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Antipub 82 antipublicity - Montauban


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Re Gays moderators post.:

She has highlighted the area the C of C she is concerned about which is “do not advertise”

If you read the post before hers it starts “A personal reply. Paysages  de France is not antipub.”. This implies that he was speaking as Paysages de France in all his posts previously and has suggested people join it (at a cost of 5 Euros according to their website) this is very close to advertising.

We have deleted another post temporarily and are waiting for clarification from Forum Admin on if it is or is not advertising. As many members know the forum does allow posts advertising things that are for charity etc but permission MUST always be sought from Forum Admin before actually posting.

If anyone has any further problems then they should contact her by PM.

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I think using the organisation's title as the forum user name is a bit of a giveaway too...

It does make it difficult to understand. Saying 'a personal reply' implies that Paysages de France the individual is not antipub, so it must be Paysages de France the organisation that seems so vehemently opposed to publicity for US corporations and French supermarkets. And why did PdeF use the word 'antipub' in his topic title?

Surely the rules that the organisation, presumably, is fighting, reasonably and correctly, to get enforced and extended will have to apply to all advertisers, not just those to whom the individual PdeF is so vehemently opposed?

Just as forum rules about unsolicited advertising etc need to be applied universally, not selectively - unless PdeF is merely making a third party recommendation? [6]

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[quote user="Quillan"]

I totally agree with Will, I can see why some don't like these panels but there are load of other things around us that need sorting out first. We could start perhaps with dog poo (I’m being serious).

[/quote]

Quillan, I can't believe you're being serious.   Dog poo is an integral part of French culture, and should be respected as such if you're going to be a guest in their country.   I don't know, you Brits, come waltzing into France and try to turn it into a dog-poo-free zone.   How presumptious!   [:)] 

 

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They might be an eyesore but they certainly are helpful when arriving at a strange town and you are seeking the hotel that you have booked.

As French postcodes are not as specific as UK or those in Denmark, satellite navigation is of no use in these circumstances.

Perhaps, the benefits of people visiting an area are far greater that the visual aspect.

Certainly, my recent visit to a large store in Montauban (which I had not been to previously) was greatly assisted by these boards. If it had not been for them I might still be going round and round in Montauban.

Paul

PS I have to agree this does seem like an advertising campaign

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[quote user="P"]

They might be an eyesore but they certainly are helpful when arriving at a strange town and you are seeking the hotel that you have booked.

As French postcodes are not as specific as UK or those in Denmark, satellite navigation is of no use in these circumstances.

Perhaps, the benefits of people visiting an area are far greater that the visual aspect.

[/quote]

It's a good point. I seem to remember something about relevency somewhere in the thread. Well of course locals know where things are so they don't have to be reminded but people coming to or passing through might like to know where these places are for many reasons. I personally would go to a supermarket for cheap diesel for example because supermarkets are normally the cheapest and Auto route stations the more expnsive. Big sign near junction for say Super'U' would make me go there.

Rumzigal - A chap used to put flags in them in Quillan indicating he had take a photo of the hound commiting the offence to shame people in to cleaning up. He then put the phote up in his window down the high street. Us Brits wear our (empty and unsued of course) poo bags with pride, the natives initially found it strange that we should clear up after our dogs. We have been campagning to have some poo bins put up but the French response is 'who's going to empty them?'. In response they created a new bylaw to say that dogs must be on a lead, never did work that one out.

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Advertising !! There are adverts from members and a Mod or two all over the place. What is he selling, two weeks in Barbados with every angry  agreement !

Sure there are more important things, lets find the most important and

give everything else a swerve. That's sorted out all the other problems

just the big one to worry about. With Quillan it's dog poo

and plastic bags!! These things don't have a pecking order, You want to get the plastic bag situation sorted, fine, that's a good thing not sure how far it has gone but this feller appears to have put his money where his mouth is. His raison d'être is this thing, others who don't feel for it, that's OK but why tell him there are more important things to do?  Are some folks telling him to fight their corner for the things they want improved ? Sorry but people have to get off their own backsides to do that, not put it on people like him who have decided to do something.

I admire the chap opposite the commons. couldn't do it myself but he has the will power to do it. Bizarre as it comes cross, it is still folks like him who are doing their little bit, not that important...course it's not but, as in everything in this World, it is generally the small things that make up the whole

Bill, to put this at the bottom and only deal with the most important things here in France, would mean little or no reaction on this Forum, some have not yet grasped the Maire and Mairie principle yet [:)] We debate from crap to less crappy and all the sh*te in between. Now some want to debate whether this is  worth the debate !!! Friendly fire, there's a good one, not been debated recently, surely something that serious, should put all other debates on the back burner....Sadly or not, it doesn't work in that way, we all know that !

So one chap thinks we need big panels so people can read them, well let's go one further and have no fear, that is what happens, let's all be allowed nice big panels and lets all shove them together, there that's better, be like a book, very handy when travelling along and it's getting boring. Road safety, nicer environment,  armpits to that, we need to know where to buy a lapin !!

I have no qualms with signs in general, we all need them in one way or another, they simply have to be controlled surely. This chap is also talking about the illegal sites that are springing up all over the place. The truth is, no one wants the big hoardings bunged up in the field opposite but will swear that they wouldn't mind...until the day, then it is a very big thing !!

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If our new friend is publicising an organisation that requires a fee for membership and Archant allow the organisation to use this board to recruit new members, effectively Archant are endorsing the organisation. It is reasonable for Archant to choose to decline that opportunity.

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Well I was surprised it was for advertising that the poster was reminded of the terms, even though it was in bold!

He's not selling anything is he, any more than Christine is 'selling' dogs?

