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New tax on non resident home owners


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I think cutting off your nose to spite your face may apply here. Calm down. Its annoying but a typical tax man trick in the UK, France or elsewhere. Be assured the Taxman will raise the tax to a level to hurt but not to kill the golden goose.
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[quote user="Cendrillon"]Second home owners who rent their homes out, often spend a lot of money locally, paying for artisans to do their renovations. Artisans could find their work starts to dry-up.
[/quote]

I understood this tax was for those second home owners who DON'T rent out their properties . . .

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I know your right, but the amount of tax we have to pay on a monthly basis is border line criminal, and now the french are jumping on the band wagon.

Of course i will not sale my house nor stop work, but this does depend on how much they decide to charge me, my property is a fair size and i may after recieving the first bill decide to change my mind. The problem with this is that it plants a seed, you cant say now what they may do in the future and this makes for a unsettled future
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[quote user="tinabee"]

[quote user="Cendrillon"]Second home owners who rent their homes out, often spend a lot of money locally, paying for artisans to do their renovations. Artisans could find their work starts to dry-up.
[/quote]

I understood this tax was for those second home owners who DON'T rent out their properties . . .

[/quote]

Yes because those that rent their property out must be registered to pay tax in France for the purpose of paying the tax on the rent gathered regardless of if it is short (as in holiday rental) or longterm rent.

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[quote user="Turnip"]WE need equality in these matters so lets tax second homes in the UK. If taxing second homes in Fance keeps prices down ,albeit some Brits. will sell up, then I applaud the new tax[/quote]An excellent idea! Having seen the damage to local rural communities by second homeowners who are rarely at their properties  I would welcome a UK tax on second homes provided of that it applied to all second home owners. When many people are struggling to buy one home here, a second home can only be regarded as a luxury and so is fair game for the taxman. Of course I would like to live in a world with high standards of public services and low taxation but that just isn't possible.
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[quote user="Turnip"] If taxing second homes in France keeps prices down [/quote]

It is estate agents who get prices moving and owners Not purchasers. If there is not enough housing stock the law of supply and demand will cause property to go to the highest bidder but as there as so many knackered old properties still available that hasn't happened. It is the estate agents who want to show how much better they are and how much more they can get out of a purchaser than the agent down the road and the owner who's told they can get another 10,000 because they freshly crepi'd their house and planted some geraniums.

Whilst annoying another tax isn't the end it just another stage but my objection is that it's only being applied to foreigners and not across the whole second home market which is as usual the French making up their own EU rules and not obeying others that they lost in translation.

Whilst some recent posters have an envy problem for people choosing a holiday home, we have a modest property in the UK and a modest property in France, the total of which would equal the average UK home. People pay more for their cars than we paid for our house in France so lets tax everyone resident or not who has a second car! for the same reason that owning a second car must by your theory raise the overall price of cars for everyone!

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Quillan, my understanding is that the second home in France will need to be available to rent all the year around and to avoid this becoming a loophole, I expect that the rules if and when published will be complicated and strictly imposed. Otherwise, the temptation might be to rent the house out for a week each year to a family member, if the resulting tax was lower!

An important fact that is being overlooked, is that this new proposed tax is being introduced to help offset the raising of the French wealth tax threshold, that means wealthy second home owners with properties in France worth over a million Euros, will on balance be better of.

Sarko wants to encourage wealthy individuals to come to France and discourage those who are not, hence the health care changes for early retirees.
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[quote user="Sprogster"] Sarko wants to encourage wealthy individuals to come to France and discourage those who are not, hence the health care changes for early retirees.[/quote]

"They maybe wealthy when they arrive but they won't be when they leave"

Sarkozy 2011.

 

Ok he didn't actually say that [;-)]

Reminds me of Arkwright in "Open All Hours" and that till of his [:)]

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Somewhere in the dredging ground of my mind I seem to remember that what got Sarkozy's goat about the health thing was that many expats pay tax in the UK (former government servants and the like) which thus deprived France and notably the social security system of revenue, and so he decided that unless this was changed, then healthcare for early retireds would be withdrawn.
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[quote user="AnthonyDrake"]KPMG have produced this informative article: http://www.kpmg.com/UK/en/IssuesAndInsights/ArticlesPublications/NewsReleases/Pages/French-tax-rules-hit-Brtions.aspx [/quote]

Unfortunately the article appears to contain at least one error that I can see. It states that the new tax will be the same as tax d'habitation, but my understanding is that the tax d'habitation calculation is dependent upon rates voted by local authorities, not a standard 20%

 

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looks like the new tax change has gone through parliment.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2002503/Britons-French-holiday-homes-face-shock-new-tax-increase.html

intrestingly it says " The tax only applies to foreigners with second homes that are unoccupied all year"

so if you visit on holiday you don't pay the extra tax?

