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Calais ... again


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The problems around Calais are not going away ...

http://www.midilibre.fr/2015/05/12/calais-des-migrants-balances-par-des-crs-par-dessus-une-glissiere-sur-l-a16,1160291.php

Last week when we came back to the UK we had a Thule "backup box" on the rear of the car to give us more space for bulky items that we were bringing back. Due to the publicity surrounding the escapades of the clandestines, for our last night in the Pas de Calais we automatically looked for accommodation away from Calais and with its own parking.

Similarly, whilst visiting Cité Europe and refuelling, we again took precautions that wouldn't occur to us elsewhere.

The situation for the lorry drivers is far worse.

And yet the clandestins would apparently be far better off if they sought asylum in France ...

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Yes, saw it on french news last night, the police or CRS or whatever, using batons and throwing some of these people over the little motorway type barrier. Interestingly the police spokesman said that we had only seen a few seconds of what had happened and it was too short a time to judge if the police had behaved inappropriately.

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BIL is weekly tramper across France and backto UK. Gasolene alley where the lorries queue up for the ferries is a terrible place andhighly dangerous so most of the truckers now have dashcams and they watch the rear of the one in front at same time.Last week he had his rear trailer door straps cuts by the desperate but the driver behind made sure he kept an eye and dash cam to say no one had got in because the drivers just dare not exit their units until they get on the ferry or train for their own safety. Truckers now are warned not to park up less than 100kms from all the channel ports if going back to the UK and run out of time or need to spend overnight!
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Went through there last weekend and it is just a s bad as ever.  There is a Tent City in the dunes a couple of Kms from the port and the trucks are often backed up as far as it, no choice.  2 or 3 minibuses of Cops and a CRS van or 2 permanently on duty (at what cost?). The whole time they are stopping the trucks being raided but they have little chance of getting them all.  I don't condone the rough treatment but after all this time, day after day, I can understand it.  Huge fences are going up (again at what cost?) but with such a vast area to defend I'm not sure if it will work.  Some solution has to be found.

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  • 2 weeks later...
We took a wrong turning from our hotel at Calais this morning, so 'Dora', our satnav took us on a route towards the docks. We saw small groups of people with sleeping bags walking towards town at first, then groups in the middle of the dual carriageway, then hundreds walking from the dunes, with many more being dragged out of back of some of the long line of lorries. They seemed to quietly accept being found, and no doubt would hop into another lorry shortly. We saw plenty climbing into lorries, which were at a standstill.

Traffic on our carriageway was going very slowly, presumably everyone was like us, just amazed. Then we saw the huge number of shelters in the dunes, covered with black polythene; what I'd seen on TV bulletins didn't prepare me for that. Yet most of the men we saw looked clean and tidy somehow, and many were on their mobile phones. This town of shelters is a world away from the new official site complete with food, showers etc.

It was a chastening thought; here we were, heading south for an overnight stay in Beaune with a delicious meal and lovely wines, and what would those men be doing......... I can't see an end to all this; GB can't possibly take all the people who would like to be there, we're a small country. Then there are those risking their lives by paying to ride on dangerous boats, and others now arriving on the Greek island of Kos after reaching Turkey.
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Whilst I feel for these people, many have escaped possible death and persecution, I do feel the UK has to take the blame for making it so easy and attractive to refugees and clandestines to want to go there in the first place. Ask yourself this, why do they not want to stay in France,Italy,Spain or any other European country where most are already? The answer is easy, the UK is a soft touch giving away the tax paying public's precious money to such people, many who offer nothing in return such as skills etc whilst other European countries have taken a stance many years ago not to give benefits or asylum to those with nothing to offer and in a lot of cases,criminals as we see in the UK papers when someone is murdered by a foreigner. All the EU countries should get together and try and sort this out once and for all, perhaps sorting out those seeking genuine asylum and sending back those who are chancing their luck and are in no danger! I actually feel more sorry for my BIL and his fellow truckers who have to endure this week after week and often verbal or physical attack.
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[quote user="Val_2"]Whilst I feel for these people, many have escaped possible death and persecution, I do feel the UK has to take the blame for making it so easy and attractive to refugees and clandestines to want to go there in the first place. Ask yourself this, why do they not want to stay in France,Italy,Spain or any other European country where most are already? The answer is easy, the UK is a soft touch giving away the tax paying public's precious money to such people, many who offer nothing in return such as skills etc whilst other European countries have taken a stance many years ago not to give benefits or asylum to those with nothing to offer and in a lot of cases,criminals as we see in the UK papers when someone is murdered by a foreigner. All the EU countries should get together and try and sort this out once and for all, perhaps sorting out those seeking genuine asylum and sending back those who are chancing their luck and are in no danger! I actually feel more sorry for my BIL and his fellow truckers who have to endure this week after week and often verbal or physical attack.[/quote]

