Snipes

[idun]

I have to admit that I am getting thoroughly fed up about all the snipes on here concerning the brexit vote.

It was done under the current voting system, and legally and above board.

How would those of you who are against brexit felt if it had gone the other way, and I had been constantly saying that it would serve you all right and you would see the folly of your 'stupid' actions, because that is how it feels at the moment.

I would have said, as I still believe, that the EU needs a major overhaul. And that all countries then adhere to the rules  and not as is the current case where the UK had a genius for implementing EU rules at break neck speed, where as even Germany does not.

None of us know what the future holds. I make plans for the worst case scenario, because in truth, our lives could get very complicated, but worry about it, no, I won't waste my time on that.

[NickP]

If anything Idun it will be the make or break of the EU, if the EU is smart and they get rid of the over paid halfwits who do things like changing the headquarters every few weeks at horrendous cost. Plus stop trying to build a federal system and just stick to common-sense regulations and trade then I think it will be fine. OK it's a bit painful at the moment for those who rely on exchange rates, but for those who based their future on exchange rates it was never a sound idea in the first place. I have high hopes for the future and am convinced it needed a shake up.

[lindal1000]

I've ben surprised how little discussion there has been on here really.

I go to other places to discuss it and also to have a moan..but the only thing that has happened so far is that there is a new prime minister and the pound has fallen.

There is still everything to play for as far as I can see and no one would seriously expect the 48% who voted remain to say , 'okay, game over, I won't offer my opinion anymore' would they? Especially when there is still no clear plan for what 'brexit' means, except that it means 'brexit'. Surely I still have a voice in arguing for the type of 'brexit' I would like to see?

So, no I'm not going to say thank you for voting for something that I fundamentally disagree with and I will continue to express a view. However it does no one any favours if people are rude and insulting to each other.

[nomoss]

Well, it was all a jolly jape for David, Gideon and their cronies, who can now go their merry ways leaving others with the mess.

[Chancer]

I agree with you both, I found the sort of comments that started with a bang the day after very very distastefull and showed a truly ugly side of human nature, I could see that many were in shock, that whilst they feared a Brexit vote that they never really thought it would happen and made allowances accordingly for their reactions but many others have continued and as they have seen the exchange rate drop have even got worse.

 

Having lived here 11 years and been dependant on transferring savings from the UK for most of that time the current rate to me is pretty much at its average value in recent years, I did feel however that the rise before the vote was artificial so those that think they are hurting should consider that perhaps they actually gained in the run up.

 

I no longer need to transfer money in either direction, I do however have a £20k share investment since the early 90's, apart from one gain the day after I bought the share price just dropped and dropped, at its lowest my "investment" was worth only £5K, then in the last couple of years it actually grew beyond the £20K, i dont think because of Brexit but maybe in the last few months when the £ rose so much, within 14 days of Brexit I had lost £6500 but I didnt start calling people who had voted for Brexit idiots, express that I hoped they would suffer, no I accepted the downside of a risk I had taken just as I have had to do many times with the risk of moving to France, things change all the time, you have to grin and bear it and adapt accordingly or not take risks in the first place.

 

After 8 weeks my shares have returned to the post Brexit value, I have no loss, and I understand that is true of the whole of the FTSE,  the £ has stabilised at what I belive is its true current value not a pre Brexit speculation inflated one.

 

Like NickP I am confident for the future, the only time I get depressed is when I can see no hope of any change, that life will always carry on like yesterday.

[lindal1000]

I can't remember any places where anyone commented in an offensive way on here. (I've read a lot on various Facebook sites but this site has been pretty quiet since the referendum)

I don't think anyone knows what will happen in the future ...that's all we can say for certain. Human nature tends to veer towards stability and my guess is that will be the case but we can't know for sure. For most people however of course life hasn't changed as nothing has happened yet. It will be October before we even get a clue of the next step, next year at the earliest before article 50 is declared, two years of negotiations while the UK remains a member..and that is taking is very close to the next General Election. The only thing we are seeing at the moment is the market reacting to uncertainty.

I should also add Chancer, that we are in the luckily position where we have adequate resources to weather the changes whatever, but a lot of people in the UK and those living overseas do not have that protection and even small fluctuations affect them.

As to the future..I'm pretty confident that I'll be okay but not so sure about those living in France on a small UK generated income, or dependent on reciprocal arrangements for healthcare, or for those living in the UK. I do genuinely think there is a big question mark about the unity of the United Kingdom as well, but maybe that is not something that bothers me as much as someone living in the UK.

[NormanH]

I haven't really seen many such comments. Which threads are they in?

As I said on another thread nothing has happened yet.

A majority expressed their view in a referendum, and the present government has started to make plans to implement that view, but everything is still vague.

Only after a number of years will the economic consequences, good or bad, become clear.

On a personal note the fact that a certain group of  ideologies  won the day has clarified the fact that I could never again willingly live in the UK, but that is a tragedy for no-one.

