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UK 20mph limits


Frederick
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It seems Portsmouth have indroduced a 20 mph limit to many of their roads and plan to spread it over the city....other  UK cities are to watch this with a view to setting 20 mph limits . The  reasoning is it will reduce the chance of serious injury....less speed  less chance of really hurting sombody in an accident ... you cant argue with that ...makes sense... why not 10mph ....you might get away with a bruise if run over....  that make more sense .....but ....Has anybody realised just how many extra hours a week on the road its going to mean to people like me  who have to spend their days driving round town visiting homes .

I give my  time voluntarily to  take people to  and from hospital apointments in my own car for which I get a petrol allowance .....If it means crawling about in 3rd gear terrified of going through a camera set at 25 ..and  they could  be as this will be a money spinner .....and...   watching the fuel guage dropping  as my car wont like doing 20 in top gear ... I shall be packing it in  and spending more time in France ..........Perhaps thats the idea... it will get people like me off the road ....then the NHS  will just have to find a gas gussleing ambulance with a well paid crew of  2  to take the  patients  I carry in .

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I first came across 30kph urban zones about ten years ago when touring in Germany.  Every town we came to, the residential side roads were signed with the lower limit.  Holland has had them for years. Seems the UK has finally woken up to the safety benefits.....

 

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[quote user="chris pp"]

Nope, I think it's to do with safety, there's absolutely no doubt that lives are saved when people, often children, are hit at lower speeds.

Chris

 

[/quote]

Well, OK, but here's a thought: if it REALLY is all about child road safety, why do they not bring back "Cycling Proficiency" and the "Tufty Club"? SURELY it's better not to have the kids hit at ANY speed? Or am I missing something?

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[quote user="chris pp"]

Nope, I think it's to do with safety, there's absolutely no doubt that lives are saved when people, often children, are hit at lower speeds.

Chris

 

[/quote]

How does this tally up on the environment issue chris? My basic understanding is slower speeds = higher levels of pollutants etc in the air, increased fuel usage due to the up and down nature of slower speeds, becomes a nightmare for asthma suffers as well i believe. Has a cost benefit analysis been done, or is this another element of the environmental fascism thats sweeping the country. Not a dig at anyone, just seems that you can do and say what you want in this country as long as you add an 'apparent' enviromental benefit on the end. Similar thing happening with the Madeline child. Apparently frankie dettori won the empsom derby for her on saturday...great.
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[quote user="Ford Anglia"][quote user="chris pp"]

Nope, I think it's to do with safety, there's absolutely no doubt that lives are saved when people, often children, are hit at lower speeds.

Chris

 

[/quote]

Well, OK, but here's a thought: if it REALLY is all about child road safety, why do they not bring back "Cycling Proficiency" and the "Tufty Club"? SURELY it's better not to have the kids hit at ANY speed? Or am I missing something?

[/quote]

Yes you are missing something. Money!! It has got little to do with safety. Bring in a lower limit, stick a camera up, grab some money, put another camera up. People have been duped into believing every life can be saved..it cannot!! however, you can keepm taking money from people on the assumption it can...
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Chief: my thoughts were as yours, but I've been pilloried on here before for suggesting that sppeding enforcement is about revenue.

However, there may be hope for this site yet. Some of the very aggressive posters are conpicuous by their absence, before I went away at Whit we had a reasoned argument on speed-related issues, and now I'm back I see someone posted a clip from the Daily Mail, (Shock! Horror!) and NO-ONE pilloried them. Some people even agreed with it. Yet three weeks ago I was accused of being a Daily Mail reader as if that were the worst insult imaginable. Go figure.

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How can speed restrictions be revenue raising,  is it in the same way that making theft illegal is designed to fill the courts and the prisons and spend money?

Come on, I haven't had a speeding fine in 40 odd years, lucky maybe or .....

From an environmental perspective I  gather that these zones are usually placed in residential areas or near schools where there should be little through traffic, so it should be people coming and going from their homes and saving lives in this instance should be a priority, of course less vehicle use would be a real environmental winner.

