Difficult to believe that

[woolybanana]

an American doctor and member of important committees in the Congress could be so stoooopid!

Another reason to vote Obamba:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/oct/06/republican-congressman-paul-broun-evolution-video

[Russethouse]

Next thing you know they'll be wanting planes with opening windows [:D]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/mitt-romney/9564529/Mitt-Romney-why-dont-aeroplane-windows-open.html

If he wins I think I'll go into hibernation for a few years...

[Clair]

Good grief!

How did this guy get where he is?

How many god-fearing, gullible suckers does it take to elect such a moron?

[Russethouse]

 Believe me, I know people who I thought of as being intelligent adults in the US who will vote for this guys party because they see him as looking after their money better, they have very little perception of fellow Americans poverty often dismissing them as wet backs or other immigrants.

Last year one guy told me there was nothing in the American constitution that entitled anyone to healthcare, and he didn't see why he should contribute to anyone elses......in other words 'I'm alright Jack'

[idun]

Fundamentalists scare the hell out of me. Bet he's a pal of Sarah Palin!

[allanb]

It's a pity, but I think that "god-fearing and gullible" is a fair description of a large part of the population of the USA.

[Hoddy]

"Last year one guy told me there was nothing in the American constitution that entitled anyone to healthcare, and he didn't see why he should contribute to anyone elses......in other words 'I'm alright Jack' "

I think you've got to the heart of the matter there RH. Americans are taught that they went to American for religious freedom and because they didn't want to pay church taxes.

Neither of those things is strictly true. Part of the taxes they wanted to avoid was the tax introduced in 1601 by Elizabeth for the relief of the poor which was administered by the parish and therefore easily portrayed as a church tax.

Just shows how important history teaching is.

Hoddy

[NickP]

Unfortunately religious idiots  are not confined to the USA, the boy scout association in the UK have banned a small lad from attending  scout meetings because he's an atheist. He was honest and said he said he could not pledge allegiance to god, so they've banned him.

[Mr Ceour de Lion II]

The religion bit is the main thing that turns me off republican. I could never be one. But I could never be a democrat either. I don't think continually borrowing money is the solution. I like Romney's plan for jobs (which is my number 1 priority at present), and doing away with Obamacare which will not solve anything anyway. If most people are working, healthcare isn't so much of a problem anyway because people can pay their way as is the ideal situation.

I don't think either are particularly good at foreign affairs. Isn't Obama is the first president never to have gone to Israel? He's snubbed them too. Crazy to embrace the Iranian leader though as they are becoming the next problem in the Middle East. I think those things make Romney's verbal gaffs more insignificant. Still not sure what he said wrong in London to be honest, he only said what plenty of British were saying anyway.

I've always lent towards the right, but I'm glad I don't have to worry about voting this time. Just hope the choice is better in 4 years time. Happy to be a floater so I can keep my options open :)

[NickP]

[quote user="Mr Ceour de Lion II"]The religion bit is the main thing that turns me off republican. I could never be one. But I could never be a democrat either. I don't think continually borrowing money is the solution. I like Romney's plan for jobs (which is my number 1 priority at present), and doing away with Obamacare which will not solve anything anyway. If most people are working, healthcare isn't so much of a problem anyway because people can pay their way as is the ideal situation.

I don't think either are particularly good at foreign affairs. Isn't Obama is the first president never to have gone to Israel? He's snubbed them too. Crazy to embrace the Iranian leader though as they are becoming the next problem in the Middle East. I think those things make Romney's verbal gaffs more insignificant. Still not sure what he said wrong in London to be honest, he only said what plenty of British were saying anyway.

I've always lent towards the right, but I'm glad I don't have to worry about voting this time. Just hope the choice is better in 4 years time. Happy to be a floater so I can keep my options open :)
[/quote]

Looks like you've finally found a country that suits your opinions, hope you both will be very happy together. Although I hope for your sake you are not taken ill when your out of work. Oh and by the way the choice in four years time will still be Republican or Democrat, still you could always try Canada their pretty Liberal.[:P]

[Mr Ceour de Lion II]

I realise the choice will still be republican or democrat, but it won't be Obama and Romney as the choices.

