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Who strips us of our heritage?  I think, no matter how you try to avoid saying it TJ, it's the same old BNP arguments, almost the same terms that they use.

Perhaps you mean people like my wife's family who although not ever having been in the UK, fought for the 'Empire' in WW1 and WW2 and although brown people from the Indian sub-continent, were actually British citizens.

Perhaps you can validate your previous comment on it being the reason that people are leaving the Uk and that many more want to?

And remember that you're an immigrant also, tho it's ok, because France is white - except for the Algerians, Moroccans etc.

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[quote user="tj"]Hi Our native country is under ever increasing occupation, this does not have to mean a military force! And is one reason why many have left and many more would like to![/quote]

So answer the question; Who should they fight?  Who is occupying Britain? 

How can you suggest sending British soldiers to fight on your behalf when you don't even have the balls to say who they should be fighting?  Damned disgrace indeed!  Either put up or shut up as they say.

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BNP, unfortunately, with all the bad press a rather unpopular party with many, that is not to say there is anything wrong with a Nationalist party.

So are you trying to say its not among the reasons why some people would like to get out of UK, or a reason why many already have, ? i have met and spoken with many expats over the last 10 years since I left and unfortunately it is factor.

As an immigrant myself, as you point out, I think its rather a long stretch to compare my migration to that of the typical immigrant to UK.
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[quote user="tj"]BNP, unfortunately, with all the bad press a rather unpopular party with many, that is not to say there is anything wrong with a Nationalist party. So are you trying to say its not among the reasons why some people would like to get out of UK, or a reason why many already have, ? i have met and spoken with many expats over the last 10 years since I left and unfortunately it is factor. As an immigrant myself, as you point out, I think its rather a long stretch to compare my migration to that of the typical immigrant to UK.[/quote]

I'm sorry tj, I afraid I can't see how that answers the question - unless you mean that the British Army should be fighting the BNP?  And, until you make it clear just who you think the "enemy" is, I don't see how anyone can discuss the matter with any clarity.

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You're happy to be called a Nationalist then, another little Englander but don't have the nuts to stay in the Uk and fight for what you believe in?

So you're 'evidence' is conversations with other little Englander Nationalists who hold similar views to you based on race and ethnicity?

Why is it a long stretch?  Immigrant is immigrant, the only difference is that you are a better educated immigrant but if we're to believe what you say, you prefer to live in France than the UK because the UK is full of people that you don't like but can't or won't describe or quantify.

Typical Nationist coward, come on, put up or shut up as you've already been asked to do.

Where is your evidence apart from your unproved chats with other people?

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So are you trying to say its not among the reasons why some people would like to get out of UK, or a reason why many already have, ? i have met and spoken with many expats over the last 10 years since I left and unfortunately it is factor

 Thus proving their ignorance of the country they are moving to, which has immigrants too.

Frankly, as someone who lives in the UK, good riddance to them.

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[quote user="buelligan"]

[quote user="tj"]BNP, unfortunately, with all the bad press a rather unpopular party with many, that is not to say there is anything wrong with a Nationalist party. So are you trying to say its not among the reasons why some people would like to get out of UK, or a reason why many already have, ? i have met and spoken with many expats over the last 10 years since I left and unfortunately it is factor. As an immigrant myself, as you point out, I think its rather a long stretch to compare my migration to that of the typical immigrant to UK.[/quote]

I'm sorry tj, I afraid I can't see how that answers the question - unless you mean that the British Army should be fighting the BNP?  And, until you make it clear just who you think the "enemy" is, I don't see how anyone can discuss the matter with any clarity.

[/quote] Not sure if you are being deliberately naive ? My reference to the army was purely to show the irony of the situation, And the enemy, your words not mine, are those who would arrive to our country and proceed to dismantle our heritage, by means of political correctness and an utterly ridiculous immigraton policy, not forgetting those who arrive illegally of course.
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[quote user="tj"]As an immigrant myself, as you point out, I think its rather a long stretch to compare my migration to that of the typical immigrant to UK.[/quote]

Er............could you please enlighten me as to what you imagine "the typical immigrant to UK" to be like?  And why this typical immigrant is so very different ("a long stretch in fact") from you yourself?

It's such a broad, sweeping statement that, unless you care to give some sort of definition, it's hard to be sure what you're talking about? 

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  I think you'll find that in many cases its not immigrants that are being PC, but other over zealous folk.

When do people stop being immigrants ?

