Pommier Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 I'm surprised that some people appear to think that it isn't (and wasn't) so bad for a man of 30 to have a sexual affair with an impressionable girl of 15, and that she was in part responsible (or is that 'asking for it'?) In the Peel case this was whilst he was separated from the young woman he'd married when she was 15 four years previously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YCCMB Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 Maybe we should resurrect the Jerry Lee Lewis saga while we're about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Théière Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 [quote user="Pommier"]I'm surprised that some people appear to think that it isn't (and wasn't) so bad for a man of 30 to have a sexual affair with an impressionable girl of 15, and that she was in part responsible (or is that 'asking for it'?) In the Peel case this was whilst he was separated from the young woman he'd married when she was 15 four years previously.[/quote]I am sorry you seem to have made that connection, It was/isn't right and also against the law as are a hell of a lot of other things people do but that doesn't stop them. The very fact that she was in awe and at the age of 15 was on her own going to a Black Sabbath concert (not once) shows her parents didn't exactly school her on the ways of the world or maybe she didn't listen so lets not forget she was in part responsible, an uncomfortable fact but there it is. If it had been a one off I would agree with you about the predatory thing by a 30 year old but 3 months! sorry she was partly responsible as were her parents/guardians.Quote from a paper.She said: "He [Peel] must have known I was still at school. But he didn’t ask and I didn’t tell him. "At the time I was just so happy to be on his arm. I was young and he was famous. All I cared about was that I could make all my school friends jealous. "I was insecure and impressionable. I suppose I used him for his fame and he used me for sex." Looking back, it was terribly wrong and I was perhaps manipulated. But it was a different era," she said. Of his previous 15year old wife, Mr Peel was separated at the time from his American wife Shirley Anne Milburn, whom he married when she was just 15 in 1965, though she claims she lied about her age to him. Well how unfortunate she lied and the authorities, not just John Peel didn't check at the wedding? If people didn't continually lie about things and cheat the whole world would be a better place but that will never happen.Savile and Peel may have liked young girls but that wasn't as bad as the former PM Ted Heath who was responsible for lowering the age of gay sex to fulfill his own wishes for young boys but we haven't heard so much about that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russethouse Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 <>Do you have a reference for that ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Théière Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 Yes,http://www.metro.co.uk/news/46516-former-pm-ted-heath-is-outedhttp://beforeitsnews.com/alternative/2012/10/sir-jimll-fix-it-alright-as-honourable-paedophile-and-provider-in-the-corridors-of-power-2480186.htmlhttp://theneedleblog.wordpress.com/2012/10/20/former-senior-jersey-police-officers-speak-out/ Just a matter of time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolybanana Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 Well, there is a new danger now arising from those articles which is that people might start making a link between gay and abusing, leading to a backlash against the gay community. To be watched I think Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quillan Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 [quote user="Théière"]Savile and Peel may have liked young girls but that wasn't as bad as the former PM Ted Heath who was responsible for lowering the age of gay sex to fulfill his own wishes for young boys but we haven't heard so much about that. [/quote]My comment about being 'forced to have an abortion' was really aimed at the social stigma still around at that time. It was still not considered 'correct' at that time for young girls to become pregnant out of wedlock especially if they were under age. Society, at that time, would have pressurised her in to having an abortion either directly or indirectly via her parentsAnyway back to your comment above. The age of consent amongst homosexuals was dropped to 16 in 2001 under a then Labour government. When the vote was cast 17 Tory MP's voted in favour one of which was Heath. To say that Ted Heath was responsible is really a vague as my comment about 'being forced'.John Campbell, who wrote Heaths biography in 1993 talked about his sexuality over several pages. Whilst because Heath had not been married (he was engaged at one time) it was often assumed he was gay however Campbell never found any proof that he was. On the other hand of course he may well have said this to protect himself against libel.If the allegations are true about Heath (just playing devils advocate a minute) two things spring to mind. Firstly that if he did indeed visit the boys homes in both Jersey and NI then this should be investigated as should he taking young boys on his yacht. On the the other hand why, after all this time, has no 'victim' come forward or were they all paid off but even then as he is dead they can still come forward regardless of if they were paid off or not.To me it matters not how far up or low down a person is in their social standing, the law is the law, there is no ignorance in relation to the law, and anyone who is thought to be breaking it should be investigated but then it's difficult enough these days to get a copper round your house when your burgled. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YCCMB Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 And with Heath, it appears that there were a number of attempts to make political mileage out of convincing the populace that he was gay...whether he was, or not. I remember listening to this fascinating story on Radio 4 a few months ago, and it seems this was but one attempt to try and sully Heath's reputation. Whether the others are true or not, I have no idea, but it seems that there's still some doubt as to whether Heath was not the marrying kind, or "not the marrying kind"...and indeed there should be equal doubt attached to stories regarding his alleged sexuality, if this is an example.[url]http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-18556213[/url] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russethouse Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 On another forum I contribute to an ex diplomat, who worked in the Foreign Office at the time, has posted that he doubts very much that Edward Heath was gay as the time homosexuals were disliked and distrusted and any suspicion of 'deviant behavior' would end your career. In addition he was said to have been 'very fond of' Moura Lympany, the concert pianist and would have married her had she accepted......A couple of people have said he was a 'cold fish' and very boring company, but thats another matter ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Zoff Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 Didn't stop Jeremy Thorpe becoming the Liberal leader, but perhaps being head of the Liberals isn't so much of a career. