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It's all kicking off chez Chancer


NormanH
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Thats where I go to the arab market for my fruit and veg late Sunday morning when they brade the unsold stock, its basically a no go area for the police metropolitaine, note that it was the CRS in attendance each time.

The atmosphere when I go is sometimes very febrile, its hard to put it into words but you can see by peoples actions and comportment that its a tinder box at those times, the shells of burnt out cars still smouldering, plumes of smoke from other areas hidden by the high rise HLM's when the fire brigade attend they have a CRS escort.

Street entertainment is always by youths without crash helmets doing donuts and burn outs on stolen motorcycles, others some looking as young as 10 years old use their own trials bikes to wheely the length of the pavements, fathers with babies on their laps doing the same on quad bikes, all these on the crowded pavements of the souk. By the way this is a normal sunday I am talking about, not a febrile one.

A few weeks ago I patiently waited while the driver of the car in front, a middle aged white middle class looking male wound down his window and spoke to a couple of youths that had crossed in front of him, I naively thought he was asking for directions, he then got out looking agitated (he must of been remonstrating with them) and the younger who was about 13 (his mate a few years older) pulled a gun on the guy who ran back to his car and sped off, they continued ambling along, laughing and brandishing the pistol at those of us behind [:(]

The strange thing was it was surreal, it was only later on that the full, impact of what had happened sunk in, I wasnt scared at the time, I think that I have seen so much go on there that I am usually in a high state of alert. When I recounted the story to a close friend in the UK she was shocked that I hadnt considered it bad enough to report to the police, I guess that says it all about the quartier Amiens Nord.

I'll be getting my veg from Lidls till the end of the summer now [:P], I reckon it will kick off again on Wed night the public holiday (whatever it is this time), not that many there work but I am sure that they will want to fete the occasion nonetheless. 

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That sounds even rougher than where I live...

We have had our murder at the Féria, not that unusual for the area, but the complete lack of taking responsibility by the Maire in his interview in the local paper is shocking.

A 33 year old was punched and kicked to death by a thug bouncer from one of the local nightclubs because his girlfriend had climbed onto the bouncer's moto so that her boyfriend  could take her photo.

The Maire's reaction? A real Pontius Pilate job

il y a chaque année des morts dans les fêtes de villages et ce type de

faits est malheureusement devenu assez courant : des morts, des

bagarres, des blessés

ça s’est passé en dehors des horaires de la Feria.

je ne sais pas comment marquer notre émotion. La minute de silence ne

pourrait se faire que dans les arènes mais je ne suis pas certain que ce

soit opportun de commencer une corrida par une minute de silence.

[:@]

http://www.midilibre.fr/2012/08/13/drame-de-la-feria-raymond-couderc-c-est-un-veritable-crime,547888.php

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If I have never understood the France that some people used to post about, I just don't know 'that' France, I do understand the France mentioned on here.

Gangland shootings were a regular occurence in the 80's in the city we lived in. And there has been the odd riot there and there was always crime. I most certainly avoided these things, only crime came a knocking when my car was broken into, within a week of moving to France.

The most curious place in my region was a ZUP. It was on TV a few times, full reports, the police unable to handle the place. And yet, you drive through there and it is smart and tidy.  Down to good luck on my part, I have never seen any trouble at all and  I have yet to see a burnt out car, even litter. And yet I know that it is a dangerous place. So maybe a warning that even nice and pleasant looking places in France are not always as they seem.

I hadn't really known about Picardie and it's problems until Chancer mentioned them. As always I am sorry that this is happening.

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I was reading out some of the statistics in Norman's recent posting about France's poorest towns, to a friend of mine here in GB.  She was astonished at the unemployment and income figures.  No surprise that the two things (the towns with the least money and highest unemployment vs the violence etc) are closely linked, is it?

About the France think, Idun.  I do think that many people have a holiday view of a lot of countries but most are the same in my experience - they have their good and bad. Why anybody would expect France to be different or thinks it is, is beyond me also.

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Other than when it has kicked off or is likely to I really like the central quartier of Amiens Nord, I like the multi-culturalism, the place is usually spotless even outside the tower blocks.

 I especially like the beautiful textiles sold for sold for making the sari's except of course they are not sari's I just dont know the name and the beautiful north african women wearing them.

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In a way it reminds me of my travels and in another its one of the few places where I feel comfortable, that is to say I dont stand out as being different by the way I sound, we are all immigrants there and all are subjected to the same prejudices and mistrust to varying degrees.

I go there most Sundays for the market and a couple of evenings a month to the 15m diving fosse, its partially built above ground so that when you are at the 5m decompression palier you are at head height from ground level outside and there is a window so that the passers by and the divers can look at each other respectively as if they are in a fish tank. The glass is pretty thick to withstand the hydrostatic pressure and someone wisely also specified ballistic glass, or maybe thats what they fitted the second time, in any case you can barely see through it now as a few shotguns have been discharged directly at it from the pavement [:-))].

