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How do les Anglais Make You Wince?


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[quote user="Dick Smith"]How, Catalpa, is this of my making? And what, if anything, has it got to do with anything else?
[/quote]

I think, Dick, she's trying to point out that you have to behave in a  reasonably grown-up way to become a moderator [;-)]

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[quote user="St Amour"]

Hi Debra

Yes I'm Coco.  I think it was when some new software was loaded a while ago that I got logged out, forgot my old password for logging in and had also changed my email so admin couldn't send me a reminder of my password so I had to take on a new username and one of my favourite wines seemed quite appropriate [:-))]

[/quote]Aha - maybe you should load your old avatar up so we get a hint!!
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Ahhh, now there lies a story.  I tried several times but I was a failure.  I've forgotten how.  But if you want to give me a simple (very simple) lesson, I'll have another go.  Or maybe I'll wait a couple of days til my new lucarne is finished and then I can show off my new look house!![:D]
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Kathie, I wasn't in a strop.  But I don't like being insulted. I also don't like when other posters come out of the woodwork to put in their little digs. You want to take the mickey, OK. But don't think that I think you are clever for doing it.

You might also consider that unlike Coco and Catalpa I have had the bottle to put my details into my profile. Interestingly all I know about Catalpa is that she lives in Southern Manche. Where my house is. We may be neighbours. Nice of her to be so polite. Again.

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I'm going to edit this for clarity

 

Dick, I know use your real name but everyone has the option whether to use their  own name or a 'forum name' of their choice here. If people chose to take use a 'made up' name that is their right.

Mod hat on

As for the current 'spat' Are you sure Normandy is big enough both of you ? [:D]

I'd be grateful if you could both (St Amour & Dick) keep the derogatory personal remarks out of it, please.

Thanks

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Please indulge me for returning to this point but I would just like to add my experience to the 'language change' debate. It seems to me only fair that the Welsh perspective is recorded.

Welsh is my first language - English my second and French my third. During my career, I have worked in Mid Wales, North Wales and South Wales as well as in England (and that was brilliant too!!). I am however not a Nationalist and in fact disagree quite strongly with most of their policies. I have NEVER been in a situation where I have been speaking English to my fellow Welsh speakers and then switched to English when the Sais (the English) walk in. This is something I really don't understand. When you have walked in and experienced this - how much of the conversation have you actually heard?? What doesn't make sense to me is why Welsh speakers would speak English to each other in the first place? When Welsh people know someone else can speak Welsh (and God knows there aren't that many of us!!) they will always speak Welsh with them. For those of you who may be fluent in more than one language, you will appreciate that it is so unnatural to speak to someone you know well in another language. The whole relationship seems to be 'false'. I did read the posting about the person who initially didn't know the man who'd lost his wallet, and I can only say that the Welsh can very 'private' people and were probably reluctant to divulge the man's identity as they didn't know you themselves and were uncertain of your business with that person - Maybe right, maybe wrong, but that's sometimes just the way we are!!

Oh and  if you think I'm going away from the thread, I am not. The ways that les Anglais make me wince is when they speak increasingly loudly in English in order to try to get a French person to understand what they want.  It would seem (perhaps unfortuante for some) however that the SE 'plummy' voice seems to carry way beyond any other (either that or because they really do shout louder!!). There have been may times when my husband and I have been tipped with wink by a waiter, allowed him to have his 'fun' when he pretends not to understand an order, and then been called on to help out!!

P.S. In my experience of reading what Coco, St Amour or whatever you wish to call her, has to say - I'd say she is a pretty good judge of people. It is rare for me to post on the Forum, as you will know but I do keep up to date with all your postings.  Don't stop sharing your opinions St Amour - that's what this forum is for - isn't it??

 

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[quote user="Dick Smith"]  You want to take the mickey, OK. But don't think that I think you are clever for doing it.

[/quote]

I didn't intend to 'take the mickey' or insult - it just made me smile that you got so hot under the collar about it. 