[nomoss]

[quote user="NormanH"] ..........................................  On a personal note the fact that a certain group of  ideologies  won the day has clarified the fact that I could never again willingly live in the UK, but that is a tragedy for no-one.

[/quote]

Nicely put, NormanH.

I know what you mean, but having left the UK in 1963, and after only occasional short visits since then, an attempt to return there for good in 1978 resulted in our leaving after less than 2 years and never even thinking of returning.

[alittlebitfrench]

Personally, the Brexit thing has convinced me that I would actually like one day to go back to the UK. I really hope it works out. The kids I think would love to live in the UK.

It makes me laugh because the loud self centred looking after my own bum type members on the 'other' forum are looking very silly right now after months of bullying and ridiculing other members on stupid threads. Where is all the doom and gloom ? Seriously LOL. I have noticed it has all gone very quiet over there now since the UK has not economically imploded since the vote like they predicted. Idiots.

Also, it seems that those 'loud' members who are only selfishly protecting their UK income fail to see that economically France is actually sinking quicker than the UK. Do they care ??? No. They are only looking after themselves and not seeing the wider picture.

Bless them. They have not got a clue about France.

[NormanH]

The most noticeable effect has been on the exchange rate, but that is in part because the cost to the Eurozone of Brexit will hit  even further in the future (although some French car manufacturers have started to worry about the effect of the higher prices of their cars in sterling hitting their UK sales).

On the other hand there are plenty of economic problems building up in Italy and Spain as well as France, so I wouldn't be surprised to see the pound rise against the Euro again in the medium term.

But  I know nothing about economics, and as I said above no real steps have yet been taken.

[idun]

Where are the comments, well there have been digs and what I call snipes in posts, on, what I consider, a very regular basis, without as has been pointed out, a proper discussion either. I haven't copied these comment or anything like that, but I have read them.

 This family is currency dependent. Have been for years. And as the french tend to operate many EU rules as and when they feel fit, then even if the negociations are OK, and 'fair', if they decide to get even in some way, they could leave us with problematic income for some time, knowing the fonctionnaires as I do, whilst it all gets sorted.

I shall not worry about it at all and simply get on with things. I can live very economically if I need to.

I have no idea why the £ dropped, in fact I have no idea why it did a few years ago and then about a year or so ago, crept up again. A senior FX bloke told me 6 years ago that it would go up again the following year, which, as it is his living, just shows that no one actually knows. The black art of the markets and in no way a science.

This weeks news:- unemployment down and people still spending. People are simply getting on with their lives and no one has mentioned it in weeks, apart from a jewish friend of mine who did, as they believed it was all down to racism. I explained why I hated the EU and it has nothing to do with racism and they said that they agreed with some of my arguments, not all but some, was OK by me.

[lindal1000]

I have no problems at all with people who voted in a different way to me, especially if they thought it through and some reasons for it. However all of that is in the past..and of course we must just get on with things..we don't have much choice anyway.

However there is an argument to say we should all be thinking about and contributing to the discussions the type of relationship we want with the EU in the future. Most people did not vote leave because they were racist, but nevertheless there are some very loud voices seeing this as a chance to adopt a very far right agenda and send 'home' everyone with a dark skin. I would love to hear discussions from all sides about where we go from here.

[Chancer]

There have been plenty of snipes one here, perhaps not as numerous and vociferous as the other place but then this is virtually a dead forum, that there is so little conflict is a credit to the remaining posters.

 

It would only serve to inflame things to quote some of the nasty snipes but I did paraphrase one jokingly only yesterday.

 

I would say that if you were with a group of like minded people in a pub you would not loudly proclaim your disdain of another not like minded group in earshot of others unless you were cruising for bruising. Calling Brexit voters idiots (or worse) and saying that you hope they will be feeling the pain, get their just desserts etc is probably going to offend a good proportion of people reading judging by the percentage of voters and what does it achieve?

 

A serious question, I really would like to know, its common enough in human nature, I really dislike it and really would like to understand the mindset.

 

ALBF your observation is right on the money.

[Pommier]

I thought it was a posting about waterfowl!

[alittlebitfrench]

Lindal 1000

I would put money on MLP being the next president of France next year. If not it will be very very very very close and people may (just may) club together to vote in Sarky just to prevent that from happening even if they don't want him from being president. If that does not happen your next French president will be MLP.

Where does that leave your logic ?

Which country is best under that scenario. Brexit UK or France ?

I am guessing for most British expats it comes down to house prices, countryside and the view. The rest is trivial.

[woolybanana]

And I thought that it was a discussion about contraception!

[Harnser]

Idun posted-

"It was done under the current voting system, and legally and above board"

Oh, please - don't try to legitimise the total farce that was the leave campaign.

It was a barrage of lies and promises that could not be kept, promulgated with the sole purpose of garnering leave votes.

And now the UK and us are stuck with the shabby result.

