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marks out of 10 please for......


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I guess I must be in a minority of one in not having the slightest interest or even knowledge of something that I only recently became slightly aware of, people talking about something called BREXIT but not knowing any more than that.


Even my French friends seem concerned for me and are asking me my views, they are perplexed when I say I dont have a view, that I know nothing about it and what will be will be.


Indeed should I be bothered? Is there anything that might happen which could affect me other than just having to adapt one more time to changing conditions?


Serious question.

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Serious answer

If the referendum result is to stay in then there will be very little change except for the points covered in the agreement.

If the referendum result is to leave then we just don't know what will happen. It all depends on what new arrangements are made and there are nearly as many suggestions as there are people wanting to leave. If as some have suggested today the UK will require visas from EU citizens then it would not be surprising if EU countries required visas for UK citizens. To be honest nobody really knows what will happen if the UK votes to leave. Perhaps a clearer picture will emerge as we get closer to the vote

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Idun wrote,

And remember this govt, IDS's DWP,

has had absolutely no qualms about venomously attacking those poorest in society

and doing little for the indigenous population that needs help, because plenty

of people do. And yet, apparently money going abroad is considered OK, well not



Rabbie wrote,

For once in this debate I agree with Idun

about benefits being sent abroad and the way this government has leant on the

poorest in order to boost the wealthy. Let us not forget that in-work benefits

are a subsidy for the employer not for the employee. It seems reasonable to me

that anybody working a full week should be be paid enough to support themselves

and not need a top-up from the government.


+1 to both of the above.


To me it is clearly wrong that people in jobs such as teaching and the

police need to claim benefits to live.


My real pet hate about this government is the imposition of the ‘bedroom

tax’ on disabled people. As someone who knows the need first hand  of an extra

room to people in this situation, to penalise them by stopping some of their

housing payments is despicable.


If the UK can send millions, if not billions abroad in aid, then why are

there people in the UK who are denied medical treatments and drugs down to



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If it's true that Boris Johnson only gave Cameron 9 minutes' notice by text before speaking live on TV about his position on brexit, then I have to ask, where has good manners gone?

Bit of a gamble on Boris' part, unless of course, he know a bit more than we do?

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I do not believe that DC has got any agreements worthy of discussion. Just smoke and mirrors, reckon he thinks we are all stupid.

Just imagine, the UK is now not going to be forced into the €, it never was going to be forced into the €........ now if DC had got us out of helping bail the € out, that would have been an achievement.

Other things won't affect anything much either, as they are going to be phased out, as there is going to be the misnomer of the living wage......... just how can people manage on £7.20 an hour unless they work 70+hours a week. 

Boris, interesting innit that he has done that. Don't think that it will affect his political future, either one likes him or one doesn't. And DC surely knew that there was a chance that he would jump in that direction.

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It was always on the cards that Boris was going to oppose staying in and at the same time strike a blow at Cameron.

If there was a leave vote, Cameron might be forced to resign and Boris could potentially up his own political stakes.

I wasn't complaining about his tactics, he is ferociously ambitious but has been denying for years that he wants the "top job"....... fair enough, if he is now ready to jump ship.

No, what I didn't like was his manner of telling Cameron his decision.  Goodness knows, I detest Cameron with a vengeance but what Boris has done is both underhand and dreadfully ill-mannered, like someone breaking off a relationship by email or text because they do not have the guts or good manners to do it properly in person or at least by phone.

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Well, what a great day it was yesterday.  Boris is to be in the brexit

camp, and Donald has won SC  convincingly.  Jeb Bush has pulled out of the race

for the white house , as clearly America does not need another Bush in charge.

Our poor recently departed mod must be really pi55ed. [:)]
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"What did the EU ever do for us?

Not much, apart from: providing 57% of our trade; 

structural funding to areas hit by industrial decline; 

clean beaches and rivers; 

cleaner air; 

lead free petrol; 

restrictions on landfill dumping;

a recycling culture; 

cheaper mobile charges; 

cheaper air travel; 

improved consumer protection and food labelling;

a ban on growth hormones and other harmful food additives; 

better product safety; 

single market competition bringing quality improvements and better industrial performance; 

break up of monopolies; 

Europe-wide patent and copyright protection; 

no paperwork or customs for exports throughout the single market;

price transparency and removal of commission on currency exchanges across the eurozone;

freedom to travel, live and work across Europe;

funded opportunities for young people to undertake study or work placements abroad; 

access to European health services; 

labour protection and enhanced social welfare; 

smoke-free workplaces; 

equal pay legislation;

holiday entitlement; 

the right not to work more than a 48-hour week without overtime; 

strongest wildlife protection in the world; 

improved animal welfare in food production; 

EU-funded research and industrial collaboration; 

EU representation in international forums; 

bloc EEA negotiation at the WTO; 

EU diplomatic efforts to uphold the nuclear non-proliferation treaty; 

European arrest warrant; 

cross border policing to combat human trafficking, arms and drug smuggling; counter terrorism intelligence; 

European civil and military co-operation in post-conflict zones in Europe and Africa; 

support for democracy and human rights across Europe and beyond; 

investment across Europe contributing to better living standards and educational, social and cultural capital.