Hastobe

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Well I'm glad to see that Calva has stood up for the Welsh contingent.  I think that she makes a very good point about exactly WHY would native Welsh speakers choose to speak English in preference to Welsh amongst themselves.  Perhaps some English people get just a little paranoid about this whole thing.

My friend, who is a native Welsh speaker, finds that when she speaks in English she sometimes runs out of words before she reaches the end of the sentance because English is, after all, her second language, and she realises that she has started the sentance wrongly in the first place and therefore struggles to finish it.  I have also overheard her talking to her mum on the phone on several occasions and there are many words that the Welsh don't have and therefore use the English for, as with the French "weekend" "parking" etc etc.  Sometimes I think my friend is speaking in English and then I realise that she's actually having a conversation with her Welsh speaking mum.  I wonder if perhaps, when you only catch the first few words of a conversation, before the brain totally tunes in, if you hear a few English words you naturally assume that the whole conversation was in English, then changed to Welsh.  Just a thought!

Also, Calva puts the "other side" of the argument about the lost wallet situation.  I read this posting out to my husband and he said that if a stranger came round here asking questions about our neighbour Thierry we may play dumb, until they further enlightened us as to WHY they wanted to know if we knew him.  There are, always, two sides to every situation.

[:)]

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[quote user="Dick Smith"]Then perhaps some sensitivity might be in order, rather than winding someone up.
Why is the answer always 'It was just a joke'?

Cheers.
[/quote]

I think I could find a few examples of you using this excuse yourself Dickie.  But of course, I can't be bothered to trawl through past postings to find them - more important things to do, like have a life.  Don't worry about it so much.  If people annoy you, treat them with the contempt they deserve [;-)]  You KNOW it makes sense. [:)]

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St Amour wrote:

"I read this posting out to my husband and he said that if a stranger came round here asking questions about our neighbour Thierry we may play dumb, until they further enlightened us as to WHY they wanted to know if we knew him."

Is your husband Welsh then St Amour!!??

 

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At our local Troc, there is a woman with her husband (I hope she is reading this) whose visits coincide with mine unfortunately.  She walks around squalking in a whingey English voice, (somewhere South of England) really loudly.  I am friendly with the staff, they are lovely and they smile at me knowingly when she walks up to them and just speaks in English as if she were in England.  Not even one polite word in French or English she constantly asks"how much is that then".  They don't speak very good English but I can tell she really gets on their nerves, and rightly so they wind her up.  Needless to say I remain under cover.

Georgina

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Just thought I'd poke my nose in and point out that the Welsh are not a 'race', they are a 'nationality'.  To take a dig at them is not being racist at all unless you are black or asian. Those are 'races'. If you are english, Scottish, Irish, French, Sandinavian, American, Italian, Greek, Lebanese, Arabic, Dutch, German, I could go on but I think you get my point, you are within the same racial group as the Welsh so while you might be being offensive you are not actually being racist in the true sense of the word. Just the same as taking a dig at a Muslim, it might be ignorant but it isn't 'racist' as to be Muslim is a faith and not a race or even a nationality. I just get fed up with the tag 'racist' being applied to anyone and everything these days.
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The ICERD (International Convention on the Elimination of All Forms of Racial Discrimination) defines racism as follows:

“Any distinction, exclusion, restriction, or preference based on race, colour, descent, or national or ethnic origin...”

Race can be defined as a group of people united or classified together on the basis of common history, nationality or geographic distribution.
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Couldn't agree more (Edited: to Wen's post on racial definitions: Just realised that this was confusing, as Benedicte's post was captured before mine![:$]).

Sadly, actions for racism have been brought, successfully, under the Race Relationship Act and Employment Law, by Welsh, Irish and Scottish people.

More of the PR gone mad area.[:-))]

 

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I take it you're agreeing with wen, gluey fella, rather than benedicte?

I thought PC gone mad was things like not being able to call black coffee, black coffee, not about people getting seriously narked by sweeping statements about whole groups (nations or races) of people.

 

 

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A ridiculously PC explanation if ever I saw one. Soon the milkman will be classified racist if he criticises the grocer!. And there are those who'd support it too!. I'll stick to the real world. Anyone for an Irish joke?

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