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Better out of the EU?


Quillan
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[quote user="Hoddy"]I often wonder why we don't train enough of our own doctors and nurses. While I was still teaching we always had many more pupils applying for medical places than were able to get in.[/quote]

You may well ask. The problem is that being a GP for instance does not permit a lot of 'doctoring' compared to before. This is because the cost of a patient’s treatment with the exception of those arriving at A&E via an ambulance or walkin is controlled by the GP. The GP has to pay for every service he asks for. If he wants you to have an X-ray then he pays for it, etc, etc. Then there are the patient committee meetings, they all have names that we mortals can't even begin to understand and these also have to be attended. So you spend all this time going through university and medical school only ending up as a glorified accountant with, if you are lucky, a bit of doctoring thrown in. basically the interfering politians, both Labour and Tory, have changed the system so much and put so much responsibility on to the GP's that nobody wants the job.

I read over the last five weeks that then number of GP's leaving the profession is at an all time high and that because publicity is making the A&E departments look inefficient etc that in one hospital (Alexandra Hospital*) the whole of A&E doctor team resigned on mass resulting in the department having to close temporarily (15th Feb 2015).

At the end of the day if people no longer want to be doctors you firstly can't blame them and secondly you can't make them.

* A&E doctors hand in resignations in mass exodus

You could try having a look at the online magazine for GP's called Pulse ( http://www.pulsetoday.co.uk/home/ )

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Q wrote,

The UK house prices collapsed in the UK in 2008/9 and took a few years to come back. The house prices in Spain also collapsed but look at the prices and how quick they are starting to go up now. These things happen and France is not unique. Because Sterling collapsed against the Euro up until a couple of months ago it would have made no difference if you sold your French house as the exchange rate would have been much better for taking your money back to the UK. Indeed if you sold at the right time you would have shown a healthy profit. That said Sterling still has a way to go before it gets to where it should be (somewhere between 1.45 and 1.5).

I forgot to add that the reason you couldn't come because of the changes in healthcare rules in France is down to EU legislation which they decided to impliment as has other EU countries. Tony Blair refused to add this to UK legislation because it thought it ws an infringment of peoples human right to refuse or make them pay for healthcare.

The thing is that we most likely would not have been able to sell up without taking a large hit. You are right that the exchange rate would have helped with the loss in value of the French house, but you say ‘IF’ we had sold, the truth is that the type of house we were in the process of buying is the type not favoured by the French. Very popular with the English and Dutch, but due to the health changes and euro value, they would have not been buying. So my guess is that if we had wished to sell up as many seem to do, we would not have found a buyer.

I was thinking more of todays situation, house prices in France well down from 2007, of course some of that was the ‘foreigner tax’ but the chances of them ever attracting foreign buyers again in the future due to the for mentioned changes means the rural house prices will continue to decline.

Then the cost of the fees for buying have risen again recently, and more taxes for second home owners brought in by the French government just helps add to the declining situation.

Contrast this with the UK, its buzzing at the moment, house prices rising across the country, well in excess of their 2007 height. Helped of course by the chancellor lowering stamp duty for 95% of properties.

And who would bet the £ will not be back to its 2007 exchange rate of 1.47 euros to the £ before long. So IF we had brought back in 2007 and sold today or in the near future we would, most defiantly have lost a ‘shed load’

BTW, one of UKIP’s policy’s is to implement the five year private healthcare rule for new entrants to the UK in line with France. I glad Tony Blair has some thoughts about human rights, just a shame he did show any when he sent our troops into Iraq.

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People in this part of France who's houses have been for sale for years are now selling. We know of several people who this year, have finally made a sale and although less than they had hoped for, not the falling out of bottom prices that people had thought. Some buyers are British, some French and quite a few from non EU countries. By contrast.. friends selling in the Uk (in London) have had a terrible time. No shortage of interest but potential buyers unable to raise funds at last minute and they are also having difficulties borrowing against what, a few years ago would have been a very safe bet with a very sizeable deposit. Lots of reluctant buy to let landlords in London I think. Not that any of this has much to do with the EU, but I know where I'd rather be right now!
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Ok so really what you're saying with regards to your house is that it was down to choice of property and the economic collapse which is not really the fault of the EU or the Euro. Indeed the Euro bounced back quite quickly in comparison to say sterling which is just about back to where it should be after seven years. Quite an achievement by the Tories regardless of how anyone feels about them. That, I should say, is not a criticism of your financial prowess rather than bad luck and just one of those things. If we could all foretell the future I wouldn't be typing this but would be sitting in the sun somewhere by the side of my pool in my million pound house having won the lottery several times.

