? The french "C" word is in my dictionary (I understand it to mean fool/stupid/damned) whereas no English swear words are.I note that they were both using the Tu form which in this instance I believe was to show disrespect, again am I on the right track? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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