Chris

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[quote user="chris pp"]

How can speed restrictions be revenue raising,  is it in the same way that making theft illegal is designed to fill the courts and the prisons and spend money?[/quote]

Nope, those laws protect people from crimes that WILL affect them. Speeding laws protect from crimes that MIGHT hurt someone, and are arbitrary, so no problem for the local Scamera partnershiop to put in an unrealistic limit and a nice camera to enforce it. A bit like the raodworks in the UK, with 50mph, or even 40mph limits on them "to protect the workforce", but enfoced 24/7, with no evidence of ANY workforce at the majority of sites outside normal working hours.

Come on, I haven't had a speeding fine in 40 odd years, lucky maybe or .....

[quote user="chris pp"]From an environmental perspective I  gather that these zones are usually placed in residential areas or near schools where there should be little through traffic, so it should be people coming and going from their homes and saving lives in this instance should be a priority, of course less vehicle use would be a real environmental winner.

Chris

[/quote]

Would that they were all like that. Unforunately, our local authority has chosen the only 20mph limit in town to be on a relatively busy through street, linking one end of town to another, since they cut the access to the High St.

And then they sold the land earmarked for a bypass at the south end of town, for housing, ( FAR more income, don't y'know?), and shelved the bypass, which would have taken HUNDREDS of  44 tonne lorries a day off the road that passes a local school........Road safety? Give me a break.

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We have had the "speeding" thread before, it's simple, if there is a speed limit that is the maximum speed that you can legally drive at, then it becomes your choice, but the law is the law, if people didn't break the speed limit there would be no revenue (as you put it), so it's not a "tax" on breathing which we have to do.

If you don't agree with a law, campaign to have it changed, personally I have no problem with it. I also don't live in the UK but the same is happening in France.

Chris

 

 

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[quote user="chris pp"]

 it's simple, if there is a speed limit that is the maximum speed that you can legally drive at, then it becomes your choice, but the law is the law, if people didn't break the speed limit there would be no revenue (as you put it), so it's not a "tax" on breathing which we have to do.

If you don't agree with a law, campaign to have it changed,

 

[/quote]

Agree totally, CPP.

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[quote user="Frederick"]

...If it means crawling about in 3rd gear terrified of going through a camera set at 25 ..and  they could  be as this will be a money spinner .....and...   watching the fuel guage dropping  as my car wont like doing 20 in top gear ... I shall be packing it in  and spending more time in France ..........[/quote]

 

I was caught speeding. I went on a seminar in lieu of points. One memorable point from the lesson. 'A modern car is NOT designed to be happy or optimum in 4th gear at 30mph... so in 30 mph limit drop to 3rd.'.

 

 

 

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[quote user="Frederick"]

It seems Portsmouth have indroduced a 20 mph limit to many of their roads and plan to spread it over the city....other  UK cities are to watch this with a view to setting 20 mph limits . The  reasoning is it will reduce the chance of serious injury....less speed  less chance of really hurting sombody in an accident ... you cant argue with that ...makes sense... why not 10mph ....you might get away with a bruise if run over....  that make more sense .....but ....Has anybody realised just how many extra hours a week on the road its going to mean to people like me  who have to spend their days driving round town visiting homes .

[/quote]

 

Can we really calculate the amount you or anyone will be 'delayed'. The areas this will affect will be relatively small pockets not dual carriageways etc. For example I regularly witness cars hurtling down a road near me which has a 'stop' point at a T junction at the bottom. Perhaps a half  kilometer from the 50 mph limit to the stop point, and half a kilometer from there to the other end of the village (another T junction). Even assuming there is no traffic or other reason like a pedestrian to slow you down just what is the ACTUAL time difference over half kilometer run?

Route A Start speed 50mph , end speed zero. Length 0.5 kilometre. Max burst speed either a) 20mph, b) 30mph c) 50 mph cos no-ones checking anyway

Route B Start speed zero, End Speed zero (another T Junction). Max burst speed either a) 20mph, b) 30mph c) 50 mph cos no-ones checking anyway

 

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