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Low income living off of summer let and taxation. (Hello everyone)


tea4two
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[quote user="Debra"][quote user="idun"]I would say that in general we pay less in the UK for much of our everyday things, but there again, I left an expensive part of France, for a poor part of the UK. [/quote]

I disagree.  I believe you simply moved to a part of the UK where silly prices for everyday things wouldn't be tolerated!

[/quote]

I live within spitting distance of London. Yes, a part of the UK where "silly prices" are - well, not so much "tolerated" as "imposed".

Oddly, and probably not in keeping with the norm, we have houses in France and the UK which are almost identical in size, and only marginally more land in France. However, our local taxes (and our French house is in the back of beyond) are now more expensive in France. As for the rest, I find generally that things in France are more expensive, if I take the cost of living overall.  Even my car insurance is more expensive in France, and there I pay only for third party fire and theft, whereas my UK insurance is fully comp. My UK car is also newer and probably falls into a higher insurance band. I certainly get more value for money from my weekly shop in the UK than I do in France. And I don't buy processed food. I buy fresh vegetables and fruit, mostly white meat and fish. I also find in France that wherever I buy fruit and veg, they keep for a couple of days at best, whereas in the UK they stay fresher for longer. Now this may be because they are sold under-ripe, or because they are

treated with something to ensure they don't go off quickly, but the

result (for me) is that I waste considerably less fresh food in the UK. I can't afford to shop at markets around where I live, as the prices are eye watering and,  the quality is worse, if anything, than the supermarkets. And in France I simply don't eat bread unless I have guests.

However, I am sure that there are as many differing experiences as there are people on this forum, so each of us can only go by our own.

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We live full time in France, but your figures sound right to me Betty. We go back to the UK about four times a year with the car and we do lots of shopping. We make all our own bread and we find that the best and freshest fruit and veg are from Lidl, apart from our garden produce.
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Funny you should say that, EmilyA...I'm a fan of Lidl France's fruit and veg as well. I should probably also qualify my comment above: I can't afford market prices round where I live in France. I was recently at a loose end for about five hours in the vicinity of Borough Market in London - eye-wateringly trendy and supposedly very expensive, yet aside from the truffle-oils and organic cheeses and micro-brewery beers, the actual fruit and veg prices were not at all expensive compared to UK supermarket prices, and certainly cheaper than I've experienced on French markets.

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t42, I have also just re-read your first post and unfortunately it all comes down to your poor health, as moving to France at 43 unable to work is a non starter, due to the fact that you are not entitled to an S1, as you have not worked for over three years.

Therefore, without being able to join the French health care system and on the assumption you cannot obtain private health insurance due to existing medical conditions, you could risk financial ruin in France if you had to be hospitalised and could not meet the costs.
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[quote user="You can call me Betty"][quote user="Debra"][quote user="idun"]I would say that in general we pay less in the UK for much of our everyday things, but there again, I left an expensive part of France, for a poor part of the UK. [/quote]

I disagree.  I believe you simply moved to a part of the UK where silly prices for everyday things wouldn't be tolerated!

[/quote]

I live within spitting distance of London. Yes, a part of the UK where "silly prices" are - well, not so much "tolerated" as "imposed"..........

However, I am sure that there are as many differing experiences as there are people on this forum, so each of us can only go by our own.

[/quote]I used to live where you live too and you don't have to pay silly prices if you don't want to with the range of shops available now.  Are prices in Lidl (yes I buy their fruit and veg too) that different between North and South?  I don't know because Lidl wasn't around when I lived there and as far as I know there wasn't an Aldi or Netto either - shops which I didn't find until I moved up North and lived on a much more limited budget!  People mention them now though so I assume they have spread even to the 'affluent South East'.

We're in the same situation as you in that our houses in France and the UK are similarly sized (at least they are now we have opened up the top floor on the one in France) and if anything, our house in France has slightly less garden than the one in the UK.  Maybe that's because our house was also bought as a second home rather than a 'sell up everything and buy a bigger house with more land' type of purchase?  I may get a shock when I submit the form to let them know I've increased the living space by nearly 50% but I doubt it will double the taxes here.  In any case - I will still not have to pay tax d'habitation whilst living here, which is the key difference to the UK, where I had to pay it regardless because they count property as money in the bank which prevents you from receiving any discount on the council tax because of low income.