I'm currently not working right now, but have very good insurance thank you very much.

Just glad I got out of France when I did. Now there's a country that will be going to the dogs, especially under socialist control. They've already begun by starting to get rid of the money there :p

[Alex H]

[quote user="Mr Ceour de Lion II"]

Just glad I got out of France when I did.

[/quote]

But it still has a hold on you, doesn't it?

Otherwise you wouldn't still be on here? [8-)][8-)]

[Russethouse]

[quote user="Mr Ceour de Lion II"]I realise the choice will still be republican or democrat, but it won't be Obama and Romney as the choices.

I'm currently not working right now, but have very good insurance thank you very much.

Just glad I got out of France when I did. Now there's a country that will be going to the dogs, especially under socialist control. They've already begun by starting to get rid of the money there :p
[/quote]

The choice in 4 years may still be Romney, do you really want a man without a basic understanding of why it is not desirable to open a window on an aeroplane having his finger on the nuclear button ?

You may have good insurance, as did a friend of mine who needed an operation on her neck (her husband is a lawyer so I think we can assume their insurance was top draw) that didn't stop the insurance company arguing with the surgeon about what operation they would pay for, while she was on the table awaiting an anaesthetic, thats not my idea of a good system - neither is the limit on supplies for diabetes another friend has, but don't you worry about it...after all you are OK !

[Mr Ceour de Lion II]

[quote user="Alex H"][quote user="Mr Ceour de Lion II"]

Just glad I got out of France when I did.

[/quote]

But it still has a hold on you, doesn't it?

Otherwise you wouldn't still be on here? [8-)][8-)]

[/quote]

I have many good friends on here. Is that ok?

Besides, it's always been the culture and history of France that appealed to me, the politics were always mostly awful.

In answer to Russethouse, I do actually believe the French have a great blend in terms of their health care system. I like that you are covered, and I also like that you also have a sense of responsibility in terms of having to pay either insurance or fees on top. I don't have an answer for the American system. It started very differently to the socialist system and is so far ingrained that it would take an apocalypse to change it. It does have great advantages, but also many great disadvantages. I was being deliberately obtuse in my reply.

As for Romney, I don't like him much either, he has said some dumb things, but I do agree with him regarding getting jobs happening again and the way to do that. I disagree with borrowing money to solve problems, it only creates further problems down the line. By reducing tax burdens on businesses to employ people makes perfect sense. All the time you hear of people who do have jobs saying how much work they have and how stressed they are, therefore if businesses are encouraged to take on more staff to get through this work, then surely that is the best way to go about it. Less benefits need to be paid out, more tax is being paid in because there are more tax payers, and you haven't lost your rich (who pay more tax than anyone else in dollar terms anyway). In my situation, that is the number one priority for me, therefore my reason for tending towards republican at this time.

Also, having a population that has jobs will actually help the healthcare system here too, as more people will have insurance. The rich, retired and poor are already well provided for, the working population will be covered through their insurance schemes, so it leaves a small minority of unemployed and self employed people to sort out health care for.

What I do disagree with republicans in is the religious background, their stance on abortion, and I'm quite happy for gays to get married too.

I also thought it was dumb of Obama to have embraced the Iranian leader too. Think that was more dangerous than what Romney said about airplane windows to be honest.

[Russethouse]

 Also, having a population that has jobs will actually help the healthcare system here too, as more people will have insurance

The problem is you need to be healthy to work, otherwise you are in a downward spiral. Also it seems unemployment benefits don't last long.....a friend was made redundant from a professional job, I think she got help for 18 months then that was it...nothing....

There is no perfect system but not having access to appropriate healthcare must be terrifying .....

 

 

[Mr Ceour de Lion II]

If the majority are working then more taxes are being paid, therefore Medicare and Medicaid can receive more funds for those who need it. So in this respect, the system is social. But those who work and can afford it can pay their own way. Simple.