I felt very sorry for the drivers of the lorries, for your BIL and all the others, who had to stop by the crowds of those crowded along the road and were unable to do anything to stop them; I remembered you saying about having cameras fitted in cabs so they could warn others if their lorry was entered. I also remember saying about companies sending their lorries via other ports and not stopping anywhere near Calais. You're absolutely right, our government hasn't done anything to put people being so determined to get to the UK by acting as other EU countries do. We are definitely a soft touch for all who wish to come.

I had seen the various groups as shown on TV, but it was a huge surprise to see many hundreds standing along the roadside and still more coming out of the sand dunes, all in broad daylight; I'd assumed that night time would be their preferred time, when it would be easier to keep out of sight.

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It's very little to do with the attractiveness, perceived or otherwise, of the UK as a destination, and more to do with the obvious fact that if they speak a second language at all, it's likely to be English. Logical, then, that you would prefer to live in a country where you can understand and make yourself understood. Clearly, if they knew they could come on here and ask for an English-speaking doctor, dentist, mechanic, hairdresser..........
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[quote user="Pierre ZFP"]Went through there last weekend and it is just a s bad as ever.  There is a Tent City in the dunes a couple of Kms from the port and the trucks are often backed up as far as it, no choice.  2 or 3 minibuses of Cops and a CRS van or 2 permanently on duty (at what cost?). The whole time they are stopping the trucks being raided but they have little chance of getting them all.  I don't condone the rough treatment but after all this time, day after day, I can understand it.  Huge fences are going up (again at what cost?) but with such a vast area to defend I'm not sure if it will work.  Some solution has to be found.

[/quote]

Short of running the lorry into a steel box closing doors and sucking the air out for 5 minutes and letting the whole world know that this is what happens in the port before boarding Which should make a lorry less attractive to hide in .

Or building a consentration camp to hold them in to be fed on all the food past its sell by date the French government wants to see go to charities until they decide they want to be flown back to the country they left as they aint going anywhere !

Another "Somthing " will have to be thoght about to be done .

......
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Here's a thought what about sending them home and letting them fight for the what they want chez eux????? There is much in this life I don't get, but why not fight for a better life at home instead of embarking on a very dangerous journey.

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[quote user="powerdesal"]I really do like the idea of the steel box. Loss of air will not adversely affect any cargo, nor will it harm the truck. Sounds like a winning idea to me.[/quote]

Blimey ! Somebody on my side ... I was half expecting

to be asked if I had loaned my uniform to Freddy Star or Prince Harry
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[quote user="idun"]Here's a thought what about sending them home and letting them fight for the what they want chez eux????? There is much in this life I don't get, but why not fight for a better life at home instead of embarking on a very dangerous journey.
[/quote]It is not so easy for ordinary people to change a military dictatorship or other corrupt regime. Most of these migrants live in sub-Saharan Africa and conditions must be pretty horrific for them to embark on the long and dangerous trip to the Mediterranean before the even more dangerous crossing. Not something to be undertaken lightly.

There is no easy solution to this problem - possibly no solution at all but I don't believe that repatriation is a viable option.

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[quote user="Rabbie"]

[quote user="idun"]Here's a thought what about sending them home and letting them fight for the what they want chez eux????? There is much in this life I don't get, but why not fight for a better life at home instead of embarking on a very dangerous journey.

[/quote]It is not so easy for ordinary people to change a military dictatorship or other corrupt regime. Most of these migrants live in sub-Saharan Africa and conditions must be pretty horrific for them to embark on the long and dangerous trip to the Mediterranean before the even more dangerous crossing. Not something to be undertaken lightly.

There is no easy solution to this problem - possibly no solution at all but I don't believe that repatriation is a viable option.

[/quote]

I know all that, but you know when I look at a history of Great Britain, we had to do change things, make things better and people died, watched something about Peterloo the other day......... freedom is not a given gift, neither are good living conditions........ the 'people' have to fight for them and it takes time.

