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Are you British or French on Brittany Ferries


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I'm not talking about Brexit. We're talking about France. Should I have a say in your kids or your other halves future? Absolutely! After all they have a say in mine. It's called democracy. You personally may choose not to take part but as someone once said 'the rules are made by those who turn up'.

 

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46 minutes ago, alittlebitfrench said:

Your last point brings us back to the Brexit vote. I think when you reach a certain age (myself included) you let the younger generation decide. 

I still think that the majority of those Brits of a certain age seeking French nationality should be excluded because it is not relevant to their lives and it clogs the system. And they dont seem to have the expérience of France to make any informed decision.

So should these types have the vote ? Should they have a say on my kids or my other halves future ? Have they grown up in France an understand the main issues. Well no.

A former member of this forum still spills his shît in other places telling us us all to break the law and not pay this that and the other. Giving unworthy advice to those seeking advice. No kids, not married knows nothing apart from the shell he lives in.

Given his own self admiration of his French skills, and if someone told him the birthdate of Nepolean could potentially get French nationality.

Being a fighter for France, pay all my taxes, make people smile and laugh when out and about, have a crit air sticker on all my cars and van, cross my t’s and play by the rules…I…..find that quite unsettling.

 

Apart from 'letting the younger generation decide' You get my vote! In any event should someone reach an age or a mental condition where they can't even fill in a form then perhaps it doesn't really matter if they are in a an EPHAD or In the ground, they wouldn't know the difference! Like you, I believe most of these pompous 'I'm now French' types invariably go back to the country they have castigated most of their lives!!!

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7 minutes ago, DaveLister said:

Should I have a say in your kids or your other halves future? Absolutely! 

But why when you don’t have any experience of the isues under contention ? It is all about schooling.

One thing I have learnt as an immigrant/expat /Johney foreigner is don’t get involved in French politics, French social issues…or just anything related to how France is run. Keep quiet. Accept on a forum of course.

The British with or without French nationality should just stay out of the debate. 

Complicated is France…and the French really don’t like others sticking their noses in. Even Mrs ALBF. Even the little ALBF’s.

So yeah, getting French nationality to vote is quite pointless.

 

 

 

 

 

7 minutes ago, DaveLister said:

 

 

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15 minutes ago, alittlebitfrench said:

One thing I have learnt as an immigrant/expat /Johney foreigner is don’t get involved in French politics, French social issues…or just anything related to how France is run.

I think that might just say something about the company you keep. My French friends love a good debate.

16 minutes ago, alittlebitfrench said:

 

Complicated is France…and the French really don’t like others sticking their noses in. Even Mrs ALBF.

I don't know why but I find that very sad.😔

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59 minutes ago, DaveLister said:

I think that might just say something about the company you keep. My French friends love a good debate.

I don't know why but I find that very sad.😔

Big strike next Tuesday. Historic they say. The whole country will come to a grinding halt…so they say.

So who’s side are you on  ?

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53 minutes ago, alittlebitfrench said:

Big strike next Tuesday. Historic they say. The whole country will come to a grinding halt…so they say.

So who’s side are you on  ?

Personally I have great sympathy for most of the strikers. They see their parents or grandparents enjoying retirement with a good pension and a full social calendar and want to aspire to the same.

BUT,

The country as a whole cannot survive with increasing social costs and an inflexible workforce. Advances in medicine means most people are now living longer, and more active lives than before. The proposed increase in retirement age is not unreasonable.  In order to have a country fit enough to pass onto the next generation I hope it is brought in.

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2 hours ago, Ken said:

...should someone reach an age or a mental condition where they can't even fill in a form then perhaps it doesn't really matter if they are in a an EPHAD or In the ground, they wouldn't know the difference! 

Once again Kenny, I find myself asking, really?  No, seriously, REALLY? Heaven forfend that you should ever grow old!

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14 minutes ago, DaveLister said:

Personally I have great sympathy for most of the strikers. They see their parents or grandparents enjoying retirement with a good pension and a full social calendar and want to aspire to the same.

