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Surviving on a UK Pension


Bannon
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[quote user="Benjamin"][quote user="Ron Avery"]Benjamin, I took the UK pension of £720 and converted it at the rate I got from HSBC's new auto trnsfer facility  on Tuesday for a transfer of less than £5k of £1 to 1.23€..  [/quote]


Lead me gently by the hand here. So that's £180 per week. Is it something to do with a married couple's pension?


[/quote]

Benjamin  I have no idea what the UK OAP is, far too young[;-)], but  if you read page 1 of this thread that is what Pads and others says that it is.

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[quote user="Bannon"]

Seems then we are between a rock and a hard place. Struggle on a pension here in France or struggle on a pension back in the UK. Reckon we'll take our chances here and see how it works out. At least it's warmer.... well, sometimes anyway :-)

Thanks again for your input guys. 

[/quote]

The biggest unknown and the biggest risk is the future exchange rate. UK pensions at 1.50€ may look doable, at 1.25 the belt has to be tightened but at 1:1 ??

One answer to staying in France may be to sell up (if you can find a buyer) and then rent. OK you lose the gite income but you also lose the work and you have the option of whittling away at the capital if income falls too much.  

When you find the cast iron answer please let me know.

John 

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Bannon, I believe that BJSLIV has raised a very interesting point in that would you be entitled to additional State support in the UK, such as pension credits, that you do not have access to whilst living in France.

I have a suspicion the the UK government will allow the basic UK State pension to fall further behind increases in real earnings and instead protect low income pensioners by increasing pension credits. That might put low income expat individuals like yourself in a difficult situation in that you lose out on State support that otherwise you would be entitled.

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Ah yes, that is an interesting point Sprogster and one I have been mulling over - looks like we might be heading up a financial cul-de-sac then. The other puzzle is that with pension credits being available from the age of sixty, is it not a route to early retirement? or am I missing something?

The other option is to return to the UK, get my pension credits, and come back to France... but I'm sure the guys in Newcastle have sussed that one out :-) .....although we did manage to get our winter fuel payment paid which is as they say, better than a poke in the eye.

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Pension credits are only available to women at 60 who qualify for the state pension and who are fiscally domiciled in UK. Perhaps the solution for you is to remain registered in the UK but if you wish spend your time in France.
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Bannon ... how about you keep you house/ address in the UK . then do long term holiday swops of homes with people who have got them selves stuck in france and cant afford to come back even through they want to . and there seems to be a few of these people on different forums. or just holiday swaps that way you could get to see lots of areas in france with out losing your status in the UK ?

What area are you in ? is it a area people would want to come to ? if not maybe your next move could be with in the UK to a more desirable area.

Its jut an idea ...... which will probally now be shot to peices by people who know how to spell[:P]   

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Pension Credits are only available (and means tested!) if a couple have less than £9,000 in savings, property etc etc. All bank and sacings  accounts are accessed by the Inland Revenue and available to the Pensions Agency so it is not possible to "hide" income or savings. So it is possible for a couple to have absolutely NO income of any sort but should they have savings at or above that level, then they will get no support.

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We've actually worked out that we could not afford to retire in the UK - mainly because our Council Tax is five times the amount in UK than France and that is for a small 2-bed terrace house.

Once you calculate heating etc, in France we have a log burner plus a bit of land, so can cut our own trees, we can have chickens and grow veg, Hubby is a bee-keeper. Here in Uk we have to work to pay mortgage and insurances on house. Have no land so buy everything.

Answer, sell house, pay off bills. House in France mortgage free then live off pensions. For us the sum means we are ok, not flush but can manage.

I know too many elderly British who are not looking forward to this winter, tax credits or not, they still find it a struggle to survive. The answer is France- friends, something to keep active and healthy, England, watch tele and talk to no-one cos they can be too miserable from trying to survive!

 

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We are in quite a rural area with not much in the way of facilities, a small terraced house in a village. In the Uk we are in the touristy area so for our small terrace here we are paying well in excess of £1000 and set to rise again.

UK prices are not geared to what can be paid, more how much can we fleece them and get away with it I feel.

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[quote user="Keni "]

We've actually worked out that we could not afford to retire in the UK - mainly because our Council Tax is five times the amount in UK than France and that is for a small 2-bed terrace house.

