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NormanH
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Has apparently a huge value on the market, more than businesses such as MacDonalds.

I have been on it and found it confusing and totally trivial.

Can someone explain where this value come from? I am genuinely intrigued to know!

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And me.

Is it true that if you join you get messages like "So and so would like to be your friend - do you agree?" ?

If so I definitely don't want to join. Imagine if you ask someone to be your friend and they say " No."

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Very simple. Marketing.

Hundreds of millioms of people have given details about themseves to Facebook. I can use that info to target my advertiing, instead of paying for TV ads which only apply to 1-2% of the population! I can hit EXACTLY my target market straight! 90% of our direct advertising goes on Facebook........it is very effective. Easy to get word of mouth and direct recommendations. Easy to get get virals.

Outlook is a Microsoft product. Anything earnt there goes to Bill and Paul.

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As an example. Last year Ford launched their new Explorer in the US. Spent USD15million on Facebook. Gained 400million individual views of their page. 400million viewers by choice! Not 400million people who went and got a beer when the TV ads came on. Including a few million who couldn't even buy the d*mn thing!

TV ads won't go away, they are very good for imbedding aspirational messages to tap into at a future date. Good exampel would BMW. Few of the audience can afford now, but 1 day......................

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Yes but how many of the 400M views turned to sales?

Most people on facebook are kids (even though it's illegal for them to have accounts according to something I saw on the BBC a while back) or unemployed who have nothing better to do.

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Half of the customers on the Jeremy Kyle show are on there because of trouble caused bythat social networking site and malicious gossip being spread. I go on there because its the only way I get to see upto date photos of my family and messages from old friends, otherwise its the phone or e.mails because they are in the UK and I am in France.
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[quote user="Quillan"]

Yes but how many of the 400M views turned to sales?

Most people on facebook are kids (even though it's illegal for them to have accounts according to something I saw on the BBC a while back) or unemployed who have nothing better to do.

[/quote]

I doubt, in my lifetime, anyone has bought anything directly due to an ad., in deed they will actively push back against the message.

Brand awareness/brand enforcement/brand positioning/image/etc. Stuff the consumer will not even necessarily be aware. Repeat enough times and when you give consumers a choice, even though they are not consciously aware, the ads kick in. Cyncsm and pofaced denial is no defence, that is why so many Physciology Phds are used, to ensure you are NOT aware, and if asked would deny it!!

I'd guess the idea of using ads to sell went out when consumers became so cynical.

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[quote user="breizh"]

Very simple. Marketing.

Hundreds of millioms of people have given details about themseves to Facebook. I can use that info to target my advertiing, instead of paying for TV ads which only apply to 1-2% of the population! I can hit EXACTLY my target market straight! 90% of our direct advertising goes on Facebook........it is very effective. Easy to get word of mouth and direct recommendations. Easy to get get virals.

Outlook is a Microsoft product. Anything earnt there goes to Bill and Paul.

[/quote]

But I haven't seen advertising, that was my point.

I can understand the value of the information people seem to be happy to post rather rashly (in fact I think it is a front for the FBI in my darker conspiracy moments), but only if it can be used as you say.

But I don't see how it is being used.

There is no advertising on the Facebook page I am looking at at the moment.

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...and if you use an adblocker or other filtering, there won't be. To some extent, there are plenty of means and mechanisms by which you can protect your personal data, and limit who sees what you write. IMO, Facebook is a little like the Ryanair website. If you're used to it, and know how to use it, then it's relatively simple, private and secure. If you are a novice and don't know much about it, then a lot of the scaremongering in the media will have you conviced that Mark Zuckerberg is reading all about your last extra-marital affair and knows your bank balance to the nearest cent.

Used selectively, it's OK.

To be honest, I think you may well find that FB is largely responsible for the demise of forumland as we used to know it. For one thing, if you have developed "virtual" friendships in forumland, then FB gives you the option (which many seem to favour) of interacting with those people, without having to subject your online exchanges to the intervention of people with whom you'd simply rather not interact. I know that reads badly, but I'm sure you get my drift.

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Yes. You and I disagree quite often, but I prefer to be on a Forum where I am challenged than on Facebook with people who agree with me all the time. Of course I can do both..

Isn't this a mirror of the fall of some political leaders who surround themselves with yes people?

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[quote user="breizh"][quote user="Quillan"]

Yes but how many of the 400M views turned to sales?