You remind me of my elderly mother who asked my daughter if her Asian friend ever went home....he lived in a rather nice flat in Notting Hill, his 'home' was actually Luton !!

PS Said friend is on Womans Hour today : http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/womanshour/04/2009_49_thu.shtml

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[quote user="tj"]Your not wrong, As much as it pains me to say so, our native country is no more, and until such time as the powers that be address the situation it will continue its decline. As british citizens we are on regular basis stripped of another part of our heritage and culture in the name of PC etc , only it appears we as native citizens have no right to same considerations. Global village, Multicultural society, all sound great, until you try and put it into practice ,,,,,, Tragic to see the destruction of a once proud and patriotic nation.[/quote]

Well there you go not too different from what I hear from some other Brits living in France. Trouble is they don't stop to think that they might now be doing the same thing here in France like setting up business's to cater for only English speaking people. I agree with Tony, this is nothing more than the same old BNP dribble. If you want to know why people on this forum, who represent a pretty good cross section of British society, moved to France then you might try reading THIS thread called 'Why did you leave the UK'. As to your statement about living here for 10 years and all the Brits you have met think the same as you well it just shows what a small and limited circle in which you move, you should get out more and mix with other people. You might also like to hide behind a newspaper in a French bar and listen to what they have to say about the Brits living in France, assuming you can understand French that is.

You might also like to take the time to read up on a bit of history. As far back as the 1700's we were importing African slaves in to the UK not just to forward on to the America's and the Caribbean but to use as slaves in the UK. It was quite the thing for ladies to have a little 'black boy' to dress up and parade around to impress others and treated them no better than they would a pet dog. You might find THIS website useful although aimed at educating children it gets the subject over in a way that even the most challenged can understand. I also doubt that you even know how Great Britain, a country you love but can't face living in, has behaved in other countries, committing genocide like in Jamaica for instance where it killed off a complete population (called the Tainos) so it could grow sugar, coffee and tobacco and make a shed load of money for people back in the UK. Those that we call Jamaicans today are actually a result of the slave trade.

I apologise to the other posters for my length of post but these sort of ill thought, stupid, ignorant and unresearched comments made by TJ make me very, very, angry. [:@][:@]

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[quote user="Russethouse"]

So are you trying to say its not among the reasons why some people would like to get out of UK, or a reason why many already have, ? i have met and spoken with many expats over the last 10 years since I left and unfortunately it is factor

 Thus proving their ignorance of the country they are moving to, which has immigrants too.

Frankly, as someone who lives in the UK, good riddance to them.

[/quote]

It's all very well for you RH - some of us have to put up with them! One country's riddance is another country's poison...[:)]

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[quote user="Quillan"]

[quote user="tj" I apologise to the other posters for my length of post but these sort of ill thought, stupid, ignorant and unresearched comments made by TJ make me very, very, angry. [:@][:@] [/quote]

Thank goodness it not just me that feels like that Quillan - I am proud proud proud to be married to an intellectual, beautiful woman (who several users here have met) whose mother and uncles were immigrants all of whom, including my wife and her siblings, suffered the abuse meted out to people of a difference racial or ethnic background which, unfortunately, is still going on in some areas of the Uk and even manages to pervade this Forum.

It's worse here because in the Uk you can see the racists on the street and can confront their filth face to face.  Here people can suggest, hint and hide in the anonymity of a Forum but it doesn't make them less of a racist.  Just a coward who can post comments, not justify their comments with evidence and then retreat into their hateful worlds - which of course, they justify but they're over here, taking work from the French, working (I guess) mainly for other immigrants, hankering for a world long gone when their nation was a Nationalistic master race.

I'm done with this thread or I'll start to get really angry!

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Not deliberately naive at all tj!  I  love the English language (and I find painful to see it so ill-used and mistreated - especially by a purported upholder of all things truly British!).  Here are a string of English words (put together in 1775ish) which you may care to consider;

"A man sometimes starts up a patriot, only by disseminating discontent, and propagating reports of secret influence, of dangerous counsels, of violated rights, and encroaching usurpation. This practice is no certain note of patriotism. To instigate the populace with rage beyond the provocation, is to suspend publick happiness, if not to destroy it. He is no lover of his country, that unnecessarily disturbs its peace. Few errours and few faults of government, can justify an appeal to the rabble; who ought not to judge of what they cannot understand, and whose opinions are not propagated by reason, but caught by contagion."