According to the Nationwide website the average house price in 2007 (Q4) was £183k and in 2014 (Q4) was £189k, a rise on average of £6k. It was only the last nine months of 2014 that the average house price rose above that of 2007.

The Ukip policy is not inline with France (which is inline with the EU) because it is only if you don't work and your not a state pensioner that you need private health insurance. If you work you pay into the system therefore your entitled to use it just the same as anyone else. Don't forget that just like many Brits who are at, or over, state pension age living in France getting their healthcare here paid for by the UK the same rule applies for migrants in the same position who go to the UK. Their healthcare is paid for by whatever EU county they come from. Thats what the S1 form is for. If the UK treats them anyway free of charge well thats down to the UK not playing by EU rules and not the EU's fault.

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Like a lot of UKIP policies, the 'healthcare for immigrants' one seems designed to pander to the paranoia of those who believe that 'all immigrants are illegal and claiming benefits '. The majority of recent immigrants are in paid work and contributing to the system, so not sure how or why you could exclude them from the system. The only way would be to fundamentally change the UK system so that access to healthcare is only given after a minimum level of contributions, as is the case in France. However the reform required would take a very long time to implement and would affect many more of UKIP's loyal voters than it would the immigrant population.
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[quote user="lindal1000"]Like a lot of UKIP policies, the 'healthcare for immigrants' one seems designed to pander to the paranoia of those who believe that 'all immigrants are illegal and claiming benefits '. The majority of recent immigrants are in paid work and contributing to the system, so not sure how or why you could exclude them from the system. The only way would be to fundamentally change the UK system so that access to healthcare is only given after a minimum level of contributions, as is the case in France. However the reform required would take a very long time to implement and would affect many more of UKIP's loyal voters than it would the immigrant population.[/quote]

I was wondering about how people would deal with the idea that if you are over 18, not in full time education and did not contribute then you wouldn't be entitled.

Still at the end of the day it is all irrelevant really because Ukip won't be in power, there won't be a referendum. Labour will get in because of Tory vote defectors to Ukip and the number of Ukip MP's will be between three and five with the possibility of one for there newer MP's (Reckless) not even able to hang on to his seat in a general election. The only people Labour will do a deal with are the SNP, which I disaprove of by the way. The whole thing no doubt will be a total ballsup but then I guess you have to be careful what you wish for.

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Ok so really what you're saying with regards to your house is that it was down to choice of property and the economic collapse which is not really the fault of the EU or the Euro. Indeed the Euro bounced back quite quickly in comparison to say sterling which is just about back to where it should be after seven years. Quite an achievement by the Tories regardless of how anyone feels about them. That, I should say, is not a criticism of your financial prowess rather than bad luck and just one of those things. If we could all foretell the future I wouldn't be typing this but would be sitting in the sun somewhere by the side of my pool in my million pound house having won the lottery several times.

According to the Nationwide website the average house price in 2007 (Q4) was £183k and in 2014 (Q4) was £189k, a rise on average of £6k. It was only the last nine months of 2014 that the average house price rose above that of 2007.

The Ukip policy is not inline with France (which is inline with the EU) because it is only if you don't work and your not a state pensioner that you need private health insurance. If you work you pay into the system therefore your entitled to use it just the same as anyone else. Don't forget that just like many Brits who are at, or over, state pension age living in France getting their healthcare here paid for by the UK the same rule applies for migrants in the same position who go to the UK. Their healthcare is paid for by whatever EU county they come from. Thats what the S1 form is for. If the UK treats them anyway free of charge well thats down to the UK not playing by EU rules and not the EU's fault.