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russethouse Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 Didn't Jeremy Thorpe get married and have a son and was then widowed when his wife was killed in a car crash in Basingstoke ? He later remarried.He was accused of being a homosexual by Norman Scott, but was later cleared of conspiring to murder him ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabbie Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 [quote user="Russethouse"]Didn't Jeremy Thorpe get married and have a son and was then widowed when his wife was killed in a car crash in Basingstoke ? He later remarried.He was accused of being a homosexual by Norman Scott, but was later cleared of conspiring to murder him ! [/quote]Absolutely correct. Although OScar Wilde who was imprisoned for being gay was married with children. There are a lot of bisexual people out there allegedly.In Ted Heath's case he may have been gay but there is no evidence that he was not celibate. Not so uncommon among gay men of his generation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clarkkent Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 Savile and Peel may have liked young girls but that wasn't as bad as the former PM Ted Heath who was responsible for lowering the age of gay sex to fulfill his own wishes for young boys but we haven't heard so much about that.This statement appears to demonstrate an unnecessary degree of intolerance. That Ted Heath should have been homosexual comes as no surprise to me, but, frankly, is it any business of mine, or of anyone else? I thought that we were past the stage when people's sexuality could be used as weapons against them. The statement about his motives is pure speculation - perhaps he considered that heterosexuals and homosexuals should be treated equally in a fair society.The publication of a photograph of Ted Heath in an article about Savile is mischief and does not amount to evidence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoddy Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 This is exactly the danger that Wooly pointed out of conflating homosexual with peadophile.Hoddy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clarkkent Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 [quote user="Rabbie"]In Ted Heath's case he may have been gay but there is no evidence that he was not celibate. Not so uncommon among gay men of his generation.[/quote] ... erm ... Celibate means "unmarried". There is plenty of evidence that Ted Heath was unmarried. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolybanana Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 It also means 'not getting any' for whatever reason, usually personal choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabbie Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 [quote user="Clarkkent"][quote user="Rabbie"] In Ted Heath's case he may have been gay but there is no evidence that he was not celibate. Not so uncommon among gay men of his generation.[/quote] There is plenty of evidence that Ted Heath was unmarried.[/quote]Pedantically there is no evidence that he was married. What specific evidence do you have that he was unmarried. You are absolutely sure that there was not a secret marriage abroad[:D] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabbie Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 [quote user="Clarkkent"][quote user="Rabbie"] In Ted Heath's case he may have been gay but there is no evidence that he was not celibate. Not so uncommon among gay men of his generation.[/quote] There is plenty of evidence that Ted Heath was unmarried.[/quote]Pedantically there is no evidence that he was married. What specific evidence do you have that he was unmarried. You are absolutely sure that there was not a secret marriage abroad[:D] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolybanana Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 Rabbie seems to be getting over excited at the thought of an illicit or secret liaison Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YCCMB Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 I'm curious as to why a single heterosexual would go to the trouble of marrying someone in another country and then keeping that marriage a secret. Especially as it would have been beneficial to admit to being married.But anyway, pedantically, I have no proof of anything and the above is just idle curiosity. I also have no proof that Edward Heath was not a tomato. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quillan Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 [quote user="You can call me Betty"]I'm curious as to why a single heterosexual would go to the trouble of marrying someone in another country and then keeping that marriage a secret. Especially as it would have been beneficial to admit to being married.But anyway, pedantically, I have no proof of anything and the above is just idle curiosity. I also have no proof that Edward Heath was not a tomato.[/quote]He often had a redish face so you never know. [;-)]He was engaged once upon a time when he was serving in the army. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolybanana Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 Can't you be arrested for being a pedant. Well, we can't call the BBC Auntie any more, that's for certain! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YCCMB Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 Elton John was married to a woman once. And as I said the other week, Liberace won damages from the Mirror when they said he was gay. It's a funny old world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nomoss Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 [quote user="Gardian"]There was a thread on Savile that stalled 10 days ago: I'm not seeking to resurrect that.[/quote]Lucky you didn't, it could have become tedious [Www] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Théière Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 [quote user="Quillan"][quote user="Théière"] Savile and Peel may have liked young girls but that wasn't as bad as the former PM Ted Heath who was responsible for lowering the age of gay sex to fulfill his own wishes for young boys but we haven't heard so much about that. [/quote]Anyway back to your comment above. The age of consent amongst homosexuals was dropped to 16 in 2001 under a then Labour government. When the vote was cast 17 Tory MP's voted in favour one of which was Heath. To say that Ted Heath was responsible is really a vague as my comment about 'being forced'.[/quote]Really, so members of parliament who raise their hands in a vote to change a law are not responsible? Then who is?[quote user="Clarkkent"] Savile and Peel may have liked young girls but that wasn't as bad as the former PM Ted Heath who was responsible for lowering the age of gay sex to fulfill his own wishes for young boys but we haven't heard so much about that.This statement appears to demonstrate an unnecessary degree of intolerance. The publication of a photograph of Ted Heath in an article about Savile is mischief and does not amount to evidence.[/quote]Yes I cannot deny I am more tolerant of heterosexual sex than buggery, does that make me strange then? I am not talking about homosexual adult couples. Lets see what unfolds before judging me No of course evidence would be given in a court, everything you and everyone else have discussed thus far is mischief but it hasn't stopped anyone offering conjecture Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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