As a member of the rabble, I heartily concur with that sentiment.[:)]

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Please be careful Quillan.

What you are describing as 'pet dog' was a very, very, tiny minority of people who did this.   Wholesale immigration/slave labour into the UK did NOT happen.   The UK was involved the slave trade, as were the AFRICAN CHIEFS THEMSELVES.   Lovely way for them to 'remove' their troublesome neighbours.

Who abolished the slave trade?  The UK.  The Good old United Kingdom were the first to stop the trade, (William Wilberforce - maybe you've heard of him?) and spoke out very forcefully to have it abolished.

The fact that the Americans feel great guilt/distress/unhappiness over the way later generations of people removed from Africa who were eventually freed in the US of A - has NOTHING to do with the UKs attitude to immigration.

The UK is being changed - for the worse - by large numbers of non-Christian people who DO WANT OUR LAWS CHANGED.   You just cannot equate English people moving to France, and starting a business, and supporting local schools - and shops, with what is happening in the UK.    There is absolutely no comparison and you do yourself no favours by reducing it to such simplistic levels.

If you want to start pointing a finger at the UKs history - how about looking at what France has done as her Imperial Powers were used across the world ?   Or Spain...or the Dutch - or the Russians or the Persians or the Turks or the Ottomans.

EVERY SINGLE COUNTRY/Nation has its dark patches.   But to try and pretend it's only the UK that has a murky past, and that every other country is squeaky clean is sheer, unadulterated nonsense.

As for the attitude of the French towards the Brits.   They believe that we will all 'go home' return to our own country at some time in the future.   That none of us are here permanently...so they don't mind us being here; they'll take the benefits we may bring and not worry.

BUT - if WE wanted to change their laws or their ways of doing things - then they would - rightly - start to protest.

An Aetheist living in France would, I am sure, have real problems with the 'Religioust Flim Flam' around the place.   All the statues in the villages to this Woman in a Blue Cloak, or to that Cross or Crucifix or that Man hanging on a Cross.    I find it offensive to see such things in towns and countries - they are obvious signs of religious brain-washing.   What do you think the reaction would be of the French if there was a concerted move, by a small group of non-believers, who said that they found such 'icons' extremeley offensive and wished to have them removed.

The French would be up in arms.   And yet the UK indigenous population is supposed to accept - without any murmer or protest - groups of immigrants into our country who not only wish to change our way of life, our laws and our attitudes about free speech - but also with to IMPOSE THEIR VALUES ON A WHITE CHRISTIAN COUNTRY.

What the heck is going on with people.   Why is there no pride in the UK and our past values, innovations, inventions and all the other good things that have come from the UK.   Why is there always this need or attitude to 'put down' or sneer at the UK and the good that has been done by the UK.

Why do some people seem to hate their own country and people and tradition and history and culture...

I know what such people were called during the War - remember ?  When two silly little leaders of two pathetic little countries who couldn't live in peace and harmony with each other started a bit of a 'punch up' ?

Oh dear - I think I'm heading for the hills.

Chessie

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[quote user="Tony F Dordogne"][quote user="Quillan"]

[quote user="tj" I apologise to the other posters for my length of post but these sort of ill thought, stupid, ignorant and unresearched comments made by TJ make me very, very, angry. [:@][:@] [/quote]

Thank goodness it not just me that feels like that Quillan - I am proud proud proud to be married to an intellectual, beautiful woman (who several users here have met) whose mother and uncles were immigrants all of whom, including my wife and her siblings, suffered the abuse meted out to people of a difference racial or ethnic background which, unfortunately, is still going on in some areas of the Uk and even manages to pervade this Forum.

It's worse here because in the Uk you can see the racists on the street and can confront their filth face to face.  Here people can suggest, hint and hide in the anonymity of a Forum but it doesn't make them less of a racist.  Just a coward who can post comments, not justify their comments with evidence and then retreat into their hateful worlds - which of course, they justify but they're over here, taking work from the French, working (I guess) mainly for other immigrants, hankering for a world long gone when their nation was a Nationalistic master race.

I'm done with this thread or I'll start to get really angry!

[/quote]

Tony, no worry, please remember that some of us French keep our eyes wide open to clock some of the UK racists (and worse) who come to live over here.

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I have come rather late to this thread - I see that it is an old one which has been resurrected.