Apart from the taxes, I agree with your post.  It's been hard at times with the exchange rate changing so much after we came over but that's easing a bit now and in the same period we've also seen our UK mortgage payments drop significantly (though we still can't afford to pay more than interest only) so on balance we're still better off staying here, at least as long as our UK house is let.  I've spoken to people who've moved over recently though who've made it sound as if things have changed an awful lot while we've been away and everything is more expensive and more run down in Britain.  I don't really know because I've only been on flying visits to my brother in Godalming and I doubt that would give me a rounded view.  My Mum has been up to the North East a lot and says towns like Redcar and Middlesbrough have a closed down look about them and it makes her feel better off where she is.

Sprogster is right - it's the healthcare that will be the block for the OP.  If he gets some sort of invalidity benefit (whatever long term incapacity benefit has changed to) then that will still be transportable and give him an S1 but if not, he might be looking at either getting it via the 'refused full cover' route into the CMU or trying to claim AME and I don't know how that will go......might be worth keeping an eye on that situation for a while as the EU are still challenging the way France is handling things. 

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We have the choice, here, of anything from Waitrose/M&S to Lidl/Aldi...although my nearest Lidl is quite a hike away. I imagine that "people who have moved over recently" have to justify doing so, and may have witnessed areas becoming run down if they live in ones that are. With Slough to the left of me, Windsor to the right,  the former's town centre looks decidedly run down, whereas the latter is seeing newer, bigger, posher shops opening by the week. So, again, I guess it's a question of where you live and personal experience. I must admit, I tend to shop in Slough (Tesco as opposed to Windsor's Waitrose, Primark as opposed to Fenwick) because the parking is easier and I don't have to fight my way through the tourists. Oh, and because I'm not spending silly money.

Of course, prices in most of the major chains are the same nationwide...but that negates the import of your original statement to Idun that silly prices for everyday things wouldn't be tolerated. I think, in any case, that the internet has put paid to a lot of that.

Interestingly, I mentioned elsewhere that I was looking for a Johnny Hallyday t-shirt for my son as a tongue-in-cheek gift. Well, I found one on the internet. The T-shirt itself was reasonable, at €12 (although considerably more than I'd normally pay for a t-shirt). Postage, however, was more than half as much again at €6.49 - whether I have it delivered to the UK or France!!!! It's those sort of things that make even internet shopping in France a costly experience. I rarely buy anything over the internet in the UK that isn't free delivered, and certainly not where the delivery cost adds another 50% to the bill!!

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I've lived in Slough, Cippenham, Windsor and Old Windsor so I know what you mean.  When I used to work in Windsor town centre it was a crush getting anywhere at lunch time.  I did used to shop in Waitrose in Slough though (loved their coleslaw and never have found one as good!) as well as in M&S in Windsor for their food - not cheap but it was in the days before I had children and stopped work to be with them and money became more of something to watch!  Also, at the time, if you ran short at the end of the month - M&S was the only shop in which you could pay for food with a credit card and Waitrose was one of the first to allow it after that!  That shows you how long ago I lived there.....but I definitely don't remember seeing a Lidl, Aldi or Netto back then.  The last place I mainly shopped there was the Asda in Slough because my home office was on the Bath Road and it was easy to nip there at lunch time or on the way home (the later I tackled the traffic the quicker I got home to Old Windsor!).

Paying for stuff off the internet seems to have no rhyme nor reason sometimes.  For instance, my boys often look for games online because they prefer the English language versions.  We have to check amazon.fr, amazon.co.uk, ebay.fr and ebay.co.uk each time because it's anybody's guess which one will work out cheaper for the item + postage to France.  The latest one is coming from ebay.fr even though it's the same seller who had it on amazon.co.uk because it works out nearly a fiver cheaper, even though they have to pay postage.  Other times amazon.fr will be nearly double the price even with free postage - from the same seller.  I keep meaning to investigate other sources people have mentioned but as it's usually me who ends up doing all the checking once they've got the reference number they want, I'll just be adding to my workload!  Perhaps it's time to make them do it but I hate to think they'll be lazy and pay more than they need to.

