It could only be the UK tax office

[mint]

Have been ringing the UK tax office, off and on, for a few days and have also tried the number that Cheminot posted here.  Phone would ring and ring, you're put on hold, a message comes through giving you the website, same voice comes back, telling you your phone call will be answered as soon as possible.  Phone rings some more, message comes through............yes, yes, you all know what I'm talking about.

I filled in a self-assessment form (2 actually), claiming tax paid on deposit accounts.  One lot was credited to my account but, the BIGGER claim came back with a letter to say that I hadn't filled in the supplementary residence form and giving me a phone number to ring or the tax website.

 Well..............wouldn't it have been helpful if they'd just given me a reference number (SA dah dah dah) or heaven forfend, actually sent me the damned form?  No, no, that would make it too simple for the poor old tax payer.

To cut a long story short, I actually managed to get through to a real person, told her I had a formal complaint, put on hold (what else?) whilst she got on to a "higher authority".

Would you like us to send you the form?  Yes, of course, but why didn't you send it in the first place?  Well, we don't have a stock of these forms on hand.  Well, why couldn't you have quoted the reference number on the form so that I could have printed it out?

If you'd gone to the website, you would have found the form.  I DID go to the website and I had no idea what form you were talking about as it wasn't immediately obvious what form you wanted?

BTW, I'd filled in all residency forms and you yourselves have acknowledged that I was fiscally resident in France because, look, you actually refunded me some money?

Dead silence, then, we will send you out the form!  OK, how long will it take?  We will send it TODAY and you will get it in 2 to 3 weeks.

At that point, I hung up as I didn't think I could take any more and I went to pour myself an extra large whisky in order to calm my nerves.

Anyone has any experience like mine?

[andyh4]

Oh yes.

 

dispite not having lived in the UK forso long that I can no longer vote there, HMRC send me a tax form to fill out on an irregular basis.  Each time it arrives it is in a totally new format to the one before.  They never send any of the explanatory notes that you are supposed to consult when filling out the form but always send the form out so late that you have to reply within 2-3 weeks.  I always send a covering letter explaining my intentions and what I have posted where and explaining that without the accompanying instructions I cannot be certain that I have correctly posted data as intended by them.  Consequently when I fill it out wrong:

1.  It is my fault

2.  They always seem to find some new form that I should have filled out  instead of the ones I have actually filled out.

3.  they return all of the forms - including those ones correctly filled out - so that I can fill out 1 A4 sheet and pay another 5€ postage to return it.

4.  The new form inevitably arrives without the necessary instructions!![6]

 

OH, who is still legally tax resident in the UK, had the devils own job making them understand that interest earned on foreign joint accounts had already been declared and taxed in Germany, declared in France (but not taxed) and was only being declared in the UK because they had asked and should not be taxed there.  They eventually gave up when they asked for full details of every account including all gains.  Given that our European accounts incur only charges and no interest we offset them and told them they owed us money. 

[Patf]

Your last point, SW17 , about the time it takes to receive their forms etc:

When I was corresponding with them over reclaiming tax I noticed that the date on their letters was always about a month before I received them. The reason I don't know - perhaps these letters have to be checked by other clerks in the heirarchy?

Otherwise, perhaps it's their policy to sit on letters for a few weeks before popping them in the letter box .[blink]

[HoneySuckleDreams]

I once got a tax letter telling me how much interest I owed them for non payment of tax, which was news to me! and the next day I got the letter saying how much tax I owed...dated 2 months prior! (it eventually turned out that they owed me).

I think they do have a laugh now and again as how else would they fill their days?

[mint]

[quote user="andyh4"]

Oh yes.

 

dispite not having lived in the UK forso long that I can no longer vote there, HMRC send me a tax form to fill out on an irregular basis.  Each time it arrives it is in a totally new format to the one before.  They never send any of the explanatory notes that you are supposed to consult when filling out the form but always send the form out so late that you have to reply within 2-3 weeks.  I always send a covering letter explaining my intentions and what I have posted where and explaining that without the accompanying instructions I cannot be certain that I have correctly posted data as intended by them.  Consequently when I fill it out wrong:

1.  It is my fault

2.  They always seem to find some new form that I should have filled out  instead of the ones I have actually filled out.

3.  they return all of the forms - including those ones correctly filled out - so that I can fill out 1 A4 sheet and pay another 5€ postage to return it.