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I think you can assume that that is simply lousy journalism from the DM.

The the tax applies to all properties that are not rented out long-term. Being unoccupied all year is not the same thing as not being rented out long-term.

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[quote user="Keelstow"]looks like the new tax change has gone through parliment.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2002503/Britons-French-holiday-homes-face-shock-new-tax-increase.html

intrestingly it says " The tax only applies to foreigners with second homes that are unoccupied all year"

so if you visit on holiday you don't pay the extra tax?[/quote]

Hi Keelstow,

Have a look at the following ie Blevins Franks newsletter dated May.

http://system.newzapp.co.uk/GPage.asp?LID=OSwxNzY3NzU5MjU=

Chris
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   What is this  "escape " tax   that is mentioned in the replies to the article in the DM  :  

Most Brits and other foreigners who own homes in France now know about this proposed tax but what is also on the cards which has rarely been mentioned up to now is that the French tax authorities are going to charge a nineteen percent "escape" tax when you sell a house here in France and return to the country from which you came, ie Britain.



Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2002503/Britons-French-holiday-homes-face-shock-new-tax-increase.html#ixzz1P9vvKUzj

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While most of us object to this tax, for various reasons not least because it may well be discriminatory under EU law, and not forgetting all the euros British holiday homeowners pour into France's coffers, at least it seems that the tax would be less than initially feared. As most Brits who buy in France tend to choose rural locations, rather than glitzier and pricier Riviera and Paris locations, for example, the notional rental values of their properties are really rather low, meaning the 20% of this value that would be payable as tax will also be fairly nominal. Of course, most people who own a holiday home in rural France aren't jetsetters, and haven't easily afforded their 'dream', as has been suggested, so any extra expense is bad news. Let's hope Sarkozy sees sense and puts this proposal where it deserves to be - in the bin!

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[quote user="FPN Editor"]

the notional rental values of their properties are really rather low, meaning the 20% of this value that would be payable as tax will also be fairly nominal. [/quote]

I'd be interested to know what your idea of "fairly nominal" is.  €100?  €500?  €1000?

We're in a rural location and the tax applicable to our property would be c. €900 p.a.

It won't apply to us, because we're fiscally resident, but it will to many others.  Maybe your idea of nominal is different to mine.

 

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And in your last paragraph lies a solution for many of the people potentially affected by this proposal.

 

Namely register to become fiscally resident.

 

The double taxation treaty will ensure that people are not taxed twice on their primary income.

It will not be a solution for everyone but for many it could stop them becoming victims of a tax that is stated as being targeted at a different group - namely rich French tax exiles.

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[quote user="andyh4"]

And in your last paragraph lies a solution for many of the people potentially affected by this proposal.

 

Namely register to become fiscally resident.

 

The double taxation treaty will ensure that people are not taxed twice on their primary income.

It will not be a solution for everyone but for many it could stop them becoming victims of a tax that is stated as being targeted at a different group - namely rich French tax exiles.

[/quote]

Andy that doesn't work for holiday home owners in so many ways. I'm not happy about paying this "extra" tax; so to get the ball rolling I've written to our local MEP and see what the official thinking from Brussels is, I would suggest that others in a similar position to us do the same.

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[quote user="NickP"][quote user="andyh4"]

And in your last paragraph lies a solution for many of the people potentially affected by this proposal.

 

Namely register to become fiscally resident.

 

The double taxation treaty will ensure that people are not taxed twice on their primary income.

It will not be a solution for everyone but for many it could stop them becoming victims of a tax that is stated as being targeted at a different group - namely rich French tax exiles.

[/quote]

Andy that doesn't work for holiday home owners in so many ways. I'm not happy about paying this "extra" tax; so to get the ball rolling I've written to our local MEP and see what the official thinking from Brussels is, I would suggest that others in a similar position to us do the same.

[/quote]

 

 Thanks for the post Nick ... I will  write .....   This is a link for contacts for those who may need it : You can write to your MEP's using the link .

 http://www.writetothem.com/?keyword=MEP&creativeid=1424683179&gclid=CPjFxI2MuqkCFcJP4QodVjkQ8w

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