I would like to say that I wholehearted support Quillan and Tony F Dordogne in their opposition to the distasteful comments from tj. To my regret, I don't spend as much time in France as I would like, but I have found that a significant proportion of the expatriate British community I encounter seem to share tj's perceptions and opinions:

...  "I don't feel that it is my country any longer"

... "I feel physically sick whenever I step on English soil"

... "No, I'm not an immigrant, I'm a migrant"

Many of these people do not have terrestrial aerials on their houses, but they all have Sky dishes. Many speak only the most rudimentary French and take little interest in French current affairs. They patronise their French neighbours and talk constantly about "back home."

 

EDIT

I've just seen Chessie's contribution and now I feel sick.

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It always seemed to me that the dominant culture in the UK and increasingly so in France (and probably the rest of Europe - the world?) is American. I suspect that the Anglican church in the London area is kept alive by black churchgoers, I mean immigrants. I love my country, and I know it has warts, and I'm in France for the adventure of living in another country.
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[quote user="chessie"]
Please be careful Quillan.

What you are describing as 'pet dog' was a very, very, tiny minority of people who did this.

They were called the rich and your right there were not so many of them as there were poor.

Wholesale immigration/slave labour into the UK did NOT happen.

Slaves in one form or another had been imported in to the UK since roman times and continued up until slavery in England became illegal in 1772 (Mansfield). Slavery still continued in Scotland until 1834 when the British Slavery Abolition Act 1833 came in to effect (William Wilberforce). The exceptions being territories controlled by the Honourable East India Company and the islands of Ceylon and St Helena. The last British controlled protectorate (Gold Coast now called Ghana) had slavery banned in 1874

The UK was involved the slave trade, as were the AFRICAN CHIEFS THEMSELVES.   Lovely way for them to 'remove' their troublesome neighbours.

Anyone we didn't like we shipped of to various countries round the world.

Who abolished the slave trade?  The UK.  The Good old United Kingdom were the first to stop the trade, (William Wilberforce - maybe you've heard of him?) and spoke out very forcefully to have it abolished.

See above.

The fact that the Americans feel great guilt/distress/unhappiness over the way later generations of people removed from Africa who were eventually freed in the US of A - has NOTHING to do with the UKs attitude to immigration.

The UK is being changed - for the worse - by large numbers of non-Christian people who DO WANT OUR LAWS CHANGED.

Says who? We have been down this road before and it was proved not to be true.

You just cannot equate English people moving to France, and starting a business, and supporting local schools - and shops, with what is happening in the UK.    There is absolutely no comparison and you do yourself no favours by reducing it to such simplistic levels.

Yes I can. What I am talking about is the Brits that move here and set up business's to serve only fellow Brits, live in areas mainly populated by fellow Brits and mix primarily with other Brits. I am sure that many here (on this forum) have seen this happening. They are doing in France exactly what they complain about immigrants doing in the UK. Quillan has a thriving British luncheon club that meets every Wednesday

If you want to start pointing a finger at the UKs history - how about looking at what France has done as her Imperial Powers were used across the world ?   Or Spain...or the Dutch - or the Russians or the Persians or the Turks or the Ottomans.

EVERY SINGLE COUNTRY/Nation has its dark patches.   But to try and pretend it's only the UK that has a murky past, and that every other country is squeaky clean is sheer, unadulterated nonsense.

You are absolutely right and you have read me wrong. What I am saying is that many Brits point their fingers at other countries, their customs and there religions whilst thinking the UK is squeaky clean and perfect. I am merely pointing out that the UK is neither better or worse than other countries.

As for the attitude of the French towards the Brits.   They believe that we will all 'go home' return to our own country at some time in the future.   That none of us are here permanently...so they don't mind us being here; they'll take the benefits we may bring and not worry.

Well thats stupid attitude to take (by the French) because we ALL clearly won't be going home, many of us never also I have never heard this where I live. The biggest problem I hear about is the Brits pushing up property prices and young French people can't get on the property ladder because the house prices are too high (which is wrong but thats another issue). They also talk about British builders coming over to live, work on the black and basically taking work away from them. Thats another fantasy on behalf of the French because not all British builders do this, many of them are fully registered and work very hard quite legally.

BUT - if WE wanted to change their laws or their ways of doing things - then they would - rightly - start to protest.

An Aetheist living in France would, I am sure, have real problems with the 'Religioust Flim Flam' around the place.   All the statues in the villages to this Woman in a Blue Cloak, or to that Cross or Crucifix or that Man hanging on a Cross.    I find it offensive to see such things in towns and countries - they are obvious signs of religious brain-washing.   What do you think the reaction would be of the French if there was a concerted move, by a small group of non-believers, who said that they found such 'icons' extremeley offensive and wished to have them removed.