Once you calculate heating etc, in France we have a log burner plus a bit of land, so can cut our own trees, we can have chickens and grow veg, Hubby is a bee-keeper. Here in Uk we have to work to pay mortgage and insurances on house. Have no land so buy everything.

Answer, sell house, pay off bills. House in France mortgage free then live off pensions. For us the sum means we are ok, not flush but can manage.

I know too many elderly British who are not looking forward to this winter, tax credits or not, they still find it a struggle to survive. The answer is France- friends, something to keep active and healthy, England, watch tele and talk to no-one cos they can be too miserable from trying to survive!

 

[/quote]

 

Not wishing to spoil the dream but do consider what happens when you become too frail to cut the trees, the garden is full of weeds you cannot keep on top of and the chickens have to be kept under cover because of some bird flu scare and you don't have the cover.

 

Rose tinted glasses back on.

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[quote user="Keni "]

We've actually worked out that we could not afford to retire in the UK - mainly because our Council Tax is five times the amount in UK than France and that is for a small 2-bed terrace house.

Once you calculate heating etc, in France we have a log burner plus a bit of land, so can cut our own trees, we can have chickens and grow veg, Hubby is a bee-keeper. Here in Uk we have to work to pay mortgage and insurances on house. Have no land so buy everything.

Answer, sell house, pay off bills. House in France mortgage free then live off pensions. For us the sum means we are ok, not flush but can manage.

I know too many elderly British who are not looking forward to this winter, tax credits or not, they still find it a struggle to survive. The answer is France- friends, something to keep active and healthy, England, watch tele and talk to no-one cos they can be too miserable from trying to survive!

 

[/quote]

 

Not wishing to spoil the dream but do consider what happens when you become too frail to cut the trees, the garden is full of weeds you cannot keep on top of and the chickens have to be kept under cover because of some bird flu scare and you don't have the cover.

 

Rose tinted glasses back on.

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[quote user="andyh4"]

Not wishing to spoil the dream but do consider what happens when you become too frail to cut the trees, the garden is full of weeds you cannot keep on top of and the chickens have to be kept under cover because of some bird flu scare and you don't have the cover.

[/quote]

Hopefully you do not become too frail for a long time to come , when you do , sell the house and move into rented accommodation and live on the proceeds .

 I`m with Keni do your sums correct and France can be a better life.

 ( my rose lunettes never come off [:P])

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[quote user="Keni "]

We are in quite a rural area with not much in the way of facilities, a small terraced house in a village. In the Uk we are in the touristy area so for our small terrace here we are paying well in excess of £1000 and set to rise again.

UK prices are not geared to what can be paid, more how much can we fleece them and get away with it I feel.

[/quote]

Your gain from a cheaper council tax in France is completely wiped out by the need to pay a mutuelle for healthcare top up. Of course a mutuelle is not obligatory and taking the risk yourself is something I have advocated in other threads but it's still a risk you don't have in UK. Do not fool yourself that living in France is cheaper than England. It is all swings and roundabouts. You gain one thing at the cost of another.

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[quote]Your gain from a cheaper council tax in France is completely wiped out by the need to pay a mutuelle for healthcare top up.[/quote]

It is important to work with precise figures because everyone's case will be different. Our Taxe d'habitation (fantastic value @ only € 301) + mutuelle (€ 1400 for two of us) add up to just 63% of our last UK Council Tax bill (and the houses are pretty much like-for-like: 4+2+2 but here, in a village, we have pluses like big garden, cave, sous-sol and outsize garage to offset against the town location in UK). The overall €1000 p.a. saving is worth having. Of course, exactly how the numbers will work for the OP I have no idea.

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Reading these replies I don't think there is any difference now between the two countries as to surviving on a small pension. Millions of retired french people survive on next to nothing here especially those who were farm labourers or small farmers themselves. Its all a question of what your priorities are. What you save on one thing here another item cancels it out especially when you have to drive twice as far to do the weekly shop or see the doctor as public transport is far and few between. For those on low pensions in the UK at least they can speak about their problems easily to the authorities concerned especially the council tax which I cannot believe can be more than someone has coming in annually,that sounds like a miscalculation rather than here where they will not qualify for any help until they have paid into the system for some years first. Raising chickens and chopping your own wood does not put physical euros on your table to pay your utilities with or your health mutuelle and old properties need yearly maintenance too.
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Also I believe you will have access to a proper healthcare service, the best in the world, when you need it, with no delays in treatment.

