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3-4 days in the Southwest in July 2023


nkostakis
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Having just arrived in the forum, may I wish everyone a healthy and happy year.

Please allow me to tap into your wisdom as my experience of France is limited to one holiday in Paris (+Disneyland in 2019).

In early July 2023, after spending 4-5 days in Andorra I'm planning a 3-4 day (depending on your suggestions) stay in southwestern France before driving on (we'll have a rental 7-seater) to Barcelona (to spend 3-4 days there before flying home). The idea was to 'discover' quaint, small-town, quiet, 'provincial' France. Wanting to avoid longish driving distances (more than 250 Km) I thought of selecting Perpignan as our base  (well Perpignan might not be really provincial but it's a smaller city and I'm hopeful of finding "authentic" villages around). I say Perpignan as it looks like a probably good solution (on a map), however I'm open to suggestions.

I have some very (pre?)elementary French that I was taught for 5 years in primary school some 45 years ago.

I would very much appreciate all insights/advice you could give me.

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Perpignan is in fact quite a big city rather than a big town. I have only seen it in passing; once going south to Barcelona and a second time going north on our return trip. I did not see anything that would attract me to stay there. 
  I can recommend staying in Carcasson if you are able to tolerate the crowds of tourists (just like me). It does offer plenty of local interest obviously including the castle but also a trip down the Canal du Midi is excellent. There are many small, pretty villages worth visiting on day trips or as part of your touring. Depending on your interests you could base your tour on the various cathedrals in that region which are often in quite small towns with village atmospheres. The journey will certainly give you a chance to see numerous beautiful, traditional villages.

You could simply start your route using Google Maps. Good luck.

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Have to support HectorsDad .. I live between Carcassonne and Narbonne.  Carcassonne and the Canal du Midi and the villages of the Minervois have much to offer .. and if  you have never visited the Cité, the medieval one it is a must, and though there are some tourist sights in the Perpignan area, it is a much bigger city.  I have not yet found anything very exciting in it.   The Palais des Rois de Majorca is supposed to  be worth seeing, I haven't been, and there is Tautauvel close by .. plus the coastal areas if you like that.  I suggest you try to stay in both, for pehaps a few days each  Do some research, there is plenty of information out there, and plot some short stays and routes between them.  It much depends on your interest.  Beziers has the 5 rise locks, quite something, a trip on the canal itself can be very relaxing and you'd see plenty of villages that way .. wine tasting available all over the region .. just a few suggestions.  Narbonne also has a lot to see, Roman remains and a splendid cathedral.  Plus another canal.  As a town, I prefer it to Carcassonne, Beziers, or Perpignan.

Carcassonne to Perpigan, about 2 and half hours drive on the motorway (tolled), Narbonne about an hour from Carca, 30 mins to Perpignan .. etc. then another hour to Girona, and Barcelona another 1-2 hrs (I don't often go much beyond Girona, but the only unknown time is crossing the border).   Can be fine unless either side decide to have a control check when it can be slow.   For Girona - it is a gem, and should be visited.  The old town and its walkways (steep cobbled streets) take your breath away, and it has city walls well worth the walk. Even I, with one hip on the blink, found them challenging but very, very enjoyable. 

Plenty there to think about.  Good luck!

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Hectorsdad and Judith, thank you both immensely for your very valuable insights. 

Our 3 teenage kids can't stand long drives (in their book, over two hours) . I guess I could stretch it to choose Narbonne as our base in France. I'll discuss this with the family and see how it flies. A possible issue, there appear to be relatively few hotels there, pricier too (quck Booking.com search), compared to Braziers.

Might I also ask for restaurant recommendations in the area?

Re tolls on French motorways, can one pay with debit card or cash?

Regarding the coastal areas from Narbonne down to Girona: do you think they'd be 'fully' crowded around 10/7? I prefer to avoid large crowds if possible (understanding I can't expect to have my cake and eat it too travelling in mid-July, if it follows the post-pandemic travel spree of 2022)

Edited by nkostakis
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The drive from Andorra to Perpignan, although we enjoy travelling that way to Spain and avoiding the more popular routes and motorways, is not going to be enjoyable for your family.

I suggest you buy a paper map and look carefully at the roads around the area. I use an old one, Michelin 235, which covers this area particularly well on one page, and is still available from various sources.

 

 

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28 minutes ago, ssomon said:

The drive from Andorra to Perpignan, although we enjoy travelling that way to Spain and avoiding the more popular routes and motorways, is not going to be enjoyable for your family.