Most people on facebook are kids (even though it's illegal for them to have accounts according to something I saw on the BBC a while back) or unemployed who have nothing better to do.

[/quote]

I doubt, in my lifetime, anyone has bought anything directly due to an ad., in deed they will actively push back against the message.

Brand awareness/brand enforcement/brand positioning/image/etc. Stuff the consumer will not even necessarily be aware. Repeat enough times and when you give consumers a choice, even though they are not consciously aware, the ads kick in. Cyncsm and pofaced denial is no defence, that is why so many Physciology Phds are used, to ensure you are NOT aware, and if asked would deny it!!

I'd guess the idea of using ads to sell went out when consumers became so cynical.

[/quote]

Well there you go. Its the same technique then as those that tell us the Euro will fail next week, next month, next year. If you say it enough times it must be true. I remember something about "if you tell a lie thirteen times it becomes the truth".

Seems then that there are too many fools out there and not enough intelligent thinkers. Luckily this forum seems to attract the latter. [:D]

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Norman: I can see the merits of both, although in fairness, FB isn't really a debating chamber. There are elements of it that can really grate, of course, but there are also elements which are a welcome change from forums. I guess a lot depends on the expectations one has of either medium. Surprisingly, because there IS a facility to restrict one's "audience", FB offers the opportunity to share things such as photos, or more personal information without it being available to absolutely everyone. However, as you rightly point out, Norman, there still exists the option to do both. And people don't agree all the time on FB. THAT is the stuff of which many sensationalist headlines and reality TV shows are made.

By definition, however, FB is a medium for interacting with "friends" - however you may wish to interpret the term. I can't speak more generally, only personally, but I don't expect my friends to agree with my every word, nor do I believe they expect that of me. As I am sure you would be the first to admit, Norman, forums attract a group of people who come together under the umbrella of a certain theme or shared interest but that is all. It's as clear as day to me that there are people on this and other forums I frequent who dislike me intensely, and I them. I'm sure we all feel much the same. On the other hand, there are a number with whom I get on well, and even a group of people I've subsequently met. With this latter group, I share much more than a passing interest in the latest regulations on fosse installation or whether Marie requires a bottle of whisky and a personal visit when I pitch up in France. Some of the information shared with them is not stuff I'd want to publish on a forum.

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" if you use an adblocker or other filtering, there won't be. To some

extent, there are plenty of means and mechanisms by which you can

protect your personal data, and limit who sees what you write"

I am pleased to hear it, but doesn't that mean that  the 'value' of Facebook is very ephemeral?

If I can avoid seeing the ads and not let them see much of my data (as I do my best to with Google as well) then it seems to me that this idea that these firms are worth an enormous price looks like a bubble waiting to burst.

I certainly wouldn't put any money into them.

"By the end of the day, Facebook was worth more than

households names including Pepsi, Ford and Walt Disney."[:-))]

But

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/facebook/9276699/Facebook-IPO-fight-back-begins-shares-priced-for-perfection-says-analyst.html

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The "value" is clearly in persuading the more gullible to allow their personal data to be accessed...or in the many (and frequent) "improvements" made to FB which force people to opt out of various invasive options.

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Oh dear, the next set of get rich quick money makers, namely the lawyers, seem to be in for an early windfall.

Facebook founder Mark Zuckerberg sees stock tumble amid IPO lawsuits

Another classic example of US banks talking up a company, making a killing whilst the poor schmuck who bought at $41 per share has now ended up $10 lighter at $31 a share. I thought that after 2008 there were laws in America to stop this sort of thing from happening again, obviously I was wrong.

I can't believe that anyone who knew about the business and used Facebook never realised that the adverts don't fit a page on a mobile phone (the most common device now for accessing Facebook). I wonder what those that thought Zuckerberg was a hero think now? Will we see a sequel to "Social Network" (the film about him) and what will it be called? Still I doubt he will be complaining very much, clever guy you have to admit.

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[quote user="Quillan"]

the poor schmuck who bought at $41 per share has now ended up $10 lighter at $31 a share[/quote]I'm sorry Q but what?  Anybody who can afford to gamble 41 dollars on anything (and that's what it is, gambling) has to put up with what's coming.  Horses fall over just as often as they win races. 

Edit : I'm sure that said sc  hmuck when I quoted you!

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