As we are not yet in France, I state "I believe", but I can be sure that the UK healthcare is very long winded, leaving people to die, whilst waiting for life saving treatment, or denying them drugs, as they are considered too expensive.

We only ever hear of excellent healthcare in France, this cannot be said of the UK.

Lets face it, this healthcare is worth whatever extra you may have to pay, even more so as you get older,

[quote user="chessfou"] 
Our Taxe d'habitation (fantastic value @ only € 301) + mutuelle (€ 1400 for two of us) add up to just 63% of our last UK Council Tax bill (and the houses are pretty much like-for-like: 4+2+2 but here, in a village, we have pluses like big garden, cave, sous-sol and outsize garage to offset against the town location in UK). The overall €1000 p.a. saving is worth having. [/quote]

AND.....you can also SAVE a thousand euros PA. [:)]

 

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[quote user="BJSLIV"]

exactly how the numbers will work for the OP I have no idea

Particularly when you consider that in the UK someone on really low income and savings  would qualify for 100% exemption from Council Tax

[/quote]

It could qualify for 100% exemption from Taxe d'habitation and TV licence  - but usually, not Taxe fonciere, alas!

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When we renovated the barn we made a small apartment with kitchenette, shower room and 14 KW log burner that heats bedroom upstairs. This year we are moving in for the winter. My office will use a small oil filled electric heater as the chimney runs through the middle of the house so we get warmth from that.

Just bought new kettle - 1 KW as we only have 6. First thing I did was measure out 2 cups of water and mark the kettle and 2 mugs of water and mark that. The amount of electricity wasted by filling a normal 2 KW kettle is mind blowing - or in our case trip blowing.

We are cutting back already but do have that magic pot.

My aunt retired with an exceedingly large pot - she has outlived it being 87 and could go on for many years to come. Who knows what the future holds BUT the amount of funerals we went to last year of men in their 60's means I will worry when I have to.

Di

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Not bothered to read the whole thread, but have to say that the two of us have survived for four years now on my RAF pension. We live a much better life that we did in the UK and there is no way that we could have retired and been happy at the age of 46 in the UK.

We don't expect much, just to be able to run the two motorbikes and eat out once a week or so. Nice to be able to keep the microlight flying too. Could we do this in the UK? Not a chance.

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There are a few UK pensioners near where we live and they are now finding life very difficult because when they came over the exchange rate was quite high which is what they did their calculations on. Some thought they were being prudent by working on 1.4 Euros to the pound thinking that the Euro would never drop that far. Now they are getting 1.23 (ish) Euros to the pound they have effectively lost about 20% of their pension and now are really struggling. Nobody really knows what will happen in the future with the Euros, it's like betting on a horse, so if I was looking to retire on a UK pension I would work on 1.10 Euros to the pound exchange rate and anything over that would be a bonus, at least for then next year or two.
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Things might be bad for UK OAPs but are they as bad for French OAPs?  Yesterday, in Hyper U, I watched a smartly dressed French OAP arrive at the weighing machine with two leeks and put them in a bag and weighed them, she then discarded the ticket.  She took one leek out and got a second ticket for that and put it in the bag, she then calmly put the second leek back in the bag and tied it up, saving about 0,60€ or less.

Not the first shoplifting I have seen in that shop, kids often could be seen stealing batteries and fishing tackle before security was tightened up, but this was so blatant.  The most audacious piece of dishonesty I have seen in France was an arabic woman who walked into a department store in Lille, picked up an opened quilt cover off the counter, stuffed it into a holdall and just walked out of the shop!

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Many people are moaning about the increase in the price of fruit and veg this year so one is not surprised that folks are beginning to steal. It is a form of protest really. Eg: melons locally are a glut on the market at the moment but the price has only just slipped down to €0.68. They always used to be 1ff at the height of the season or less.

TV programmes this week are suggesting that the average French shopping basket may be as much as 30% cheaper in Germany. Why?

The Government has only scratched the surface so far in its attempt to reform the retail sector. They need to go much further.

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