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Hi folks - I would appreciate your honest apparaisal of our plans - we are taking early retirement next year ( I'll be 55 and hubby will be 60 ) - we'll have a combined private annual pension of around £18,000 and a total cash pot of around £300,000 to fund the purchase of our house plus fees, settling in expenses and any unexpected emergencies etc  , hubby had a heart attack 5 years ago and is on daily medication but is otherwise very fit and I'm as fit as a flea ( thinking about private medical insurance here ) - we would not plan to have to find  any paid employment.

I speak fluent French ( I'm half French )  but hubby does not  although he is a willing learner ! - I have relatives already in Provence , the Auvergne  as well as very good friends currently in the Mayenne and we love the Lot and the Loire regions so any of these areas would be considered

Our current lifestyle is an active rural one in that we have a smallholding  and also breed train and show our dogs -and this is the kind of lifestyle we would like to continue - we would be looking to either buy a plot of land ( no less than 2 acres )  and build or buy something already in excellent condition - we do NOT want to do up a French ruin. - our DIY skills being restricted to holding a paint brush at best !!

Are our plans practical - especially the amount we would have to live on ? - I'd really appeciate an unbiased opinion from those that have already made the move

 

many thanks

 

Yvonne

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Hello Yvonne,

I suppose it's always going to come down to a personal decision about what you do, but I would think that if your outline of funds is what you would have to live on in the UK then its probably only going to cost you a very similar amount to live in France on a daily basis (apart from your outlay for some extra health insurance).

Your abiliity to speak fluent French is always going to be a bonus and from my perspective is really a must (I'm still struggling)

Of course from my point of view the "lifestyle" in France is so much better than the time I spend in the UK.

I find myself much more realaxed, happier and more content than I do in the UK, but currently can't afford to live there all year, I spend most of my time in the UK having to work in order to fund our long trips to France, but we do usually stay for our permitted periods each year if we can

We hope to get our B&B off the ground next year so will then become resident in France................lots of praying and finance juggling !!!!!

So from my point of view, if I was in your position with a guarenteed income and money to buy your "dream house" would definately bite the bullet and do it right now.

You only live once so go for your dream I say.

Others may be able to offer you an alternative point of view.

Good luck in whatever you do, I wish you all the best.

Regards Mel.
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I'll kick off on the health side because this is the absolutely fundamental make or break issue which will dictate everything else.

Research the private insurance aspect very very thoroughly now because getting private

cover with pre-existing conditions ranges between very difficult and impossible and you cannot legitimately reside, or remain resident, in France without adequate health cover. The very worst scenario would be to discover, only when your E106 runs out, that you cannot get cover and are forced to sell up and move back to UK.

Assuming you can secure private cover when the time comes if you time your retirement and departure for the

latter half of next year you should be able to get up to 2.5 years out

of an E106 saving you money on private insurance by reducing the time

for which you would have to pay privately to as little as maybe 2 years. Whatever you do please do not be tempted to go the 'pop back to UK for treatment' route as some may suggest to you. EDIT: No one here will BTW !

As to the move itself, if you do make it, I think there is little doubt that with your financial resources you could certainly make a very good go of it but I'd caution against making the same mistake that many do which is jumping in the deep end ploughing all your capital into a property. Whilst it might be a compromise on your ideal if you are flexible on location you should be able to find a suitable property for 1/2 of your £300k leaving you a very comfortable safety buffer so I would set your budget at that - and try to stick to it.

Nobody has any accurate numbers to quote but annecdotally it's alleged that something like 50% of emigrees end up going back within 5 years and from my own experience of coming up to 3 years that number seems not too far off the mark so without being unduly negative or pessimistic I think it would be wise to leave yourself an exit strategy.

After you have bought I would also tuck your remaining capital safely away somewhere and try to live principally on income, spare money can have a habit of dribbling away almost unnoticed until you suddenly realise you've run out, often just around the time the doubts start to set in.

Your speaking French is a huge bonus point and whilst you can teach an old dog new tricks as keen and willing as your OH might be learning a language at 60 can be very challenging and very hard work, I am approaching 60 and I'm not ashamed to admit that it is for me although a big part of my problem is that I still return to UK to work for 2 weeks out of every 5 so am not here full time which is what I need. Some of course have a natural gift for languages and fall straight into it but I think they are very much in the minority. If your OH has it you'll already know it, or certainly will in the first 3 months!