All of this is nothing compared with its greatest achievements: the EU has for 60 years been the foundation of peace between European neighbours after centuries of bloodshed. 

It furthermore assisted the extraordinary political, social and economic transformation of 13 former dictatorships, now EU members, since 1980. 

Now the union faces major challenges brought on by neoliberal economic globalisation, and worsened by its own systemic weaknesses. It is taking measures to overcome these. We in the UK should reflect on whether our net contribution of £7bn out of total government expenditure of £695bn is good value. We must play a full part in enabling the union to be a force for good in a multi-polar global future.

Simon Sweeney,

Lecturer in international political economy, University of York"

 the anti-EU campaign will have the full force of Murdoch's and the other 4 extremist right-wing media billionaires papers whose agenda is to destroy all our human rights.

As I wrote in The Prostitute State, over 80% of UK papers are owned by five extremist right wing media billionaires: Rupert Murdoch, (Sun/Times), Barclay Brothers (Telegraph), Richard Desmond (Express) and Lord Rothermere (Daily Mail).

Murdoch is Australian living in New York, Rothermere lives in France, the Barclay Brothers in the tax havens of Monaco and Guernsey. All of them use tax haven entities to avoid UK taxes.

So key question is in light of the above list, why have these billionaires for decades tried to destroy the EU?

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The main thrust of the debate to leave or stay has now been forever tainted by politicos jostling for position and not about what is best for our country.

Clearly Boris and Gove, with all their talk of "heavy hearts", "reluctantly coming to the decision" etc ad nauseam is nothing more than "well, above all, I have to see what's in it for me".

What is arguably one of the most important debates of recent political history has now been turned into a contest for the leadership of the Tory party.  I am disgusted by this turn of events.  Disgusted but also saddened because it's now all about which Tory will succeed Cameron when he steps down and not about sovereignty or Britain's economic future which should be the essentials to be mulled over[+o(]

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What a worthy list NH, but really, where would we have been if we hadn't gone in?

Frankly, some of the stuff on that list, we would have been 'bright' enough to sort out ourselves. 

And in spite of it all, how has the EU helped France, apart from proping up the agricultural sector, which is no longer working, seen the manif's on tv?

France has not moved into the 20th century with the way it does business, and that was not a typo.

It will, I imagine, alter my life if we come out, but in the grand scheme of things, my needs don't count for much and I remain completely unconvinced that coming out will be a catastrophe anymore than staying in will be 'good'.

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If you are referring to me Hoddy there was nothing in the posting that I replied to which broke any sensible code of conduct, just because I dont agree with peoples views does not mean they should be reported, I dont know what was written later, I dont mind you removing my comment if it spurned something which deserved deleting but I cannot see why the one I responded to should be removed, everyone is entitled to express their views.


This forum has been on its death bed for a very long time and now you are telling people not to add to threads?


forgive me if I missed anything contentious, I have been on a work break!

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You are not allowed to express your views in a public arena if they break the law, and referring to people of a particular colour, religion, ethnic group or race in a way that may stir up hatred against them is against the law and punishable by a custodial sentence. Any public forum that allows that is laying itself open to be prosecuted. What you say to people in private is entirely up to you but forums are not private places. I think you'll also find it is against the forum rules.
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I'm confused, was it the posting that I replied to, my reply or a subsequent posting that caused the thread removal?


I had said that I didnt appreciate that type of posting and encouraged the person to do more of the reasoned type that he had done in the last few days but the posting in question was no different to any that he had done for as long as I can remember and none of those were deleted hence my confusion regarding the code of conduct or perhaps its application.

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I’m sorry I’ve not been available this afternoon to come back to this thread.

Chancer it was the post that you replied to that broke the Code of Conduct.

I deleted it and so your (and other people’s) responses made no sense without it.

I am sorry that this has offended you.

I was not in any way suggesting that the thread was closed, only asking that people press the report button if they see something which breaks forum rules so that this kind of confusion does not arise.

I now understand that the “Report” button is not working properly anyway so I will ask forum admin to check that out.
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Dont worry, I was not offended Hoddy! Well only be the posting that I commented on!


It was no worse than many I have read before from that poster and they were always in the same vein on exactly the same subject even if the thread wasn't, except that is for a couple of reasonable and reasoned ones in the last couple of days. They were never deleted before but the fact that they are now can only be a good thing.

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[quote user="You can call me Betty"]Whatever the outcome, even the most hale and hearty among us will only have to live with the fallout for twenty or thirty years at best. Our children and grandchildren will have to live with it for the rest of their lives.[/quote]

Mr Russethouse asked both our children what they thought, which was stay in, and will vote accordingly because they will be the ones living with the decision.

I'm not certain if this was a brilliant idea or just a wheeze so he hasn't got to listen to months of EU discussion ;-)

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I'm inclined to do the same, RH. I think the "older" generation has become (in general) far too self-centred in recent years, without giving much consideration to the idea that a lot of the things they'd like to happen in order for them to feel comfortable, whether financially or psychologically, have a severe knock-on effect on their children and grandchildren.

And, as an aside, I've seen more older people on TV saying "I'm undecided, but I'm going to vote "no" " than I thought possible. What's that about?
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