The French would be up in arms.   And yet the UK indigenous population is supposed to accept - without any murmer or protest - groups of immigrants into our country who not only wish to change our way of life, our laws and our attitudes about free speech - but also with to IMPOSE THEIR VALUES ON A WHITE CHRISTIAN COUNTRY.

I think RH has already answered that one.

What the heck is going on with people.   Why is there no pride in the UK and our past values, innovations, inventions and all the other good things that have come from the UK.   Why is there always this need or attitude to 'put down' or sneer at the UK and the good that has been done by the UK.

Why do some people seem to hate their own country and people and tradition and history and culture...

If you read one of my previous posts in this thread and followed the link to another thread about why people have left the UK your comments above are clearly not the case.

I know what such people were called during the War - remember ?  When two silly little leaders of two pathetic little countries who couldn't live in peace and harmony with each other started a bit of a 'punch up' ?

Oh dear - I think I'm heading for the hills.

Chessie

[/quote]

Sorry about my 'blue' answers but I don't have the time to keep cutting and pasting.

I personally left the UK to live in a warmer place, be less stressed with better healthcare and certainly not because of any of the things you have mentioned above. I am proud to be British and yes the British have given the world a lot of excellent things but we also have done, like other countries, some terrible things as well which simply can't be ignored and in some ways you could say you reap what you sow. Many however seem to conveniently forget this.

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[quote user="Clarkkent"]

I have come rather late to this thread - I see that it is an old one which has been resurrected.

I would like to say that I wholehearted support Quillan and Tony F Dordogne in their opposition to the distasteful comments from tj. To my regret, I don't spend as much time in France as I would like, but I have found that a significant proportion of the expatriate British community I encounter seem to share tj's perceptions and opinions:

...  "I don't feel that it is my country any longer"

... "I feel physically sick whenever I step on English soil"

... "No, I'm not an immigrant, I'm a migrant"

Many of these people do not have terrestrial aerials on their houses, but they all have Sky dishes. Many speak only the most rudimentary French and take little interest in French current affairs. They patronise their French neighbours and talk constantly about "back home."

 

EDIT

I've just seen Chessie's contribution and now I feel sick.

[/quote]

Clarkkent,

I really can't see why Chessie's comments would make you feel sick, unless of course that you think your comments vis: ''Many of these people do not have terrestrial aerials on their houses,

but they all have Sky dishes. Many speak only the most rudimentary

French and take little interest in French current affairs. They

patronise their French neighbours and talk constantly about "back home."

are equally sickmaking. You imply that British immigrants to France should be watching terrestrial French TV not Sky, they should all speak perfect French and should not refer to their country of birth as ''home''.

This is, to me, as strange an attitude as the one you seem to be complaining about.

Of course, I can only speak for myself, whose French is ''rudimentary'' (but getting better), and who, when at my residence secondaire, watches TV in my native language. What exactly is the problem for me?

You may be totally in favour of unlimited immigration into UK, I couldn't possibly know. I however, am not in favour of such. I have no problem with controlled immigration such that whatever passes for UK culture is not 'swamped' by an alien culture. I believe that the UK Govt has lost control of its borders and is out of touch with the reality of how the indigenous population feel. Whether this apparent loss of control is deliberate or accidental is for the conspiracy theorists to argue.

It is a fact that the cultural make up of the UK has changed in the last 20+ years, possibly more dramatically than at any other equivalent period, is it for the better or worse? the people of UK can best answer that (I dont live there). Its pretty obvious that many UK residents are not particularly happy about the rate of change and a substantial number have voted with their feet and left, some to France, others to different parts of the Globe.

They may look back with nostalgia and claim that they dont feel its their country any more - whats wrong with that?

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[quote user="memb"]Nativity plays banned, Xmas back instead of Christmas, changing carols to suit the multi cultural society but  when a teacher substitutes a "partridge in a pear tree " for "corncrake in a palm tree" because she doesn't want to step on any toes, then that, for me, is the end.  When are true Brits in Britain going to get some backbone and declare enough is enough.[:@] 

[/quote]

Not relevant to Christmas [and we utterly share your sentiments here]; visiting friends from Oz told us the nursery school teacher had the 3 year olds singing "Baaa baaa pink sheep, have you any wool. Words fail us, they really do!

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