Hope some of this helps and bonne chance [;-)]

PS: Ignore Norman, you'll get used to him if you stick around [:D][:D][:D]

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What an exciting project, Yvonne!.  I can't comment on the health or financial aspects you post as I've been here a long time, am in the 'system' and have modest income and lifestyle.  However, in your boots, when choosing a house, I'd be inclined to build an ecohouse on a plot that you have chosen. Old houses are charming, with lots of character but bring with them their own  possible problems - drafts, damp, difficult to insulate. My brother in Tasmania built an eco-home to his own design out of straw bales and it it fabulous.  In addition, his bills are next to nothing.
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As we happily travel between homes in both countries and plan to continue to do so, I'm not best placed to advise you. But I'll give my views anyway. With your level of income, if you'd have a standard of living you'd be comfortable with in UK, you should be fine in France.

However, AnOther has gone to the main problem, and what he's said makes excellent sense. Health cover will be the key, and it's not going to be cheap. Arranging matters so that the time for which cover will be needed is key. I don't know what cover will be available for your OH, but others will point you in the right direction.

Other thoughts; yes, the Auvergne is cheaper than some areas, and it's an area I love, but I would suggest you look at places not too far from main services, and remember that the parts of the Auvergne can be bleak in winter. As we age, many of us feel the need to be near a doctor, not too far from a hospital, and getting in the car for milk or something else vital that you've forgotten isn't a good idea. A rural lifestyle is great, but try to look ahead to getting older (hopefully a lot older!) and plan with that in mind.

Bearing in mind all that's happened in finance recently, remember that savings can seem to evaporate; so many people have had to return to UK because of  lack of money; very few could imagine the problems with sterling. Others are having a very tough time, as pensions have reduced so much. I'd also suggest that whatever type of house you go for you should plan to insulate it well.

There's also a very interesting current thread on dentists, opticians etc.

I wish you all the very best in whatever you decide.  [:D]

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What the others have said... (including Norman - don't ignore him, he talks good sense but some don't like the straightforward way he puts things).

I too would recommend that you don't blow all your budget on a fancy house in France. Keep a foothold in Britain if at all possible - you could easily keep a rentable property there as well as buy a reasonable place in France, at least if you avoid certain hot spots. Not only will this give you some extra income, but if it doesn't work out you will be able to return and be able to live, mortgage-free, until the French house sells - when you can go up-market once again. A lot of people are very happy in France and don't regret the move but some who, for example, think the rural lifestyle will suit them, then find it doesn't, have come seriously unstuck.

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As far as the health aspects go, you may be OK if by being half French, you hold dual citizenship.  With a French passport you may find you can both access CMU.  I don't know this for a fact but it is the route which I would explore in your shoes.  Otherwise do beware as ANO says.  For more info' on this subject, do have a look at our website - link below.  On the face of it at least, new regulations make it virtually impossible for a non-French EU citizen to retire early to France if they have even a minor health problem which prevents them from getting full private cover - so talk to a French (or France-savvy) private insurer (preferably several) before you move, to ensure that the cover they are selling you fully complies with the French regulations (copy on our website.)  Private cover for two people could say goodbye to around 4-5,000 a year for up to five years for somebody with health problems - even if you can get cover at all - so do add that figure to your budget.

I agree with Will.  Even if you intend to burn all your UK boats, I would not spend all my money on a house here as nearly everybody finds something wrong which needs to be repaired or changed and it always costs a lot more than you expect if you've been in Britain for a long time - costs here (even for DIY) are very high in comparison, in my experience.  But with that amount of money you should even be able to leave yourself enough for a British bolt-hole, as Well suggests.

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[quote user="Will"]What the others have said... (including Norman - don't ignore him, he talks good sense but some don't like the straightforward way he puts things).[/quote]Agreed, it was a tounge in cheek comment [Www]

Coops, missed that very valid point about being 1/2 French, could be an invaluable valuable asset if it pans out.

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I agree to a certain extent with GG; the bit about growing older and needing to be near hospitals, etc.  That is clearly the commonsense view.  It was mine for a while but, having said that, I so adore the isolation of the countryside in France that I am more than prepared to live in the middle of nowhere as that is where I am happiest.