I suggest you buy a paper map and look carefully at the roads around the area. I use an old one, Michelin 235, which covers this area particularly well on one page, and is still available from various sources.

 

 

Do you mean the Google Maps travel time (3.5 hrs for 241Km) is not realistic? I see the fastest route uses the N20 ( what speed limit on N roads, in general ?) and a 90 Km final strech on the A61.

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apologies ssomon, I realised after replying that you were talking about the Andorra to Perpignan road which is indeed very twisty. That's one more reason I received the suggestion of Narbonne instead of Perpignan with relief; much easier roads.

Edited by nkostakis
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I don't know what route you are looking at, but if I were going from Andorra to Narbonne I'd go via Perpignan - at least as far as the junction of the N116 with the N9. I refer to the old National (N) road numbers, which have been changed in many places since the handover of main roads to the Departments. Many are now labelled "D", but often have the same number or a slight variation of it, e.g. D6113 for the old N113. Quite often the old designation is still on many signs.

Mappy gives the distance and time to Perpignan as 162km in 2h38 min, but if I were driving a people carrier on holiday in July I'd allow more than that.

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I've just realised you are looking at going northwards and eventually joining the A9 to Narbonne near Bram, which I wouldn't consider, especially in the middle of summer.

You would go almost through Carcassonne, which I think would be a far more interesting place to visit than Narbonne, and the countryside is good around there, as mentioned. Both towns have a traffic problem, especially in summer.

Maybe you like Autoroutes, but I stay off them when on holiday, as the cost is around 50% of the cost of the fuel I use, and one sees nothing except trucks and inferior restaurants and caffs in service stops.

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Nkostakis .. oickingup on the posts since I last looked on here.   You can go from Andorra towards Toulouse - it's the way I went and is not too bad.  The motorways (in spite of what ssomon says) are not too bad mid week unless someone does a silly.  Avoid bank holiday weekends eg 14 July, but 10 should be OK.   Avoid travelling the weekend after it will be hell on the motorways but ordinary roads are fine. I have travelled the auto route from Toulouse to Carca regularly over the last 2 and half years, usually no problem at all .. I would avoid going through Carca .. it's not very easy and is tedious.   Everybody uses the  motorway to get from one side of Carca to the other.  Hotels in Narbonne tend to be on the outskirts but it is a much smaller town and much easier to get around, also has bus routes.  Beziers does have a few hotels in the centre, but parking is not easy, and it is city I avoid when I can (it is our sub prefecture so I can't entirely!). Toll payments on autoroute are usually by card. The route to Girona in July, about as ususal .. the coastal road is scenice, but long and that woudl be busier .. avoid the towns along the coast, they wil be busy.   Restaurants, almost impossible to say, they change, and it's pot luck .. I do have lists, but that would be better in a separate post once you've sussed your route out. 

 

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  • 3 weeks later...

Following your recommendations Judith, I think I'll select either Narbonne or Beziers as our base in France. Michelin  proposes the route passing through Perpignan (N22, N20, N116 to Perpignan, from there on via the motorway A9/E15 to Narbonne). The main problem that I can see is road traffic on and after the July 14 holiday (Fri 14- Sat 15-Sun 16) which I wasn't even aware of. Initially I expected we'd be leaving to drive towards Barcelona on the 13th or 14th. If you can shed some light here, how bad can I expect traffic to be? Would things get crowded in Narbonne/Beziers even on the eve (13)?

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Hi again, Nkostakis.  From either of those you can go in whatever direction you'd like easily .. Narbonne being perhaps an hour nearer Spain (and as I said, my preference for towns of the two, though lacking a good quality central hotel, but there are plenty with easy access to the autoroute, including a Novotel near the southern rocade, with very easy access to the autoroute (could hardly be nearer, but getting ito town is easy too, I find the road system in Narbonne less confusing thatn Beziers.  And there are buses too.  Whatever you do the French will faire le pont over the weekend, which means they will be moving mainly and certainly, it being a Thursday, more than Friday, so as to be in place for Friday 14th and the weekend.  My experience of 14th is that it is quiet .. very little traffic  on the route around our little town, which we can hear when there is a lot on it. Some food shops might be open on the Friday morning, but nothing much in the afternoon, at a guess.  From Narbonne you can be at the Spanish border in about an hour ..or less, and it is more likely that it will flow smoothly trhough the border itself.  People in France tend to go to family for 14th July clebrations. Watch the speed limit in Spain, 100 immediately after the border, reverting to autoroute speed of 120 once on the the autoroute proper.  No tolls when I last went through in November. Saturday travel, difficult to say, as holiday makers changing at the weekend will add to traffic (and you wil be passing a very popular holiday spot )so I would not recommebd the coast road that weekend. So it will be very much luck, but mornings are usually less busy than afternoons when people are on the move. 

