woolybanana Posted June 24, 2015 Share Posted June 24, 2015 Can one assume that these nasty violent people were UKIP supporters, Betty or just old fashioned NF ones? Perhaps they too want votes at 16. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YCCMB Posted June 24, 2015 Share Posted June 24, 2015 I don't know, Wooly. For me, if there was ever a situation where the word 'people' should be enclosed in inverted commas, it would be in describing the perpetrators in all three of these cases. When it's kids of fourteen and below, one can only assume it's what they learn at home. Nice thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patf Posted June 24, 2015 Share Posted June 24, 2015 Betty - those are very sad stories, but I expect your students, who presumably pay for their tuition, are legally living and working in the UK. Whereas no-one has any idea whether these crowds of would-be immigrants at Calais have any right to be in France never mind the UK.It's an entirely different problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gardengirl Posted June 24, 2015 Share Posted June 24, 2015 Some very distressing stories there, Betty; I hope they all recovered well and saw fit to continue in our country.(Edit: I worked for many years in a Berkshire school where such awful behaviour was ingrained by the age if 5, when the children started school. It took a long time for them to accept that there were different kinds if strength, that shouting wasn't the only way to persuade others etc, but I doubted whether many if these thoughts lasted fir most if them beyond the age of 12 when they left us for secondary school.)I recall when aged about 15, I saw somebody being assaulted by a gang of yobs when the bus I was on stopped at the Technical College ( - remember them?) I raced up, yelling my head off, stick thin and not very tall, but enough to startle them and the cowards ran away. The poor young man who had been assaulted was a strapping Norwegian in his lovely stripy jumper - loads of them used to attend Sunderland Tech. I learned that day that these gangs are cowards, don't want to have to deal with anything they weren't expecting. My 2 older brothers, who heard about the fracas from friends of theirs who had been nearby, but hadn't lifted a finger (also cowards in my eyes!) were really annoyed and warned me not to try doing anything like that in the future - but I'd learned from them about aiding people in trouble. Apparently, according to them, it was OK to wade in if you're 6ft odd and know your stuff, but girls didn't do things like that on their own. I learned something else that day - big brothers aren't always right! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YCCMB Posted June 24, 2015 Share Posted June 24, 2015 I have said as much, Pat, on another thread, and I do fully understand. I've also taught asylum seekers and know the sort of problems they face, and the problems faced by the authorities in dealing with the burden they represent. Unfortunately, many people don't (or can't, or won't ) differentiate. But if, as Idun suggests, people are saying that "immigrants" are being bussed into the north under cover of darkness, and if they're asylum seekers, then they won't be taking anyone's jobs because they aren't allowed to work. However, I doubt that asylum seekers are being randomly distributed across the country unless it's under close supervision, as, until they have formally been granted asylum, they are at risk of disappearing unless kept in special centres and tend not to be bussed to random places and given jobs. I guess in an ideal world, I'd like a couple of things to happen:Firstly, I'd like all the non-UK nationals currently living and working in the UK to agree to leave for a month. Or for long enough to give everyone a chance to see what life would actually, genuinely be like without them.Secondly, I'd also like a similar time period to be devoted to employers refusing to give any jobs to non-UK-born workers. I think it would also be revealing to see just how quickly the vacancies would be snapped up by Brits. Even better, if these two things could happen simultaneously. I would put money on the economy being in virtual meltdown before the end of the experiment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickP Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 Just one question Betty, if asylum seekers are not allowed to work, how do they get the money to pay you to teach them?On another subject, we drove to Calais yesterday to use the tunnel, we never saw a single "illegal" or no trucks stacked on the A16. We had a booking on the 13.50, and got the 13.20, the only hold up was at the French passport control, only one booth open, until the situation got so chaotic they opened two more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolybanana Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 Nick, it was lunchtime, what did you expect? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabbie Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 It does seem that some asylum seekers have been dispersed to the NE. Using google I found these figures for 2013. It would appear that this has taken place openly and not "under cover of darkness". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YCCMB Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 Nick...i worked on a voluntary basis. Nobody paid me. In general, however, once asylum has been granted, or if it's taking too long for an asylum request to be processed, asylum seekers (who are classed as refugees after they've been granted asylum) can work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idun Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 I was aware that people were being sent to the NE in the past, but due to the current 'crisis', the rumour mill says that they are doing this at night at the moment.And anyone who wants these people, well, adopt them, take them, feed them, care for them, look after them, pay their health care bills. Don't cost me a penny, don't take jobs from locals, at least not in the NE. Love to see a big camp for them in David Cameron's personal home's garden at Chipping Norton. In fact couldn't they live in his house as he is being 'kept' by the state. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickP Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 I just read a great idea on another Anglo/French forum, and it said that all the bleeding heart "ex-pats" resident in France, complaining about the UK's treatment or lack of; for illegals, should take in illegals in their own homes, very simple answer to a perceived problem. Especially as they are constantly telling us that the houses they buy in France are much bigger and better than what we can afford in the UK. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YCCMB Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 I think I'd rather be a bleeding heart than a cold hearted xenophobic bigot, whichever side of the channel I was living on. But that's just me.Immigrants, especially illegal ones, are a problem. Fact. They don't diminish in numbers the more you hate them. Fact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lindal1000 Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 Actually I really wouldn't have a problem helping people in that situation get on their feet. I have done similar in the past when I have been in a position to help. I consider it a privilege to be able to help another human being rather than watch them suffer. Never really had a problem with sharing either.