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Well I did not realise I was blaming either the EU or the Euro for any potential lose, just stating the facts as I see it would have played out for myself if we had have made the move.. Indeed hindsight is a wonderful thing, ’ the rear view mirror is always clearer than the windscreen’. as Warren Buffer famously said.

Please remember the average house price takes into account the UK as a whole, its only certain parts that matter to each individual, and my part has enjoyed rises far in excess of the amounts quoted by the Nationwide as ‘average’.

I don't regard it as ‘bad luck’ we did not move to France in 2007, quite the opposite in fact now. Perhaps living in France full time, you don't see the decline in the country over the last ten years. perhaps your area is OK,

Maybe this might interest you tonight on BBC2, 9.00 UK time (no its not Top Gear), Quelle Catastrophe, with Robert Preston. All about the decline in France and how it is affecting the ‘very fabric’ of French life.

The UKIP policy does not have to be in line with other EU countries, because if these rules that are proposed were ever implemented, then it would mean the UK had left the EU. (Hooray)

I would not count on the S1 being available forever, again another thing to add to the growing list which will stop foreigners buying in France I guess.
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[quote user="ebaynut"]The UKIP policy does not have to be in line with other EU countries, because if these rules that are proposed were ever implemented, then it would mean the UK had left the EU. (Hooray) I would not count on the S1 being available forever, again another thing to add to the growing list which will stop foreigners buying in France I guess.[/quote]

Well quite frankly it is not going to happen and we all know that because thankfully there will not be a referendum. The Tories lie and Labour won't hold one anyway and they will probably be running the country after May. The end of the S1 would only come about if the UK left the EU and didn't trade with it. If it wants to trade without being penalised on import duty it will have to join the EEA in which case it is still effectively, although without representation, a member of the EU like Norway. As I said it won't happen anyway.

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[quote user="Frederick"]I am glad you know who is going to win the UK election Q .. I think its not that certain today and after the Budget will be even less so . I suspect Cameron will not need a furniture van . http://www.electionforecast.co.uk/  [/quote]

To form a government in the UK you need half or more of the seats i.e. you need 325 or more seats which neither of the party will get on its own. Currently the Tories have 302 + LibDems 56 giving them 358. It's going to a right old mess I can tell you but I think with both the SNP and LibDems with labour should do the job.

The problem is that ex Tory voters will vote for Ukip but that does not mean in a particular seat Ukip will win but what it will do is dilute the Tory vote letting the second party (Labour) get the seat and as you can see from your link 13 of the 18 that the Tories will lose will go to Labour. Labour will not even think about a EU referendum let alone concider reducing the amount of immigrants so it's a double whammy for Ukip.

 

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Q wrote,

Still at the end of the day it is all irrelevant really because Ukip won't be in power, there won't be a referendum. Labour will get in because of Tory vote defectors to Ukip and the number of Ukip MP's will be between three and five with the possibility of one for there newer MP's (Reckless) not even able to hang on to his seat in a general election. The only people Labour will do a deal with are the SNP, which I disaprove of by the way. The whole thing no doubt will be a total ballsup but then I guess you have to be careful what you wish for.

I have just got off the blower to Nigel, and told him the above. He is gutted, as am I. We both thought we were in for a clear UKIP majority in May. Nigel wants to know where I found out about this, I told him from a man on the French Forum, so it must be true. What we both want to know is how long have you known about this for, and why you have failed to mention anything about it in the past ??

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I have known about it ever since he said on more than one occasion in TV and newspaper interviews. I wonder if his attempt to blackmail the electorate where he is standing to vote Ukip by saying if he loses he will resign as leader will work. It's a shame really as I was looking forward to him and Boris locking horns. What great sport it would be to see Farrage, Boris and Clarkson on Question Time. Farrage and Boris would be shouting at each other whilst Clarkson gives them both a smack and looks for a lampost to hang them from having invited their families to come and watch.
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I doubt shouting at each other would be the order of the day if those three were on question time. In private I am sure they all have very similar views. But if there was a fight I wonder who would win?? Could be anyone one, ask Jeremy to decide, he has a great way of choosing. eany, meany, mieny, mo,..........
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