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  • 2 weeks later...
Hi Everyone and thanks so much for the amazing amount of info.

Well I,ve been in France for 8 years, 6 months here and 6 in England. I always tow a trailer over full of gear and make the most of whats cheaper there for here (lots)and whats cheaper here for there( not much). Usually 2 ton of fire wood free from garden to heat the Eng house n water.

I like it the way it is, the nhs know what i do, they have never said there is a problem with my health care due to being away more than 3 months. and the EHIC has been ok although last year i had a 2k medical bill i sent in to france for reimbersment and got 130 euros back! should have sent to Eng apparently.

At some stage well have to sell here (Fr) as second home owners now have social charges to pay well move here for a year or so to stop the cgt on what will then be main res.

I see what people are saying about the health care cost and i think i would struggle to get insurance as i have not been able to get holiday insurance.

Basically I was hoping that by living here and my tax return showing less than my personal allowance and my income coming from renting my house I would not pay social charges, Habitation tax, or they would be heavily reduced as my income would be so low.

In Hindsight with me now being screwed and unable to support myself without living in a caravan at the bottom of the garden and renting the house. I would have bought a better house in England, suffered the rain, used the rent a room scheme for income and biodegraded in my chair.

I have a friend back in Blighty who's incapacited has been out of work for years, has no house or savings. sounds terrible BUT. he's got the latest gadgets, eats out, gets dental, has a warden controlled flat, pays no council tax,has a car supplied and has the equivalent of nearly £400 a week in rent, benefits etc... I've done it all wrong, im not bitter at all, just realizing all those years working hard wearing myself out paying the taxes. building up savings paying off the mortgages. And trying to keep my crumbling damp house going I could have been chilling out with my Giro watchin the world go by. Aaaaaaaaa Bisto! lol

. I still got my sence of humor, hey what do you mean there's a comedy tax for anyone with a smile payable on the 15th of January!!! It's in 3 bands, High, Mid and Low. The high band is for big earners, they are deemed to be the ones with the whitest teeth. The Low band is for those with no teeth. If you have dentures your in the high band as you are wealthy enough to have them. If at the time of assesment you remove your dentures in an attempt to delibretly defraud the smile tax office your assets will be siezed and you will be deported within 48hrs. Thanks everyone, much appreciated. Tony

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[quote user="tea4two"] I have a friend back in Blighty who's incapacited has been out of work for years, has no house or savings. sounds terrible BUT. he's got the latest gadgets, eats out, gets dental, has a warden controlled flat, pays no council tax,has a car supplied and has the equivalent of nearly £400 a week in rent, benefits etc...[/quote]

Would you gladly give up your 2 houses, your savings, your car, your health? Would you prefer to  live in a small flat, (no trips to France), be chronically in pain or somehow disabled and medically dependent, unable to do much at all, would that really make you feel better??? Would you swap lives with your friend??

I can't think that it's a great life, needing to live in a warden controlled flat, not have a house, no car, no savings, and be totally dependent on the state - I really can't see what there is to envy but maybe that's just me...

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Yes Gladly. I am cronically in pain, disabled, medicaly and support dependant, unable to do much m,ore than sit in this chair. He's an olyimpian compaired to me but because i have worked hard and paid taxes and stamps and now have some assets that i am unable to maintain. I cant get the means tested support and have to sell everything to fund myself till the money runs out. I,ve paid hundereds of thousands in tax. yes a warden controled flat with central heating and no damp would be fantastic, i could sit in the window and watch the world go by. Yes to someone well it might sound rubbish but if your not able to do much it gives a new perspective on whats important. when your ill everythings a struggle having it all done for you is a great help. Im not bitter at allgood luck to him. yeeee haaaa. theres another damp patch.
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