The abolition of French Departments

[Logan]

Plans are afoot to change the way our number plates are displayed with the removal of the department number and impose the more anonymous European style matriculation plate. In addition plans are also being discussed to abolish departments altogether. Alor!! I feel this change may help to make France less bureaucratic and regions more integrated. I confess personal irritation because I live on the borders of 2 departments and the ‘us and them’ scenario is discernable. I think their abolition might bring some positive changes to life here.

http://news.independent.co.uk/europe/article3342198.ece

[Bugsy]

[IMG]http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p211/Bugbear2/NewNoPlates.jpg[/IMG]

These were the last plans I saw regarding plaques and, as you can see, the regions are retained but shown in a different format.

[Deimos]

Other than "pride" and similar reasons, I've not seen any real justifications for the continual re-registration of vehicles when you move.  It does seem like more paperwork and keeping people in pointless jobs, etc.  However, might be that I'm not seen the important justification for this bureaucracy.

The "get rid of departments" is an interesting one given that they have just spent what must have been quote a lot of money passing Route Nationales to the departments and going through re-doing loads of road signs, maps, etc.  Given that that process (and costs) is just about complete, probably about the right timescales to go and change it all again.

Ian

[raindog]

It'll certainly be simpler and more logical, but will take away the fun and romance of seeing where vehicles come from.

But as bugbear says, the department number will still be displayed at the edge of the "plate" so i'm all for it.

But I saw on the news where some communities are demonstrating against it.

[Kitty]

It's ridulous that you have to re-register when you move.  I spent an unpleasant time amongst crowds of people in front of the Bordeaux prefecture when I went to register my car.  People had taken a day off work to do it and just because they had moved departments.  Pointless.  At the very least, they should be able to do it online.

Why do we need to know where the car has come from?  It encourages parochialism (is that how you spell the word?!).

 

[CBC]

But won't we still have to change the carte grise when we move, if only to show the change of address, so although the number plate won't change we'll still be paying for a change in paperwork.  And you can bet your bottom dollar that the cost will remain the same, even though only element is changing ..

I agree it would be great to be able to do stuff like that online!

CBC

[Cerise]

I hope they do something about the inter-department non-communication.  In local Tourist Office we have the ridiculous situation where we have trouble getting info for the 2 nearest attraction because they are in other departments.  We're on the border of 3 departments.  The river which is the department border runs through the village.  If you live in one part of the village, which officially is another village in another department, and a member of your family should die you have to get a prefectoral agreement for them to be taken over the bridge to the cemetery!  This kind of daft departmental rule makes living where we do both hilarious and frustrating.  Recently we introduced charges for our 'salle informatique' - with a special cheap tariff for those in the commune.  Then it was realised that half the village actually lived in another commune, indeed another department, and if the rules were applied our own volunteers would end up paying more than holidaymakers staying on the campsite.   Chaos rules!

[Frenchie]

You seem to all agree, maybe because you are English. Personnally I prefer to keep the number of the separtment, I like to see where a car comes from.

Maybe it has to do with childhood games when my dad was driving us to britanny, from the cote d azur, and we had to guess where the cars came from,  it' s difficult to explain, it s a French tradition, I wouldn't like it to change.

 I d like to know the other French members ' reaction to it .

[groslard]

Not a lot of problems knowing where this one comes from:

Oblivious

[Kitty]

[quote user="Frenchie"]

You seem to all agree, maybe because you are English. Personnally I prefer to keep the number of the separtment, I like to see where a car comes from.

Maybe it has to do with childhood games when my dad was driving us to britanny, from the cote d azur, and we had to guess where the cars came from,  it' s difficult to explain, it s a French tradition, I wouldn't like it to change.

 I d like to know the other French members ' reaction to it .

[/quote]

Frenchie - Our car registrations in England used to be regional.  HA and HD were Bristol, for example.  AE was Gloucestershire.  But when personalised numbers came in big time, everything changed.  I don't miss it, even though Dad and I would play the same game (using an 'I Spy' book) as your Dad and you.

 

 

[Kitty]

Without department numbers, how would blue-eyed Arthur play 'Deal or No Deal' or whatever it is called here?

 

[Clair]

[quote user="Cathy"]

Without department numbers, how would blue-eyed Arthur play 'Deal or No Deal' or whatever it is called here?

[/quote]

The game (A prendre ou à laisser) is based on the French regions, not departements.

[Frenchie]

And Arthur is brown eyed!!

 [:D]

[Benjamin]

[quote user="Coolbikerchick"]But won't we still have to change the carte grise when we move, if only to show the change of address, so although the number plate won't change we'll still be paying for a change in paperwork.  And you can bet your bottom dollar that the cost will remain the same, even though only element is changing ..

I agree it would be great to be able to do stuff like that online!

CBC

[/quote]

You don't actually pay to change your address (well certain not here in 85).