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I already spotted Novotel Narbonne Sud A9/A61 yesterday as a probable place to stay 🙂

I undestand that chances are I'll (probably) be ok driving to the Spanish border in the morning of the 14th.

So, once we got the hard stuff sorted out, let us proceed to the pleasurable: places to visit and where to eat.

The floor is yours.

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If you do stay at that hotel, it is very close to a restaurant called Bistro Regent which is on the other side of the main road. We resorted to eating there because I wanted steak and chips. It was a little chaotic and the staff tried hard. Our food was excellent and I saw many good looking dishes on other tables. It is plain and simple but good value.

You will have fun picking your way through the “shamrock shaped multi-roundabout”. I drove through and around it several times when we first arrived looking for our accommodation in a chateau outside the city. It was easier when we came back to eat in the bistro.

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I've eaten at the Novotel .. it's perfecty fine as well.  There is also a Courtepaille and IBIS adjacent to the Novotel. Plus most peoples favourite shop - Grand Frais - best fresh veg and fruit ever - but that won't interest you!   But is explains  why I know the area so well!  If you really must, towards Narbonne on the road from there, you wil find a Macdonald's. but nect to that is a sports centre, swimming pool etc. As for things to see in Narbonne.  Spoilt for choice.  Archbishops Palace in main square, take a tour and get to the top - marvellous view, also the Cathedral, oddly shaped, next door, can be seen for miles, but never completely finsishd as planned, hence it's odd shape.  There are Roman remains, a new Vino exhibition, (not been but heard it's good), the tourist office just up the road from the main square, palace and cathedral, is worth a vist, it sits over an arm off the canal du midi, which name currently escapes me, but walking along that canal path, is very interesting indeed.  It has a theatre, on the canal side, where you can park if you decided to drive into town, for free, and it's about a 10 min walk, if that, along the canal to the town square.  Plenty of restaurants, markets, etc etc.  Anything particular you like to do/ see?

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Judith, we'll be sleeping in Narbonee but would like to take short excursions/day trips in the area. Let us say on a radius of 1-1.5 hour drive from Narbonne (one way). One such visit will be to Béziers for the boat tour on the canal.

What else would you sugggest? I'd be interested in small villages, local food restaurants & wine, a horse riding farm for my two teenage daughters, nature scenery (no hiking). What "real" (if that means anything any more) France is like.

Is that too vague?

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HI again, nkostaskis,

Sounds like your plans are ocming on apace.  Look at the Narbonne tourist office web site, also for La Clape, the Minervois .. you can get to Carcassonne from Narbonne in about an hour, but in the middle of July I would not suggest that, Carca  will  be heaving with people. You could drive from Beziers along the Minervoise, plenty of villages dotted around off that road, which will  take you first to Olonzac, in about 30 mins (watch for speed limits on that section, they are very keen in that bit), and whilst the road eventually also goes to Carcassonne, I would suggest you aim to go through Olonzac, pretty enough, with some commerces if necessary, and onwards to Minerve, one the seats of the Cathars, and the most accessible.  Apart from Beziers (huge massacre of the Cathars in 1308 - I think that's the right date), the rest of the sights are way down west of Perpignan in somewhat inaccessible places for the short trip you are making. MInerve is spectular. Good restos too. Plenty of tourist shops.  As you can see, it is one of my favourite places, though I usually go out of season.  The tourist web sites of the various regions are very helpful.  You might also like to look at Fontfroide, just south of Narbonne, and also well worth a visit.  Ex-monastic building now very nicely restored etc, if I could only remember which brand of monk they were!  Nice resto too. Don't know horse riding places, sorry, not my thing.  Hope that helps, from the top of my head. 

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I think restaurants are very specific to what you like, and sadly there have  been quite a few closures since Covid.  The larger towns have several, along the canal du Midi, which la MInervoise follows, you wil lfind them them too.  I'd have to reserch a little more to really help .. La Croisade is liked, Chantovent in MInerve, from memory, Homps has several choices along the canal in the village centre, the unpretentious ones you often find only by asking in the villages.  French cuisine done here is not a varied as you will find elsewhere in France, with a strong Spanish influence.  I prefer the food in the SW myself.  Ty'zak in Olonzac, very popular pizzeria plus the standard types of meal. 