4.  The new form inevitably arrives without the necessary instructions!![6]

 

[/quote]

How I thought about you today and how I agreed with everything you have written, particularly the highlighted bit of your post.

So, the "Residence, remittance basis etc" has arrived (yes, the name of the form is as I have written it here![+o(]

I made time this morning to fill it out and thought, in my simple way, that I'd then whip it down to la Poste this afternoon.  But, as andyh4 could have told me, I cannot fill it in without knowing what the Code for France is.

It's a 3-number code and I am sure one of you informed ones would know.  Therefore, please give me the Code for France to enable me to complete the damn form.

I am very strapped for cash and the 3 grand they owe me would come in very handy.....

Thank you, compassionate souls (I'm sure there are many of you out there!)

[Pierre ZFP]

I found the instructions for filling the form in!

http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/cnr/hmrc6.pdf

not forgetting the extra notes here

http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/worksheets/sa109-notes.pdf

and here is the magic document with the codes (see page 21)

http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/worksheets/sa106-notes.pdf

The code for France is FRA

(which for some reason is not the iso standard country code which is FR)

Why make things easy eh?

[Rose (& Greyman)]

It's FRA sweet17.

Don't start me commenting on HMRC 'service'. I'm an accountant who has to deal with them regularly. I believe they've been taking lessons in incompetance from RSI.

[mint]

Pierre and greyman, thank you from the bottom of my heart![kiss][kiss]

So very kind of you both to reply....

[AnOther]

Sweets, different facet of HMRC but same syndrome http://www.completefrance.com/cs/forums/2211789/ShowPost.aspx

From this and my past dealings with HMRC I would say that unless they are sending stuff by 3 legged blind donkey it seems pretty clear that when thay say that something has been 'issued' what they really means is that person 'A' has finally taken it off their pile and dealt with it from whence it goes to person 'B'  to take it's due place at the bottom of their pile awaiting an envelope and placing in a bag for collection.

Perhaps 'elf & safety prohibits person 'A' from folding a piece of paper and putting it in an envelope, or possibly they don't have an NVQ in that particular highly specilised skill !

[mint]

You know, Erns, what I would love to be done to the tax lot is to send in troops and threaten to sue them individually unless they get through their "pile" of work in a reasonable time-span.  You know, like the Spanish govt did to the unofficial strikers in air traffic control!

Alas, the UK govt is now all namby-pamby, coalition-minded, love-us-we're-the-Dave-and-Nick-Show.....gggrrrrggghhhh!!!!!!!!!!

How are you, Erns, and is it Christmas dinner with all the trimmings on the North Sea or Christmas dinner with all the trimmings with Mrs Bluecat?[:D][:P]

[AnOther]

Either that or sack the bl00dy lot and give their jobs to some of the burgeoning hoards of swindled uni graduates who would give their right arm for a job - and probably make a better fist of it to.

I'm fine and thanks for asking. Home for crimble and New Year but not due off until the 22nd so hoping that the weather doesn't turn on me.

Don't know about all the trimmings, just the two of us this year and personally I'm perfectly happy with a cosy fire, some bread and cheese, and a bottle, but doubtless Mrs bluecat won't leave it at that [:)]

[Judith]

[quote user="greyman"]It's FRA sweet17.

Don't start me commenting on HMRC 'service'. I'm an accountant who has to deal with them regularly. I believe they've been taking lessons in incompetance from RSI.

[/quote]

My father, long retired, but also an accountant, can tell many a story of the HMRC incompetence, he used to love writing long letters to tax inspectors, proving that they were wrong (but not saying so, of course!).  His prize is a letter from a tax inspector admitting he (the tam inspector!) got it wrong!

Somehow, I don't think it's changed much - they've sent me a form to fill in which I filled in last year, and you are supposed to only need to fill it in once..... I'm waiting for courage to phone them... yet again.

[AnOther]

OK peeps, on a scale of  1 to 10 what would you rate the chances of a satisfactory outcome from HMRC's own complaints procedures ?

http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/factsheets/complaints-factsheet.pdf

[Gardian]

I have to say that my experience of the Inland Revenue (as it used to be known) was entirely positive.

I can remember being able to ring whichever office my employer was linked to and being able to have a quick and decisive conversation with somebody: problem solved, one way or the other & the updated notice arriving within a week or so.

That was 7 years + ago.

It had changed by the time we moved over here and our R51 (?) lark took a year or so to come through. I can remember speaking to somebody who said that their staff numbers had been decimated. It's not just a big problem for the 'customers' of HMRC, it must be very demoralising for the staff, who know that things are simply not right. 