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idun Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 Maybe it is because I am getting older and because of some things that happened in my life but the current world disgusts me. When I was 20 I reckon that I would have been applauding you Betty, but now, no. I remember feeling appalled by people with my current views, I remember it clearly. Now I look back on 'me' as being so naieve and I should have been questioning so much, in the interests of 'really' doing the right thing. I had too many years and years of doing what I thought was the 'right' thing, donating to causes and frankly I feel like all that help that sometimes I could ill afford, and it has come back to mock us all.I have just typed much more, but have deleted it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoddy Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 I think we have to divide the personal from the political. I guess that most of here would be personally kind to an individual in trouble even if we believed it was of their own making.That does not alter the fact that we need a political solution because, in purely practical terms we cannot accept unlimited numbers of immigrants.Another thing strikes me - many of the people at Calais would appear to be children. Would I be wrong to think that if this situation was in the UK they would be taken into care ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patf Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 [quote user="Hoddy"]I think we have to divide the personal from the political. I guess that most of here would be personally kind to an individual in trouble even if we believed it was of their own making.That does not alter the fact that we need a political solution because, in purely practical terms we cannot accept unlimited numbers of immigrants. [/quote]Good point Hoddy, I agree.In practical terms, I think there should be some kind of quota system, and the UK should be obliged to accept some of them. After all it's partly due to their bungling interference in Middle Eastern and Afghanistan affairs that has caused this exodus.But if and when they arrive there should be methodical assessment and evaluation of each case. Which would need some kind of inital holding centre where their language, qualifications and health and social needs are looked at. Which would cost.Apart from everything else their continued presence at Calais could well put up the cost of fresh food and other things in the UK , as lorries are delayed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YCCMB Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 Pat, there are already several holding centres where exactly what you suggest is undertaken. There is a very large detention holding centre at Colnbrook, just outside Slough and not a million miles from where I used to live, and others throughout the UK.For people who arrive in the UK illegally (and here I am differentiating between coming in under - or inside - a lorry versus arriving by plane/boat/train and claiming asylum)..usually meaning arriving without versus with a passport and papers... Then these detention centres are absolutely where you'll be taken. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolybanana Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 Could not a huge fence be built round Slough and all these 'people' be put in there, with the perimeter patrolled by 'white van man'? Both these should get them slavering to leave the country and even paying for the right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pickles Posted June 30, 2015 Author Share Posted June 30, 2015 And the MyFerryLink staff have done it again, closing Eurotunnel to vehicular traffic and Eurostar, and closing the port of Calais ...IIRC, aren't these the same people who dragged SeaFrance into oblivion? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frederick Posted June 30, 2015 Share Posted June 30, 2015 [quote user="Pickles"]And the MyFerryLink staff have done it again, closing Eurotunnel to vehicular traffic and Eurostar, and closing the port of Calais ...IIRC, aren't these the same people who dragged SeaFrance into oblivion?[/quote]And from what I have just read.....the French Police not only did nothing while strikers put a My Ferry Link truck in front of the ferry loading ramp ...they put a police vehicle there to keep it company ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DerekJ Posted June 30, 2015 Share Posted June 30, 2015 What a fiasco....If this Calais situation continues people will more and more look at alternatives to traveling via Calais if possible/practicalWe were due to travel Dover-Calais early on Sunday and would have got away with it. However a last minute family bereavement on the evening of Saturday meant we've had to postpone our next visit. Although we had a P&O ticket that was flexible and we can travel at a later date, I'm thinking of cutting our losses and finding another route.Of course, if that becomes the norm then now doubt strikers, illegals and ineffectual police will just move on to another port and screw that up as well.What a gutless way of dealing with this situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolybanana Posted June 30, 2015 Share Posted June 30, 2015 Out of interest, how is the suituation in Calais different from the striking miners in UK of a few years ago? Both are fights for jobs, the difference apparently being that the French government has not used the police against the French seamen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickP Posted June 30, 2015 Share Posted June 30, 2015 You would have thought that these days people had a bit more sense, especially as the miners never won. Still the French work force is probably about 50 years behind. That's why the sensible ones are flocking to the UK, like the French business's setting up in Britain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoneySuckleDreams Posted June 30, 2015 Share Posted June 30, 2015 If someone is causing criminal damage e.g. setting fire to the trainline, why can't they be arrested ? Is it still the case in France that if damage is caused as part of a greve etc, e.g. torching a car, then the law can't touch them ? I do wonder that nowerdays it only takes a few hundred tyre burners to cut off a major route into the UK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frederick Posted June 30, 2015 Share Posted June 30, 2015 All it takes is burnt through signal cables that may be trackside and the result could be carnage . Their action means that all has to be done to inspect repair and test the whole railway to see it is opperating correctly before they dare run a passenger train again .... I would like to see the Union that supports these clowns that do not give a sh..t for the safety of the passeners in the trains .Forced to cover the cost of the illegal action of their members and if they ended up with a bankrupt union in the process then so be it . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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