What you have to remember is that the French used to buy a vehicle and then keep it for years and years and absolutely never more from the department where you were born. It's a bit of local pride as far as I'm concerned. If anybody says to me "you're from the Vendée then" they then have difficulty shutting me up as I gone on forever extolling her virtues'.

And they'll never get me to stop having my departmental sticker on the back of my car/trailer/bike. [:D]

[CBC]

Soz, you are quite right about not paying for change of address at the moment.  Let's hope that doesn't change when they only have revenue on cartes grises from new registrations.

[Georgina]

[quote user="Frenchie"]

You seem to all agree, maybe because you are English. Personnally I prefer to keep the number of the separtment, I like to see where a car comes from.

Maybe it has to do with childhood games when my dad was driving us to britanny, from the cote d azur, and we had to guess where the cars came from,  it' s difficult to explain, it s a French tradition, I wouldn't like it to change.

 I d like to know the other French members ' reaction to it .

[/quote]

Sorry Frenchie, but there is no logic to your plea. How can you justify hours of wasted time and the expense of the paperwork out of your simple curiosity.  It is documented well enough in the plate number (no matter what it is) all the details required to those that need to know (like the police and authorities).  Much as we love French traditions, when it involved this endless expense and form filling, I'm afraid, I prefer (and I don't think I just speak for myself) not to waste either. Plus think of the tax savings your department could make.[:)]  France really has to cut down on paperwork, for the sake of the environment too.

Georgina

[Frenchie]

Sorry but I see a French logic to my opinion.

I don't want to go all "  European anonymous" ..  IWhen will you ask for the end of regions? the end of countries maybe ??

When your own country has not adopted the euro,... and we have to queue up in post offices and banks where there are clercks paid to make the change .. And paper used ( to sign on etc ..)

If you want to use this logic.. well, use it both ways......)  [;-)]

Oh and the carbon footprint.. how PC ..   So maybe we should stop all Xmas lights to save energy, no Xmas cards  .. so much paper used .............

Oh come on............ 

[Georgina]

 I don't see a logic to your argument here either, and this has nothing to do with England adopting the euro (although of course I wish it would as I have lost a great deal of money recently. Sorry.[:)] Perhaps because "je suis Anglaise" but in the tradition of my Englishness, I am prepared to agree to tolerate our differences.[:D]

[5-element]

I don't understand the dilemna, IF it is true that the number of the department will still figure on the number plate - right hand side.

Then we can continue to play those games "Oh look, they are from Strasbourg/Lyon/Toulouse" or "Ah! c'est bien des Parisiens, tiens!"

Isn't it one of those rare win-win situations? Unless I am missing some vital clue.

[Frenchie]

Well, ask your French neighbours, friends.. The vast majority of French people are against this measure.

We want to keep the number of departement on our plates, and we are fed up with Brussels imposing things perceived as another step to a Europe we don't want .. We want Europe I think, but a social Europe, not the anonymous and insipid model they want to impose.

We feel the plates as they are are part of a French identity, even if you find it hard to understand.

The only time when they asked the French  what their opinion was, the European treaty was massively rejected.

Being European is something different, and we want to keep our cheeses and plates   LOL

AH lala, ces politiciens, ils sont " à côté de la plaque" !! [:D]

[Clair]

[quote user="5-element"]I don't understand the dilemna, IF it is true that the number of the department will still figure on the number plate - right hand side. Then we can continue to play those games "Oh look, they are from Strasbourg/Lyon/Toulouse" or "Ah! c'est bien des Parisiens, tiens!" Isn't it one of those rare win-win situations? Unless I am missing some vital clue.[/quote]

From what I have read, the mention of departement will be optional. When it is mentioned, it will be in quite small lettering compared to the actual registration number (picture here)

[Logan]

[quote user="Frenchie"]

Well, ask your French neighbours, friends.. The vast majority of French people are against this measure.

[/quote]

Nothing new there then. This and 800 other changes. Admit it Frenchie the French hate change and oppose anything new in the name of tradition. The British do that as well, that's why countries need leaders who are brave enough to force through change in the teeth of opposition. It's called leadership.[:)]

[Frenchie]

Un bon leader ne gouverne pas à contre courant. Il n impose pas, il convainct , monsieur ..

Anyway, the vast majority of people will have the optional number on their plate,  I ll be the first ..

And I'm far from being against any kind of change, in my job, I ve welcome the CECRL, people applauded the carte vitale, the PACS, etc 

[5-element]

[quote user="Clair"]
From what I have read, the mention of departement will be optional. When it is mentioned, it will be in quite small lettering compared to the actual registration number (picture here)
[/quote]

 

Ah I see. We'll need to take binoculars on car journeys now, if we want to continue playing spot the departement ...

It will be interesting to see who decides to have their departement number, and who does not. I wonder what criteria people will use, if it is left to individual choice?

[Clair]

I gather the decision will be taken by the original owner, as the number plate will last as long as the car.

But I suppose it will be possible for a "damaged" [Www] plate to be replaced by a subsequent owner, in which case, the dept number might well be added if it does not show...