Healthcare from another perspective

[Chancer]

I have noticed how the right of access to the French healthcare system or lack of it tends to bring out strong emotions in forum members.

There are those who came here some years ago and had no right to reside, no right to healthcare and had to work and contribute for the priveledge of being a member of French society.

There are others who came later as inactifs with no intention of working and who were able to join the CMU.

There are other inactifs who arrived after 2007 who cannot  benefit from the CMU and may or may not have private health insurance.

And there are the actif workers who pay their full cotisations.

There is another actif working group ithat has been in the news a lot recently yet there has been no mention of on this forum, les sans papiers or perhaps I should call them les faux papiers.

They make up a big proportion of the working and cotisation paying population and many of them have popped their heads above the parapet and been on strike for over 6 weeks now hoping to have their situations regularised.

Unlike the inactif early retirees from the European Union these people came here to work but have no right to reside here, had they been of a different temperament then they probably would have carried straight on to the UK welfare state. By comng out on strike they are bringing attention to themselves and run the risk of deportation.

What I feel is scandalous is that they are paying full taxes and cotisations yet have no right to any benefits whatsoever, many large construction projects are currently grinding to a halt without these workers hired through interim agencies who have actively encouraged and helped them to submit false papers in order to work, the Bouyge site in La defense Paris is getting a lot of adverse publicity at the moment.

What is your view?

[buelligan]

Have to admit, I know little about this subject.  I have a horror of healthcare and tend to shy away from any article or thread about it.  That said, I have to agree absolutely with you Chancer.  It is scandalous!  I just hope things change - and, of course, change is the one thing we can all be certain of.[:)]

[Sunday Driver]

This has been going on for some time now.  A few years ago, we were shopping in Poitiers and there was a big demo outside the Hotel de Ville in support of rights for the sans papiers.

Eric Besson (Immigration Minister) has just issued a circular to préfects giving them the power to review individual cases under the criteria of period of residence in France, time in employment and future job stability as well as the level of 'integration' achieved. 

The Minister estimates that as many as 1,000 people could be legalised this way....[8-)]

 

 

[NormanH]

I can't understand how it is possible to pay cotisations and not have benefits.

Cotisations are handled by the employer and you have to have a social security number; so how is it possible not to be in the system?

Tax is handled by a different agency, so that I can see might not entitle you to anything.

[Scooby]

Irrespective of the mechanics of the French social security system, these individuals would appear to be filling shortage occupations (by the very fact that they can bring building sites to a standstill by their withdrawal of labour).  In this respect they would appear to meet most western immigration criteria - certainly they seem to be contributing more to the French economy than certain other groups.  The blame seems to rest with the lax processes of their employers and the equally lax government administration.

[Chancer]

[quote user="NormanH"]I can't understand how it is possible to pay cotisations and not have benefits.
Cotisations are handled by the employer and you have to have a social security number; so how is it possible not to be in the system?
[/quote]

False papers NormanH.

I thought you of all people would have been informed on this one, have a listen to FranceInter radio, they have been covering this subject every day for quite a while.

[NormanH]

Perhaps I'm being thick, but if you have false papers you have paid cotisations based on those papers, so should also have benefits based on those papers..

I have been out of the circuit for a few weeks..

[Chancer]

Welcome back Norman [:)]

Definitely not from all the reports that I have heard although for obvious reasons they dont explain exactly how it works.

I reckon that they do a similar thing that I did for a while in the USA, make or buy enough forged papers in the name of a real French citizen to  pass the checks that the interim agency are supposed to do, dont forget that it is the agencies that are the gerants of this scam, the agency then sends them off to the job and makes deductions and cotisations in the false but not fictitious name.

If you are lucky enough to have your identity borrowed in this way you will benefit from a better retirement pension thanks to the illegal worker but he is unlikely to be able to or stupid enough to try to pass himself of as you at the chez le medecin or the hospital.

Now if it does indeed work this way I am sure that the government could easily trace these citizens with multiple employment but I guess it is better for them to just keep quiet and trouser the money.