 

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Now had time to look at a few .. these are some of the restaurants in the Narbonne end of the Minervois. Watch for closing days, usually Monday, Wednesday, or Thursday, and sometimes Sunday if they are open all week. I've noted those I know as I have used them.  Those not noted I have not used.

Table'O  in Beaufort, Ty'zac (Wed)

Le Ty Zac(Olonzac)  is open for lunch only on Monday

Cafe de la Grille in Capestang? Pretty sure it's open every day.
Serves  steaks, pizzas (they have a pizza oven) fish etc. Very hearty   traditional French food. The restaurant is not 'fancy' but we have  always had very good food and service (Not me, tbhis from someone else)

Lo Cagarol in Aigne (?Thursday) Long time since I've been a tyical circulade viallge as is Olonzac, but Aigne is prettier.  YOu can get on to the road from MInerve too from there.

Bella Npoli in Narbonne is pretty good.

La Belle Epoque - St Marcel sur Aude - (Sunday) also a bar so open all day.

Might think of more when I think futher, but another busy day here!

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A great deal of delightful information!

You suggest the villages of Olonzac and Minerve in the Minervois area, is Bize-Minervois (came across it in a travel guide) another interesting place to visit?

Regarding restaurants, are you by any chance familiar aware of places serving gluten-free dishes?

(shamelessly pestering you on) Now, parking. I'm the sort of person that likes to drive as close as possible to my destination, ideally right outside. What difficulties should I prepared to meet in Narbonne/Beziers? General situation, paid /metered municipal, paid private garages...

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Hi again,

Bize isn't very large, but I have yet to find my way around it ..completely.  My doctor used to work from there, but has since moved, but I still go back to the phamarcy there, and it is a pretty village to walk around, with a river which can be swum in during the summer.  There is also a very good restaurant called Chez Jean-Marc, (I forgot before) who is an excellent chef, his wife (Rachel) speaks good English and the meals have a touch of the oriental in them (he was a 5* chef in  hotel somewhere in Asia).  Lovely couple.  To find, pass the pharmacy roundabout, at the next small roundabout take the right hand road, go in to the parking on the left and the resto is on the other side of the road.  The other side of the river is the main village.  Most villages (but not all) will have some form of eatery, you can only go look and see if yo fancy it.  Bars often do main meals at lunch time .. always worth trying and you will find regulars aplenty in them.  They are very much French country cooking with often no choice of menu.

In a previous post I suggested a place to park in Narbonne, the threatre, but in both Narbonne and Beziers parking is not so easy, and all would need a little walk.  This is not America!  There is a shuttle bus in Narbonne whch goes past the parking in the theatre ..  parking near restaurants in villages is usually but not always easy.  Most villages benefit from a walk around, and in some places you could not or would not want to drive too close to places you want to see.  In Bize Minervois, it would be difficult as the roads are very, very narrow, as they are also in several other villages.  In Minerve it is a good walk from the parking, and you are not allowed to park in the village, unless you are a resident, at all.  And if you drove in, you could well get stuck and not get out again. 

I cannot help with gluten free, as it does not affect me, but restaurants, especially those serving the tourist trade, are catching on.  But betise's suggestion is good also.

 

 

 

 

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  • 5 months later...
On 10/01/2023 at 09:55, nkostakis said:

Having just arrived in the forum, may I wish everyone a healthy and happy year.

Please allow me to tap into your wisdom as my experience of France is limited to one holiday in Paris (+Disneyland in 2019).

In early July 2023, after spending 4-5 days in Andorra I'm planning a 3-4 day (depending on your suggestions) stay in southwestern France before driving on (we'll have a rental 7-seater) to Barcelona (to spend 3-4 days there before flying home). The idea was to 'discover' quaint, small-town, quiet, 'provincial' France. Wanting to avoid longish driving distances (more than 250 Km) I thought of selecting Perpignan as our base  (well Perpignan might not be really provincial but it's a smaller city and I'm hopeful of finding "authentic" villages around). I say Perpignan as it looks like a probably good solution (on a map), however I'm open to suggestions.

I have some very (pre?)elementary French that I was taught for 5 years in primary school some 45 years ago.

I would very much appreciate all insights/advice you could give me.

A rainy day and i'm sitting here browsing! It is July and I have read through all the posts. I don't know how far you have got with your travels but I hope you managed to differentiate between the SW and the SE!! Every thing written was about the SE but you started by saying you were going to the SW? Doesn't really matter, I'm bored and just browsing!!

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