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clarification of social charges in early retirement


frenchdc
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Hi,

I am trying to calculate our social charges liability on a private company pension of 15000 euros but am a little confused with the exact rules as we currently pay reduced taxe d'habitation.

We are both under retirement age and we currently pay no income tax.

Is the csg 7.5% or 3.8% plus the crds of 0.5%?

Or do we pay nothing?

What figure is then deductable for tax the following year?

What are the social charges if I take a lump sum from my pension?

What are the social charges on uk savings interest?

so many questions!

fdc

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AFAIK whether you are liable for social charges on your pension income depends on how your healthcare is covered. In early retirement I would assume you do not have the S1 form, so would either have CMU-B or full private cover. If you have CMU-B then the charges on pension income is 8% total. The social charges on savings interest is 15.5%. I am sure someone will be along soon regarding the deductions.
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[quote user="frenchdc"]Hi,

I am trying to calculate our social charges liability on a private company pension of 15000 euros but am a little confused with the exact rules as we currently pay reduced taxe d'habitation.

We are both under retirement age and we currently pay no income tax.

Is the csg 7.5% or 3.8% plus the crds of 0.5%?

Or do we pay nothing?

What figure is then deductable for tax the following year?

What are the social charges if I take a lump sum from my pension?

What are the social charges on uk savings interest?

so many questions!

fdc[/quote]

Hi,

   If one of you is over 60 and your total net  taxable income for the year before last was less than the maximum for exemption from taxe d'habitation (16392€ for 2015) you are exempt on the pension .   Interest is subject to 15.5% CSG.

See here;http://droit-finances.commentcamarche.net/faq/5778-exoneration-de-csg-sur-les-revenus-modestes-plafond

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[quote user="parsnips"]

   If one of you is over 60 and your total net  taxable income for the year before last was less than the maximum for exemption from taxe d'habitation (16392€ for 2015) you are exempt on the pension .   I

[/quote]

I believe you intended to say "maximum allowing a reduction of taxe d'habitation", which I believe is 25130 euros for a married or pacsed couple.

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we are both under 60 but currently pay no tax but pay into the cmu so I think the csg rate is 3.8% plus 0.5% crds.

can somebody clarify and answer these questions

What figure is then deductable for tax the following year?

What are the social charges if I take a lump sum from my pension?

What are the social charges on uk savings interest?
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From how I understand from the thread on claiming back these charges I would think that given your ages and that you have not reached the statory retirement age and do not hold an S1 (meaning the UK is not paying for your healthcare) then it is the full amount (15.5% or there abouts) when it comes to social charges.

 

With regards to the pension it is my understanding and confirmed by my local Imports that you will pay 7.5% tax on the income although I am not sure what happens about the tax free lump sum under the UK system. What I do know is that I have taken my whole pension pot out of the UK, was charge 40% tax in the UK which I am within days of getting back in the form of a cheque from HMRC and will then have to pay 7.5% tax on in France. I do know how the UK work out the tax on the lump sum which is because I have no other income from the UK is multiplied by 52 because it was taken in one 'week' then tax and UK personal tax allowance applied. If you didn't claim back the tax then at the end of the year they will recalculate it bringing it back down to whatever tax band you would really fall in and you get a refund that way. However I am much better off paying the 7.5% in France and holding an S1 will not be paying social charges because of the reasons laid out in the other thread.

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Quillan

On pension income CSG is 6.6% and CRDS is 0.5% giving 7.1%. On interest income it is in total 15.5%. There is a reduced rate of social charges if your revenue de reference is below a certain threshold, tho i do not have details of that to hand.

All the above apply if you do not have a an S1.

OP

If you pay the reduced rate i do not know what is deductible from the following years income, but it will be shown on your avis d'impot.

rgdsJFB

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[quote user="nomoss"][quote user="parsnips"]

   If one of you is over 60 and your total net  taxable income for the year before last was less than the maximum for exemption from taxe d'habitation (16392€ for 2015) you are exempt on the pension .   I

[/quote]

I believe you intended to say "maximum allowing a reduction of taxe d'habitation", which I believe is 25130 euros for a married or pacsed couple.

[/quote]Hi,

             You are correct, I must not post in haste!

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[quote user="JohnFB"]Quillan
On pension income CSG is 6.6% and CRDS is 0.5% giving 7.1%. On interest income it is in total 15.5%. There is a reduced rate of social charges if your revenue de reference is below a certain threshold, tho i do not have details of that to hand.
All the above apply if you do not have a an S1.
OP
If you pay the reduced rate i do not know what is deductible from the following years income, but it will be shown on your avis d'impot.
rgdsJFB
[/quote]

 

I was under the impression, obviously incorrectly, that this was only true if you were at state retirement age and not if you retired early and did not have an S1. Once you reach state retirement age you then pay a reduced rate unless you have an S1 in which case you pay nothing because, in this case, your social contribution is paid by the UK and you can't pay twice. Bit like double taxation and why so many are claiming it back from the French government as per the other thread.

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Its not age relayed but on type of income. I am not at state retirement age yet but that is the rate I pay but only on pension income, other types of income are at 15.5%., even after 65. That's why the S1 exemption on investment income is so interesting  assuming they do not find a way of finessing it away as they are proposing for french expatriates by defining it as pension contributions.

JFB

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