[Rabbie]

As someone who made no secret of the fact that I thought remaining in was the best for the UK I must admit to be disappointed in the result but what disappointed me more was the complete lack of a coherent plan on what to do next. It is clear that leaving the EU is not a trivial task and until we as a nation decide on the sort of deal we would like to achieve it is impossible to say how much better or worse off the UK will be.

I certainly hope that the Brexit people were right and I was wrong because I want the best for my country but we will have to wait and see what deal can be negotiated. My gut feeling, for what it is worth, is that the outcome will not be as rosy as some think but not as gloomy as others have prophesied but we will have to wait and see.

[alittlebitfrench]

Forget Brexit, I would be be more worried about the dire economic situation France is in. Well if you live here.

Is it me or is the whole of France up for sale on Le Bon Coin ?

[lindal1000]

ALBOF,..I think it highly unlikely the MLP will even be in the final two..but I didn't think the UK would vote leave!

The test will come on the US elections. If Trump wins then I really will believe that the world has moved irreversibly to the right and anything could happen. In that case I don't think that it will make much difference where we all live..but the quieter or more remote the better and somewhere to build a bunker! The other issue will be the re run of the Austrian election, which will give more of an idea for Europe.

I think Alain Juppe has more of a chance than Sarko.

I can't think why things would be any worse in France for us under a Sarkozy type government as income is not dependent on the French economy and I'm not worried about house prices. That said for many other people it might be worse. You should go back to UK and see if you like it but best to go before the UK leaves the EU, or else there's a chance that if French citizens are treated in the same way as non EU immigrants then you would have to earn more than £35000 pa to get a visa for them to live with you.

[alittlebitfrench]

JMLP was up against Chirac in the last two not so long ago and life was a lot better then. Opinion polls suggest that MLP will be in the last two.

Did I read correctly somewhere that 60 % ish French want out of the EU ? That is more than the British !!! Nobody talks about that. Just Brexit.

Personally, I am more interested in French politics because that is where I live.

[NormanH]

I was banned from a Facebook group because I posted about French politics and they were judged irrelevant to the group's aim which was ....helping Brits in France after Brexit...

I also annoyed people by explaining things such as  the French pensioners pay social charges on their pensions, and the British NI contributions might not count in France post-Brexit...

I think MLP will be in the last two, but I think the anti-EU sentiment has cooled a little after seeing what happened in the UK.

Remember I live in the biggest town to have a Maire  who is FN in all but name, and I have seen their election tactics which are not unlike those of Trump and UKIP...

[idun]

[quote user="Harnser"]Idun posted-

"It was done under the current voting system, and legally and above board"

Oh, please - don't try to legitimise the total farce that was the leave campaign.

It was a barrage of lies and promises that could not be kept, promulgated with the sole purpose of garnering leave votes.

And now the UK and us are stuck with the shabby result.[/quote]

I hope that little rant has been sent to the

guilty parties, complaining about their lies. If you take that route of complaining about every last lie that comes out of politicians mouths, you will spend the rest of your days writing to them and complaining.

What did you expect. Cameron said that he would have a referendum and for once, did as he said. It was all perfectly legitimate, how was it not........ ?  ..........and if YOU think that just because the result went against your wishes, makes the vote something other than legitimate, it still won't.

As far as I am concerned, it doesn't matter what lies 'parties' come out with........ as a general rule, I reckon, woe betide

anyone who believes a politician, because that is the route to

disappointment and dismay.

Yes, both sides

lied. Cameron could not even be bothered to try and improve things when

he was able to negociate, and that could well have affected the election

too. Why he did not, I have no idea, but maybe he was arrogant enough

to think that doing little was enough, but even those I know who were

anti brexit were terribly disappointed by his show of whimpy

weakness.........

.......... and it makes me wonder what the

other EU countries really wanted at that point. They knew there was an

election and yet they offered crumbs and nothing solid and good he could

offer to the voters. I feel sure that would have swayed many.

I

did not think that Brexit would win, I thought that fear of the unknown

would creep in as people got into their voting booth, but apparently

not. And those who couldn't be bothered to 'think' it out, and

complained later, well, they vote in all elections anyway, and probably

without thinking things through then either. And there is no way

to stop anyone who cannot be bothered get informed from voting.

[Rabbie]

I know from talking to friends that there were many different reasons for people voting as they did. Some voted for Brexit  because they wanted more money for the NHS, others because they wanted to fire a warning shot over Cameron's bows, others still because they they sincerely thought that leaving was the best for the UK. Regardless of why people voted as they did, the result is still valid and should be respected but  I believe that it is legitimate to point out where people have been lazy  and not researched the consequences of their vote in advance. In my mind there is a big difference between critising anonymous people who apparently did not do their research properly and making personal attacks on members of this forum. I have not noticed any such attacks but if anyone wants to report this type of post to the mods we will look into it.

[andyh4]

From what I have seen locally I too can see Marine in the last two (and we are not in a high migrant area - pied noires, Dutch or Brits - and if the other choice is either Sarky or an Hollande look alike, then I can see that an "anyone but Le Pen" vote will fail. Unlike Chirac's victory.