With your plan for the type of lifestyle you describe, you will be in a rural area, I suppose but of course the road network in France is absolutely fantastic so I don't think you need be cut off, unless that's what you want.

If I subscribe to what others have told us, for example, that my OH was really too elderly to relocate (he's 79 and we came here when he was 76), we'd still be in the UK and chances are, he'd still be doing some work professionally.  However, it was my intention to prise him from work and now he loves it here.

We are planning on moving to another part of France soon, so I don't agree that you always need to look to "when you get older".  As for you, you have what, 30 plus years more perhaps which is a lot of years to enjoy what you have so carefully planned for yourselves.

Go for it, Girl!  Think about it and THEN make it happen!  My new motto is "All results originate with a single thought".

Good Luck!

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Hello

All things taken into account, as the OP has stated an annual income of 18k is this realy considered more than adequate to live on in retirement or is the assumption being made that a good deal of capital will also be used for living expenses or interest on capital (such that it is these days).

It doesnt seem that much to me...

Px

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If taking early retirement then the £18k mentioned would currently not include the possibility of 2x state pensions in due course so you can add another 10k odd depending on contributions.

£28k gross is a very comfortable income I'd say.

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As others have said ( and as currency fluctuations have shown) it is important not to put all your eggs in one basket.

Use part for buying an adequate place to live and part to make an income.

Hedge your bets, so that if your pension is payable in sterling in the UK for example you find a way to supplement it in Euros, or if it is taken in Euros in France create an income (from a small letting property for example) in the UK in sterling.

My income is less than half your figures for one person, and my total capital (if I sold up) about a fifth of yours, but taking the model I have just given I have a perfectly reasonable life (in my 'barrel' as wooly would say...classical reference)

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Yes, Steve, afaik, you're right.  I always reckon that one pays less tax (certainly as a couple) but more cotis in France - although the latter will only be paid until UK state pensionable age is reached, after which the UK pays (possibly not the case if the o/p goes the French citizenship route.)

Like Diogenes, I reckon a couple can live reasonably, if not lavishly, on 18k.  

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As others have said, I would recommend putting half of your capital into a UK property bought specifically to let out.  This should raise you another £3-4000 or so per year, (after deduction of agents fees etc) on which no income tax would be payable as you would be able to offset it against a UK personal allowance.  Although you might have to pay social charges (about 13%) on it in France, not sure.  As well as boosting your income, this maintains the value of your capital in a way that (as far as I am aware) no other standard low-risk investment could do, and leaves the way open for a return to UK if necessary. 

Chrissie (81)

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So if you have a pre-existing health condition and can't obtain medical insurance you can't live in France?  So what happens if you become ill with this pre-existing condition and don't have insurance, do they leave you to die in the gutter?  If this is the case then I hope it also applies to the French living in Britain and that they are denied treatment on the NHS. 
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Hi all

 

Thanks for your input - it's exactly what I was hoping for - I did wonder if health insurance woud be an issue and we will have to look into this side of things vey carefully. I do like the idea of buying a small modern house here in the Uk to rent out. We live in Lincolnshire where prices are still quite cheap so should be able to pick something up for around £120,000 I'm a little concerned though that by doing so  that we would'nt have enough left to buy a place in good condition with the land we need ( minimum of 2 acres) in France - I know that the Auvergne is the cheapest of the areas I mentioned but it does rain alot there in the winter and we are looking for more sunshine !! - I love Provence and have family there but it is expensive - any suggestions as to where to start looking ?

 

We have a year left before retirement to do our research but roughly the plan  is to sell here then rent in the area we are looking to buy  - looking on the internet is great fun but I think not a really realistic way of house hunting and we really need to be 'on the ground '  .... I don't have dual nationality ( mum got UK citizenship when she married  dad ) so those options woild not be available to me .

 

many thnaks again

 

 

Yvonne

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You're obviously doing your homework, Yvonne. We also went for the sunshine and headed south. Parts of the Langudoc are very expensive, but there are plenty of areas where property and land is better value. The Drome area is also quite rural, has plenty of sunshine too. We were going to buy there, but lost the property, and are pleased we did, as where we are now suits us very well.

Good luck in your research; enjoy it.  [:)

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