I wouldnt want to be diving there tomorrow night as I am pretty sure its going to kick off again.

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There seem to be two sorts of 'mixed' areas, the ones on the outskirts of large towns, often with Tower block accommodation, known as 'cités', then a second town centre sort, where old run-down multiple occupancy houses predominate, and which are usually a bit calmer, though no less socially diverse.

I live in the second sort..

[IMG]http://i253.photobucket.com/albums/hh80/bfb_album/insalubrite.jpg[/IMG]

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[quote user="cooperlola"]Straying off topic somewhat, Chancer, I used to live in Penge and love it for the same reason - the mix of people who lived there and rubbed along reasonably well was great fun.[/quote]

I see the route has changed now but I am sure Penge used to be at the end of the 227 bus route from Chislehurst?

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I know it's a bit late but I have been rather busy. There was footage on the 13:00 BBC news yesterday, about 3 minutes on what caused it etc. They are expecting more riots across France in the coming weeks they said. Apparently the French rioters have been learning from the English ones and are using different 'techniques'.
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[quote user="NormanH"]There seem to be two sorts of 'mixed' areas, the ones on the outskirts of large towns, often with Tower block accommodation, known as 'cités', then a second town centre sort, where old run-down multiple occupancy houses predominate, and which are usually a bit calmer, though no less socially diverse.

I live in the second sort..



[IMG]http://i253.photobucket.com/albums/hh80/bfb_album/insalubrite.jpg[/IMG]
[/quote]

The ZUP which is on the outskirts of a city is not at all like that, I have never seen rubbish lying around, or it being other than tidy. In the city there were areas that were not very well off, but as the bins were emptied every day, we never saw rubbish like that either. Do they not take the rubbish every week day where you live NH?

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In principle yes, but there are other factors.

That was on a Sunday when there is no collection.

As I said the houses are in multiple occupation, so that there are often 4/5 studios in a house, yet the number of dustbins seem to be calculated on the basis of per house, rather than so many per person.

There are no individual dustbins, just the inadequate collective few at the end of the road

Secondly it is the South, and this sort of thing together with dog fouling seems endemic

Third the population is impoverished, largely uneducated, and very often under the influence of drink and drugs.

That remains an extreme but not unusual example.

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I lived in a big city when I first got to France, ending up in an old appt block that had five floors and lots of us lived in that block. It is true that on a weekend the rubbish would mount up, but not surprising with so many of us living there. It was a big appt and awful, but so handy for the centre of the city, in fact a great place to live in a new country.
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The BBC reporting of this has been appalling and completely innacurate, the closest they have got to the scene is a reporter comfortably ensconced in Paris and they are relying on someone from the university of Texas to explain the motivations of the troublemakers in Amiens Nord.

In this article http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-19256122

they translated "tirs de chevrotine" as the rioters throwing shots and fireworks at the police whereas in fact it is someone firing a shotgun loaded with a cartridge intended to maim where the shot are linked together with fine wires.

At the end they have the gall to ask us to write their articles for them : Are you in the area? Send us your comments and experiences using the form below.

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[quote user="Chancer"]

At the end they have the gall to ask us to write their articles for them : Are you in the area? Send us your comments and experiences using the form below.

[/quote]That is standard BBC practice. It appears on most News Stories about riots, natural didasters etc
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Ramadan!

Very interesting and thought provoking article NormanH.

I had noticed that the gentle crippled Lebanese kebab seller has been absent for a few weeks, when I enquired I was told that he had been chased off his pitch by some of the unruly element, I know there is no pork in his kebabs, in fact I dont think any of them in France contain pork but this could well have been aggravated by Ramadan.

Pity the so called expert from the university of Texas didnt think of that.

I am curious to go to the market now on sunday.

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So those in Mecca only have to fast for 12 hours at the moment and those in Amiens have to fast for 15 hours. Just read an article about this and it said that children, pregnant women and the elderly can suffer. Children? does this religion really make children fast like this? Nice!
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[quote user="idun"]So those in Mecca only have to fast for 12 hours at the moment and those in Amiens have to fast for 15 hours. Just read an article about this and it said that children, pregnant women and the elderly can suffer. Children? does this religion really make children fast like this? Nice![/quote]

 

There are, apparently, accepted guidelines regarding fasting times for those areas with entensive day light hours.

The Islamic religion does not require fasting by children, nor by those who are ill, nor by travellers. The first day of Ramadan was never a good time to need to see a doctor ( when I lived in the Middle East ) because the queues were unreal due to the non-fasting of the ill.

 

In theory those who don't fast due to travelling or illness or any other acceptable reason are supposed to fast for an equivalent time at some time in the future.

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