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Gordon Brown with Andrew Marr this morning.


Russethouse
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Did any one see it ?

When he turned to Martin Sheen, who had just said that he was good friends with David Morrisy (Martin Sheen has played Blair, Morrisy has played Gordon Brown) and said yes, good friends just like me and Tony, I had a coffee over keyboard moment! [:)]

Apart from that moment of levity, did anyone have a view about his comments re Israel and Palenstine or the financial situation ?

 

 

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I did smile when Andrew Marr suggested that the UK was heading for a Trillion Pounds worth of debt.

Dear Gorgons response was classic, as in.............."yes but there are many countries in a worse position than us" [:-))]

Oh, thats alright then!

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When is Gordon Brown going to realise that we know for years we have been fed nothing but bull sh1t by him and Tony Blair over everything their governement has touched since they came to power ..Nothing works properly immigration. health. education .Policeing you name it ..one cock up after ..they even had to fiddle starting a war....The sooner they just foxtrot oscar the better .........rant over !
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[quote user="tegwini"]

Shame it wasn't Jeremy Paxman - Andrew Marr is a lightweight, & perhaps a Labour supporter ?

Tegwini

[/quote]

Like Dick Smith, I don't consider Marr a lightweight.  Just has a different style from Paxman, that's all.

And anyway, I understand that Paxman supports Labour.

Not wishing to argue with you, Tegs, just wanted to respond to your post!

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Interesting that no one has yet mentioned the Israel / Gaza situation....

I'm horrified that Israel has gone to Gaza and Mr Bush has sunk so low in my estimation that there is nowhere else to go.....on the other hand Mr RH thinks that Israel had no choice....( a little chill there at present [Www] )

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Wasn't Blair meant to be doing something in the middle east? Have I blinked and missed it? Brown was a bit off when he said the tunnels into Gaza should shut, I know thats how the arms get in but also food , medication and fuel what are they to do? Only 2 weeks before Bush goes, maybe a light at the end of the Tunnel (excuse the pun)
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As both sides have proved since the 1940's that they are not capable of living togtether on the same part of this earth without killing each other then perhaps the time has come to keep them apart....The UN should put troops into both sides force them to disarm and police the area If they have to be there for years while the hatered is bred out of both sides then so be it ...
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Dick,

It's hard to actually know how someone votes, but  he started as a Socialist, is a fellow Scot, is married to a Guardian journalist, the daughter of a Labour peer-  all reasons for him to have given GB an easy ride.  

He was once a member of the socialist group Socialist Campaign for a Labour Victory and reportedly a seller of its newspaper Socialist Organiser while at Cambridge, where he acquired the sobriquet of 'Red Andy' (quoted from Wikipedia, which I realise isn't always accurate, but membership of a group does say something).

Paxman would have been a tougher interviewer, and again it's hard to know how someone votes.    The BBC is in my opinion often biased towards the left wing of the political spectrum.

Regards

Tegwini

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RH

I am certainly with Mr RH on Israel & Gaza - The Israelis have no choice.  And, we get the BBC's bias which says little on who started this conflict.  Hamas makes clear daily that they want to remove the tiny Jewish state off the map. They are surrounded by huge nations & peoples who do not want peace with them, & who have attacked them many times since 1948.    They were attacked in  1948, 1956, 1967, 1973, 1982  plus numerous smaller scale attacks since then. 

I can relate to their commitment   -  'never again'!

Sorry RH for more chill.

Tegwini

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Palestine was taken by force. Palestinian villages were emptied by force. Palestinian land was taken by force. Israel has expanded itself by force and refuses to return the extra land it has stolen by force. It has treated the Palestinians worse than dogs, forcing them to spend their lives for a couple of generations in camps, for which read concentration camps, such as Ramallah and Gaza. It feels free to kill Palestinians as and when it sees fit.

Israel is maintained by subsidies from the US and US arms because the US government supports Israel come hell or high water. But it earned itself the enmity of the Arab nation for hundreds of years to come with its stupidity. 

Little wonder that the Palestinian people have taken up arms with the support of their neighbours who also feared for their own frontiers with the expansionist Zionist state baying for more and more land. And little wonder that they have turned to and been taken over by extremists whose agenda is the spread of militant Islam and for whom the Palestinians matter little, in fact.

The US has to be even handed in its dealings with both sides and force Israel to return the occupied Westbank and Golan. And to be willing to force it to make peace with its neighbours, but also to accept in the very long term that unless this happens and fast, there will be eternal conflict in the region leading, ultimately to the destruction of Israel, probably after a nuclear war.

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Perhaps Israel could be moved to a new state in the USA? Centres of religion seem to have moved around over centuries without any major problems. I've often wondered at the logic of founding a Jewish State in the middle of the Arab world. I do remember rather a lot of British soldiers getting killed and booby trapped there not that many years ago.

Regards.

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[quote user="Gastines"]

Perhaps Israel could be moved to a new state in the USA? Centres of religion seem to have moved around over centuries without any major problems. I've often wondered at the logic of founding a Jewish State in the middle of the Arab world. I do remember rather a lot of British soldiers getting killed and booby trapped there not that many years ago.

Regards.

[/quote]

The simple answer to that is Jerusalem.  The Israelis will never give up Jerusalem...and, as it's the second most holy place to moslems, the conflict is inevitable. 

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Hi Wooley

Clearly something you feel strongly about?

BUT - in 1948 the UN mandate of Palestine ended & Israel was established on a tiny bit of land.   Right or wrong it is debateable, but the UN, founded by the victors after WW2 decided the Jews needed a homeland, something the Jews had been campaigning for since WW1 and before.

Palestinian land taken eg.  the West Bank was taken after a war (Jordan also took over part of Palestine, but few realise this)  In 1967 Israel was invaded by Egypt, Syria & Jordan who were rapidly  defeated, and Israel as the victor took over the Sinai, Golan Heights & Gaza from their enemies and essential for protection.   In fact, most of this has been handed back, and in spite of massive opposition from Israeli settlers.  Gaza is independent of Israel, and perhaps is not a happy place to live, but the people voted in Hamas knowing what Hamas stood for.   

 I cannot understand how you can call the refugee camps concentration camps Wooley, but what that means to us now.  And, strange that the war mongering states of Egypt, Syria & etc have made little effort to improve the lot of the refugees. Or, how you can be a refugee for 40 odd years. I don't think the Palestinians are at treated like "dogs" quoting Wooley - perhaps that's the status of females in that part of the world?? Didn't a terrorist leader and his  3/4 wives die last week in this conflict?

Yes the US does help Israel, and so do Jews from all around the world.  But Israel is a rare outpost of democracy, literacy, longivity and good living standards.   US help was part of the 'Cold war' strategy, but now perhaps people see future conflicts, danger and terrorism coming from a different origin these days.

I used to have  more moderate views on the Middle East before September 2001, and  this changed also because of the changes that are taking place in my birthplace (England), but now really do support the underdog, the little beseiged country of Israel-  perhaps that's a 'British thing' too.

Regards

Tegwini

 

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