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mazandcol, I agree that the piece you have posted is full of interest and also clarity.  I have to admit that the financial shenanigans behind Brexit, whilst not unacknowledged by me, do not loom as large as the political, social and constitutional implications.

In fact, I happened upon an excellent broadcast this afternoon by Professor Vernon Bogdanor on what Brexit could mean both for us and for Europe. It's the first time I have heard about protected and unprotected constitutions.  Apparently, our constitution, famously "unwritten" has been protected by treaties made within the EU.  No more protection for many of our rights, conventions and practices that have been so painstakingly agreed within the EU and power would reside more in governments than in the justice system.  So what happens to the checks and balances to the balance of power?  Now you begin to understand how dangerous it is to call judges "the enemies of the people", as some right-wing press and politicians did back at the time of the triggering of Article 50.

Interesting that he ended with a quote from Mitterand who said, "la nationalisme, c'est la guerre".  And this is what I fear the most, social and political unrest that could lead to violence, or perhaps I should say even more violence, on our streets and the return of "the troubles" on the Irish border.

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NH you are right no one knows the will of the people at the moment.

The people I know have forbidden all talk of it when we get together, saying that they just want it over with and now is the not the time for chewing the cud.

Below is what the ballot paper said and that was it. ( link should be live ).  No hard or soft or not at all......... remain, or leave c'est tout.

And the majority voted leave. This is not rocket science, it was clear. Whatsoever the politicians said prior, well woe betide anyone who actually believes them. However, there was nothing fancy on the ballot paper so argue about later.

Who knows what the actual future will hold, I am not talking about our tiny time on this earth and it will be what it will be.

If there had been a remain vote, I would still have hated the EU, but really I had not expected all this chucking dummies out of the pram.

very sick and fed up Idun

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I do not support Boris but Boris did get a grip; he has put all sides of the debate up against a sensible deadline, which includes Brussels.

There had been enough shrill debate and idiocy full of sound and fury leading precisely nobloodywhere.

And too many primadonna MPs who have forgotten whom they represent as they strut and rant and rage their hour on the stage shortly to be heard no more!

The hysterical response to his move has been unjustified and frankly stupid.

When there is a traffic snarl up someone has to get out of their b loody car and sort it out. He did that. Now there is clear sight of what can be done.

Instead of behaving like a load of whining ninnies who have just seen a spider in their shoes, those who oppose a dealless Brexit should have come together and offered clean cut proposals which can garner the support they need, as well as a one issue, short term leader, which does not mean Popeye the Labour man.

And gone for a second referendum.

We must not forget that there are things happening behind the scenes in Brussels which could yet iron out some of the bumps in the camels back.
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Interestingly, to get his legislation through, Macron also bypassed his

parliament, deemed too obstructive even with his majority.

That worked out well

for Macron, still I guess the manufacturers of yellow vests are


I see our new dictator

is today threatening to ignore any law that may get passed to stop a

no-deal Brexit. How very democratic, but what choice does he have?

Please pass me the sick bag.

Overnight Johnson has

turned the UK into Bongo Bongo Land, by preventing democratically

elected members of parliament having a say in the most important

legislation to appear before parliament since the second world war.

He has managed to drag The Queen into the sordid mess, and has

created disquiet within The Commonwealth.

I just wonder what the

media (for that read right-wing press), would be printing if a Labour

government, especially one that had Corbyn as PM had just pulled this

stunt. Far different headlines I could guarantee for sure.

Excellent posts

lindal1000 and mint, definitely thumbs up from me.

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I agree with all those comments Grecian, lindal1000 and mint. By the way mint, the article was about the motives behind Brexit being financial - the social and political consequences are not only horrendous, but also suit the long term profit-making plans behind it all. Welcome back 19th century England.
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[quote user="Grecian"]
Overnight Johnson has

turned the UK into Bongo Bongo Land, [/quote]

As this is not the first time you've referenced the above terminology on here, here's a heads up regarding your choice of language which I would expect is not exactly acceptable in 2019. Oh, apparently UKIP have even banned the term so it looks as though you could be in good company if you erase it from your vocabulary.

By the way which did you vote, Leave or Remain?

From Wikipedia: "Bongo Bongo Land"

In British English, Bongo Bongo Land (or Bongo-bongo Land) is a "pejorative" term used to refer to Third World countries, particularly in Africa, or to a fictional such country.

From Wikipedia: "pejorative"

A pejorative (also called a derogatory term,a slur, a term of disparagement)

is a word or grammatical form expressing a negative connotation or a

low opinion of someone or something, showing a lack of respect for

someone or something. It is also used to express criticism, hostility, or disregard.

Sometimes, a term is regarded as pejorative in some social or ethnic

groups but not in others, or may be originally pejorative and eventually

be adopted in a non-pejorative sense (or vice versa) in some or all


Power to the people brother

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Mint you wrote

'Much as I dislike crude labelling of people, I think that "Boris the Dictator" might not be too out inaccurate.'

Sorry, I disagree and to my mind it is "Boris the Puppet". Seems that Dominic Cummings is the Prime Minister / Dictator.

Just wonder what will happen if the UK leaves without a deal and disaster happens?......I shudder to think.
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Paul, I do not disagree about Boris the Puppet.

And here is the government's own advice to people to prepare for no deal:

I hope you continue to be able to bring your doggies to France without too much bother[:)]

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We do not know how Corbyn would be as PM and we are unlikely to ever know as he is no PM material.

As for Thatcher, even she did not act as outrageously as Boris has done.  Do you think that two wrongs can make a right?

So you accept that, in our largely unwritten constitution, Boris has acted correctly and honourably? 

Not only do you not question the divine right of kings, but you readily acquiesce to the divine right of Boris?

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[quote user="mint"]
Paul, I do not disagree about Boris the Puppet.

And here is the government's own advice to people to prepare for no deal:

I hope you continue to be able to bring your doggies to France without too much bother[:)]


We had the blood test for rabies anti-bodies carried out in December....£160, that did include the certificate to show he has the correct level.

Reading the latest guidance it seems that all that is required is an inspection by a UK vet 10 days before travel and the dog (cat etc) can re-enter the UK up to 4 months from the vet visit. No mention of a visit to a vet in the foreign land so looks like they will miss out on the current visits.

Interesting bit on BBC News last night whereby a businessman AND a BBC financial reporter did not know a term used by the UK Government. Still, 8 weeks to learn and put in to action.
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Hopefully it will not be necessary.

But according to my reading then, as France is not tapeworm free (EU countries listed as free are Finland, Ireland and Malta) then people will still need to visit a vet abroad 1 day to 5 days before travel back to get that done.


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Truthfully I have not watched one bit of proper UK news since last week, the odd unavoidable  headline, but no more.

I am just wondering what the EU will do. As far as I can see there is a deadline and that is the end of October and I do so wish they would say that it cannot change.

Corbyn any sort of PM beurk, do not trust the man one little bit, of all the rabble, I trust him least.

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