I saw other reasons why a reminder was made - which just goes to show how we sometimes see very different things when reading a post.[;-)]

 

 

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There seems to be a confusion between the terms 'advertising and information' and 'free speech and libel' here. If I  post the adress of Paysages de France on this forum     http://paysagesdefrance.free.fr         it's obviously done to inform people of the existence of a non profit making environmental association, and not in order to bring them 'clients'.It is certainly not an advert.

          If I say that Clear Channel, Viacom and JC Decaux continually break the law, it's not libellous because it's true. Paysages de France has condemned these three societies several times each before the courts and the asso  has also had the state condemned 18 times in the past few years for 'carence'. (not upholding the law).

 I'll not post any more comments on this forum as the debate seems to be well under way and my entries seem to put the moderators in too much of a tizz. I hope that at least one or two people have looked  up the P de France site and may have joined - the French countryside needs all the help it can get. I shall be presenting the film 'Montauban et les 400 panneaux' at Pau University on the 14th March. the film will be  followed by a debate...........I can be contacted at  the antipub 82 adress         aleluis@club-internet.fr

  another French site to look at is  Brigade Antipub       bap.propagande.org

 P.S. Quillan:

 As regional correspondant for Paysages de France  I've been named to 'siege' on a commission at Carcassonne and shall be doing my best to wrest back the town's entrances from the hands of the 'afficheurs' (who've particularly spoiled the exit roads from the airport).

      Salut à tous le monde................I'm going to get on with protecting the countryside.

         

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Miki, yes fair enough.What I thought the campaign was about was the supposedly illegal large hoardings and the apparent inability to enforce the laws regarding such signs. I still think there are other things that are more important in the wider world, but that doesn't mean people shouldn't camapign about local issues - fair play to them.

All the stuff about multinationals and hypermarket conspiracies is something else altogether, probably better suited to a David Icke web site, that threatens to devalue the real issue. It's like the campaign in our part of France against the THT power lines, that seemed to get hijacked by the anti-nuclear power and anti-nuclear waste lobbies, that diluted the real issues and the whole thing seems to have faded. That too had more relevant side issues concerning vested interests and certain maires.

If the people here can keep their focus and concentrate on the signs then I don't see that anybody, apart from those who may be profiting from the existence of illegal signs, can object. I am sure it is possible to have signs that are both useful and legal. It's when somebody who claims not to be anti-publicity comes up with phrases like 'general intoxication of minds and spirtits (sic)'; 'ban advertising from the town's entrances'; '...tries to save the French countryside from unscrupulous companies with vested interests'; ' Stalin manipulated public opinion in his fashion, so do the advertising barons'; 'The hoardings are 90% devoted to promoting hypermarchés... that are responsable (sic) for the fact that 30 000 French farmers give up farming each year' and so on, that other agendas seem to spring out of the woodwork.

These are not the fundamental issues, it's that illegally-sized and illegally-placed hoardings are being erected, and all the other stuff is, in my opinion, merely diverting interest in, and support for, the basic campaign.

Edit - PdeF's response beat me to it. I think if you had stuck to the point, you would still be here, and with rather more support.

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Can I just make a simple point, here?

I haven't been very interested in this thread, largely because I couldn't really understand what the OP was on about, mostly because his posts are very confusingly written and seem to mish-mash different ideas together. I really couldn't be bothered.

Will's post has clarified a lot of that for me, and his critique really reinforces what I had thought all along - that there are a number of agendas being pushed here, and advertising hoardings is just one. The rest I'm afraid I regard as a bit fringey. What I dislike is the apparent attempt to draw people in on one issue and then use their money and participation on others.

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[quote user="Will"]

It's when somebody who claims not to be anti-publicity comes up with phrases like 'general intoxication of minds and spirtits (sic)'; 'ban advertising from the town's entrances'; '...tries to save the French countryside from unscrupulous companies with vested interests'; ' Stalin manipulated public opinion in his fashion, so do the advertising barons'; 'The hoardings are 90% devoted to promoting hypermarchés... that are responsable (sic) for the fact that 30 000 French farmers give up farming each year' and so on, that other agendas seem to spring out of the woodwork.

< SNIP>

Edit - PdeF's response beat me to it. I think if you had stuck to the point, you would still be here, and with rather more support.

[/quote]

Yes. The organisation may be very worthwhile but to me, this is a case where the proponent may have damaged the cause by telling us far too much about his/her views in what I'd describe as verging on "rant" mode rather than sticking to the basic aims of the organisation.

Will - re the anti THT... I agree with you there too - it's unfortunate that the campaign has focussed on the anti-nuclear aspects of the project but - if I understood things correctly - it is a pragmatic decision to do so as what are dismissed as unsubstantiated health issues and the impact on a beautiful part of the countryside weren't considered sufficient to mobilise public opinion. My local association is very active and we regularly have email notifications of mini-manifs and meetings and there's still a fair amount of coverage in Manche Libre. The organisers are also awaiting the outcome of the election as that may have an impact on the project. The project still hasn't been signed off and won't be pre-election.

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There seems to be a confusion between the terms 'advertising and information' and 'free speech and libel' here.

You are right, there is confusion, but I'm afraid it is yours. This board belongs to a publisher, Archant, who have a Code of Conduct you must abide by when posting here (and by posting you agree to that)

You have already been informed that the mod team had concerns about your post being an advertisement and have been asked to contact admin for an exemption from this part of the Code of Conduct as you are a 'not for profit'. As yet the mod team have not been informed of any change or exemption, however we now have concerns that you are coming far too close to breaking other parts of the Code of Conduct. As you seemed to have not read it the first time I posted it again for your information.

Looking at the situation as a whole I am going to lock this thread.

PS Believe me - the moderators are not 'in a tizz' [:)]

 

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