BUT,

The country as a whole cannot survive with increasing social costs and an inflexible workforce. Advances in medicine means most people are now living longer, and more active lives than before. The proposed increase in retirement age is not unreasonable.  In order to have a country fit enough to pass onto the next generation I hope it is brought in.

I should also add that I am below the current pensionable age.

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10 hours ago, betise said:

Once again Kenny, I find myself asking, really?  No, seriously, REALLY? Heaven forfend that you should ever grow old!

It's of no use to anyone pretending there is some sort of parallel world where everything is 'tikkity boo'! If someone should be unfortunate enough to suffer the sort of dementia implied then the reality is they wouldn't know if they were in a care home or Shanghai prison. The relatives have the problem not the sufferer. I don't know how old you are either but obviously you are naive!

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Whilst I will always defend the 'right to strike' the on-going efforts to stop pension reform is merely just another example of the French refusing to accept change even though the majority realise that change is needed. The country simply cannot afford for the shrinking working population to retire from the age of 62, countries all over the world are raising retirement ages so why do people here think France should be different?

Going back to the 'nationality' conversation, I think it's right for those who intend to spend the rest of their lives here to strive for the extra security that nationality brings, we've pushed our kids in that direction and for our youngest it's the only way he can obtain his desire to be a full time pompier.  

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My extended family has a growing number of dementia sufferers and the symptoms and the effects on the individual and people around them vary enormously. Best case is wife's 86 year old uncle in a care home who is blissfully unaware of everything and seems happier now than he ever was, worst case is an aunt who only exhibits anger because she can't remember things and her inner turmoil causes violent outbursts which in turn creates hell for her carer husband.

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My mum has dementia which actually started this debate. I agree that it is worse for close relatives than for the individual themselves. She seems perfectly happy going mad with her cat. The cat is everything. Everyone else is secondary. Which is fine by me. We just try and make sure she is safe. How long that will last….I have no idea.

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1 minute ago, alittlebitfrench said:

My mum has dementia which actually started this debate. I agree that it is worse for close relatives than for the individual themselves. She seems perfectly happy going mad with her cat. The cat is everything. Everyone else is secondary. Which is fine by me. We just try and make sure she is safe. How long that will last….I have no idea.

You and your family have my sympathy . It is indeed bloody cruel but I am convinced my comments are right. I have never experienced it in my family and I hope I never have to . Mind you I seem to have outlived most of them anyway!!!! Must be my caring and considerate nature!!!!

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1 hour ago, DraytonBoy said:

Whilst I will always defend the 'right to strike' the on-going efforts to stop pension reform is merely just another example of the French refusing to accept change even though the majority realise that change is needed. The country simply cannot afford for the shrinking working population to retire from the age of 62, countries all over the world are raising retirement ages so why do people here think France should be different?

Going back to the 'nationality' conversation, I think it's right for those who intend to spend the rest of their lives here to strive for the extra security that nationality brings, we've pushed our kids in that direction and for our youngest it's the only way he can obtain his desire to be a full time pompier.  


A few things here…

The change has to come from employers in the sense that they have to employ older people. And also treat them with respect. Get made redundant above the age of 50 and you will struggle to get a job. Especially in business or tech businesses that you are trained in. So how do you get to retirement age paying into the system without a job ?

OH who is senior director level will not last until she is 67. She will have a burnout. Like most people in France in such jobs.

The working environment is toxic in France. Which is part of the problem. The main reason I gave up my career in France. No way would I work in business in France. I would end up in jail for GBH.

Also, commuting in Paris (for example) kills you. Ever seen the film Fallen Down ?

I would not put up with what my wife puts up with in her job….or rather sees. They treat each other like shît.

Lastly, if you are a roofer ….do expect a roofer to still go onto roofs at 65 ? 
 

Essentially, the whole employment system is at fault not really the retirement age.