[andyh4]

[quote user="AnOther"]

OK peeps, on a scale of  1 to 10 what would you rate the chances of a satisfactory outcome from HMRC's own complaints procedures ?

http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/factsheets/complaints-factsheet.pdf

[/quote]

if the minimum I can use is 1, then 1. I used it and did not even receive an acknowledgement. Did not bother to follow up since we have enough dead donkeys here to flog.

EDIT: why id thw quote is such a mess Archant?

[Albert the InfoGipsy]

[quote user="andyh4"] EDIT: why id thw quote is such a mess Archant?[/quote]

What browser are you using? That looks like Safari, probably on a Mac.

Funnily enough, Sometimes when I view your post it looks OK and others it's garbled. Can't pin down why.

EDIT: I know it's for another system, but the problem is probably as described here:

http://codex.wordpress.org/Writing_Code_in_Your_Posts

The automated code writing in some browsers (e.g. Safari) use different codes that the Archant software probably doesn't recognise.

If you view the source, your post starts off:   &lt;BLOCKQUOTE&gt;  and others (that display normally) start with <P><BLOCKQUOTE>

Try using Firefox, if you aren't already. Hope this helps.

[AnOther]

My other experiences with other departments have been better. Queries on PAYE coding for instance have been dealt with quickly and efficiently but the CNR have definitely got worse in the 4 years I've been dealing with them.

My initial E106 in 2007 was produced in about 3 weeks but subsequent annual renewals have got progresively more tardy to the point where my current application, which was submitted on Aug 8th, has yet to appear some 4 months later.

I don't think HMRC understand the potential consequences of these sort of delays which, in extreme circumstances where a recipient perhaps could not afford to fund their own medicine/treatment in the interim, could result in a serious escalation of a condition or even death !

[Rose (& Greyman)]

[quote user="AnOther"]

OK peeps, on a scale of  1 to 10 what would you rate the chances of a satisfactory outcome from HMRC's own complaints procedures ?

http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/factsheets/complaints-factsheet.pdf

[/quote]

Be sure to clearly mark the outside of the envelope and in large bold type just above the Dear Sir on the letter COMPLAINT.

Otherwise the post openers will shuttle your letter off to some outlying department to be dealt with at leisure. They do take complaint letters slightly more seriously.

[zarathustra]

Fortunately my experience was quite positive. When I left the UK I was due a rebate of a few thousand pounds and they got it back to me at once. A few months later I did get a note from them about the following tax year, so had to contact them and remind them that they had all the necessary forms and details about my leaving the country. They sent a quick letter of apology and confirmation that I wouldn't have anything to pay next year.

[andyh4]

[quote user="Albert the InfoGipsy"]

[quote user="andyh4"] EDIT: why id thw quote is such a mess Archant?[/quote]

What browser are you using? That looks like Safari, probably on a Mac.

Funnily enough, Sometimes when I view your post it looks OK and others it's garbled. Can't pin down why.

EDIT: I know it's for another system, but the problem is probably as described here:

http://codex.wordpress.org/Writing_Code_in_Your_Posts

The automated code writing in some browsers (e.g. Safari) use different codes that the Archant software probably doesn't recognise.

If you view the source, your post starts off:   <BLOCKQUOTE>  and others (that display normally) start with <P><BLOCKQUOTE>

Try using Firefox, if you aren't already. Hope this helps.

[/quote] Not Safari - plain old IE.

[Albert the InfoGipsy]

Andy,

Have you turned on Compatability View, or tried adjusting its settings? It's in the Tools menu.

[Quillan]

Actually its more simple than that it to the right and next to where the URL of the website you are visiting is displayed, looks like a page torn in half horizontally.

[andyh4]

[quote user="Albert the InfoGipsy"]

Andy,

Have you turned on Compatability View, or tried adjusting its settings? It's in the Tools menu.

[/quote]

 

Not changed a thing - and the second quote has worked perfectly.

[Pierre ZFP]

[quote user="Quillan"] looks like a page torn in half horizontally.[/quote]

Ah but is the page half-torn or half-intact? [:P]

[Albert the InfoGipsy]

I can't account for it. In this thread you've got one graunched post and the rest are OK. It needs someone with more web/HTML knowledge than mine to sort it out. Of course, the Forum software is generally agreed to be <polite> slightly odd </polite>.