Maybe I should be president? :)

[Russethouse]

It depends how you look at it - personally I wouldn't want some guy in an insurance office deciding what treatment I get.......argueing with surgeons etc.....

Why, oh why do, the Republican party have the likes of Bush and Romney as candidates ?

[Rabbie]

[quote user="Russethouse"]

Why, oh why do, the Republican party have the likes of Bush and Romney as candidates ?

[/quote]Simple. Bush and Romney reflect the views of many Republican party members even if they are regarded as dangerously moderate/ left wing by the more fanatical members. It's all a bit worrying just how right wing a democracy can go. it would be interesting to see what the USA political map would look like if voting was compulsory as in Australia.

[Russethouse]

They can't be the only republicans that reflect those views, the richest and most powerful maybe....?

[Quillan]

If this man wins then God help us all and in particular America but then I don't think he will. I would imagine, unless there are a lot of sick American women out there, that the comments about women getting raped and that should they fall pregnant as a result that it is God's will, should alienate him from the women's vote. Sadly there are plenty more where that came from as well like only allowing married women to have contraception because parents should tell their kids nt to have sex till they are married. But perhaps it is not these horrific comments so much as the gross stupidity of the man like his comment about why you can't open a window on an airplane! Whats the old saying about the lunatics running the asylum?

[Mr Ceour de Lion II]

That's exactly why religion and politics should never be together.

In fairness, Romney distanced himself from that comment. But then he'd be a fool not to.

[Quillan]

[quote user="Mr Ceour de Lion II"]That's exactly why religion and politics should never be together.

In fairness, Romney distanced himself from that comment. But then he'd be a fool not to.
[/quote]

Yes but he is not distancing himself from the anti abortionists and their beliefs is he, nor his he distancing himself away from the anti contraception lobby either. If you look on the web there are loads of things he has said and I am not referring to the pro Democrat party papers either.

Your not going 'native' are you Richard?

Thank God I am in France and not America. [;-)]

[Mr Ceour de Lion II]

No, I'm just looking at the issues most important to me. Like any other voter does too (although I'm not voting this time, just practising).

As I think I said earlier, I could never be a full republican because I don't agree with all their doctrine, but similarly I don't agree with all of the democrats stuff either.

For me, immigration and jobs are my number one priority at present. Things like abortion, gay marriage etc will never be an issue for me (but no doubt it will to many other people, and they will make their minds up based on those priorities), but I see nothing from the democrats regarding getting people back to work. For the republicans, it's central to their policies, hence why I am leaning that way.

Of course, whether it comes to light is another matter, but that's the same for every politician and party.

For me personally, I feel I have already had more opportunity in America to do something with my life than I did in France. Despite limitations in my visa, I feel freer here than in France. I'm not knocking France as I moved there for a different reason and the US will never be able to compete in terms of history or culture, but the spirit of being in control of my destiny feels greater here than it did in France or even England. I felt the same in Australia. Perhaps the pioneer spirit still exists.

[allanb]

Mr C de L : if you're not working but you have good health insurance, then presumably either a former employer is paying for it, or you're rich enough to buy your own. In either case, you're lucky. There are tens of millions of people in the USA who aren't.

I don't like everything about Obamacare, but in the absence of Obamacare or something like it, those people live with the risk of serious illness for which the only available treatment (unless they are so poor that they qualify for Medicaid) would be what they can get from a visit to the emergency room. And even the lucky ones, who have good health cover because of their employment, are permanently in danger of losing it.

I think this is disgraceful in one of the world's richest countries, and I give Obama credit for trying to do something about it.

[Mr Ceour de Lion II]

So how does Obamacare help? All it does is force them to buy health insurance, which they obviously cannot afford, otherwise they'd probably have it.

The whole system needs to be started from scratch, and that isn't going to happen.

However, if the majority of people are working, then they will be covered leaving only a minority without cover. With the extra tax which is being paid in because the majority of people are working, then improvements to Medicare and Medicaid can be made so those people can be covered too.

You therefore don't need Obamacare.