 

 

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1 hour ago, DraytonBoy said:

 

Going back to the 'nationality' conversation, I think it's right for those who intend to spend the rest of their lives here to strive for the extra security that nationality brings, we've pushed our kids in that direction and for our youngest it's the only way he can obtain his desire to be a full time pompier.  

Your youngest born (i guess ?) and bred in France should be given nationality by default. And it kinda makes my point.

Becoming a pompier is going to add positively to French society.

An elderly British couple in the Dordogne walking their dogs and watching sky all day don’t really contribute much. So I don’t see the point of clogging up the system for something they don’t need.

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Workers in the UK and Denmark will retire at 67 with the latter raising that to 68 by 2030, those workers also suffer burnout so it doesn't only apply to workers here. Is it right, probably not but it's where we are in 2023 so without change the country is screwed and the sooner people realise that the better.

Go back 50 years life expectancy was so much lower that the notional retirement age didn't matter as many didn't even make it to that age, now though the majority are predicted to live way beyond retirement age so somehow the extra pension cost has to be funded and making people work longer is currently the only viable answer.     

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47 minutes ago, DraytonBoy said:

Workers in the UK and Denmark will retire at 67 with the latter raising that to 68 by 2030, those workers also suffer burnout so it doesn't only apply to workers here. Is it right, probably not but it's where we are in 2023 so without change the country is screwed and the sooner people realise that the better.

Go back 50 years life expectancy was so much lower that the notional retirement age didn't matter as many didn't even make it to that age, now though the majority are predicted to live way beyond retirement age so somehow the extra pension cost has to be funded and making people work longer is currently the only viable answer.     

I bet the working environment in Danish companies is far less toxic than in French companies. I can’t begin to tell you how toxic they are. Which is half the problem.

 I bet most people in France are happy to retire at 67, 68 or later. They just want to retire from the toxicity of working in France/French companies. That is your problem.

Another thing, I don’t have a state pension. I have never believed in them. In fact they are a big con. I sorted that problem out myself.

All comes back to the educational system in France IMHO. Fix that, and you halfway to solving all the problems France has.

On another note but kinda relevant, some German students (13-16 year olds) visted my little girls school. They could all speak fluent English. Fluent. My daughter said they were fluent.
 

There are no fluent English speakers at my daughters school. Or my sons for that matter. Or German or Spanish speakers. Ask any French school kid what is the hardest lesson at school, and most will say French.

French is not going to get a job when you already speak it.

 

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The reluctance of employers to employ mature workers is a world wide problem but I agree with ALBF that there does appear to be a particular malaise in France that begins with the schools. The learning by rote and reluctance to allow free expression and independent thought produces a workforce that is incapable of adapting to change. I know countless young French people who hate their jobs but wouldn't consider looking for alternative employment. Instead they go to work every day, detesting every moment of it, waiting for the weekend when they can let rip. There are a few who can think outside the box and, like Wooly's example on another thread, move on and obtain a sense of fulfillment but most are just waiting for a retirement they see slipping further and further away from them.

As to elderly British couples clogging up the system, I'm not old, I'm not married, and I don't have a dog. So I suppose I'm alright😉

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5 hours ago, Ken said:

It's of no use to anyone pretending there is some sort of parallel world where everything is 'tikkity boo'! If someone should be unfortunate enough to suffer the sort of dementia implied then the reality is they wouldn't know if they were in a care home or Shanghai prison. The relatives have the problem not the sufferer. I don't know how old you are either but obviously you are naive!

Kenny, Kenny, you make a lot of assumptions. But in order for you to insult me, I would first have to value your opinion.

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I just don't see why the work 'toxicity' here (if it exists) would be any different to other countries, our kids certainly haven't mentioned it and I would guess overall they have worked for around 20 businesses/organisations between them since the eldest started work ten years ago. They have to work hard but in comparison to say the US their working lives are a doddle.

I'll agree to a point about the education system which seems to be stuck in the past, I think this is down to the national psyche enforced from birth that the French way is always the best so why change which permeates society in general.  

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