I really cannot say what I would like to say and I get thoroughly fed up with all this, so what do we do, let everyone in?????  Just how feasable is that??

I wish people in the west would step back and look properly at exactly why we are in this position and where all that aid we have been sending since I was a child has gone and why we are not all wanting to move 'there'!

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'' There is no easy solution to this problem - possibly no solution at all but I don't believe that repatriation is a viable option.''

Repatriation is not an acceptable solution ( why not ?)

Opening the doors to everyone in the World who wants to come to UK / Europe is not an acceptable solution ( not enough space )

Housing the illegals in camps ( located where ???? ) would be considered to be 'concentrating' them and would not be an acceptable solution ( again why not ?)

No solution is going to be totally acceptable to everyone but there really has to be action taken or, I fear, local violent action will be taken by those most affected. Not a good scenario at all.

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[quote user="powerdesal"]'' There is no easy solution to this problem - possibly no solution at all but I don't believe that repatriation is a viable option.'' Repatriation is not an acceptable solution ( why not ?) [/quote]Many of the people come from land-locked countries in Africa so the only means of returning their citizens (if in fact you can prove of which country they are citizens) is by air. What do you do if the aircraft are refused permission to land? Parachute them down?
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We are reaping what we have sown and I am furious about it.

My chief culpritt for the moment is Bob Geldof, followed by all the other charities and MSF.

I never minded saving starving people, but just feeding people is never enough.  Look what has happened in Ethiopia, their population has exploded, nearly 40million when they were starving, now in 2013likely more now, 94million. IF they did not have enough ressources for their small population, what the xxxx were they doing letting it more than double....... and Eritrea has left since then AND their population has doubled too. I could not afford more than 2 kids, so why should anything 'I' have go to people who cannot literally stop breeding.

As I have said before, IF I am going to give to any charity now, it will be to animal charities, never used to understand BB, but actually, I realise that animals need our protection and humans actually do not.

So what are we going to do? I have not got a clue, but something needs doing and it will sound horrible and probably will be, but there is no choice as sometimes harsh decisions have to be made. AND anyone who does not agree, maybe they should be made to take in four or 6 of these 'migrants' in their own home with NO government aid, and let them get on with it. I don't want them, I want them to go home and stop over populating their own countries.

Incidentally, I have no time for any 'big' family, I truly believe three children is pushing it and more, well, disgusts me and has done for years and years. Our village GP in France's wife was a great conservationist and she had four kids and they were great kids, but the two do not go together, one cannot save the planet and a big family, just does not go together.

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[quote user="idun"]     

Incidentally, I have no time for any 'big' family, I truly believe three children is pushing it and more, well, disgusts me and has done for years and years. Our village GP in France's wife was a great conservationist and she had four kids and they were great kids, but the two do not go together, one cannot save the planet and a big family, just does not go together.

[/quote]

Oh well, you wouldn't like my family then, I'm married to an Irish lass who has three brothers and three sisters, with all our children; grand children and now great grand children plus in laws etc. when our latest grandson was born he was family member 57. Although my daughter wasn't amused when I suggested she called him Heinz. Listen I came from a small family and I couldn't be happier, I have never met a more close knit bunch who care for everybody, and every year we have a superb family party and everybody attends because we have such a great time that no one wants to miss out. It's bit of a logistical nightmare sometimes, but my wife and her sisters got together in the early days and they decided because of the cost no child over 15 got Christmas presents and that there was a limit on birthday present costs, after all not every body had well paid jobs,  the Christmas card cost is a bit expensive, but well worth it. You don't know what your missing Idun,as for saving the planet I'd rather be a member of a happy family . [:D]

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Was watching the news last night and they showed a refugee camp near the Syrian border where the people have nothing at all, no food or water hardly and yet the family they interviewed already had four little kids with the mother expecting again.That is irresponsible behaviour to me when these people knew they could be on the run at any given time yet they still pump out more mouths to feed and expect the authorities to take care of them! They should be issuing condoms not rice!
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I'm curious as to how so many people who left the UK for. a better life in France are so vehement about others who have left their countries for a better life in Europe. And, incidentally, the UK has fewer of these migrants than, say, Germany...but that's another matter.

If Brexit comes about, perhaps you'll be OK with being repatriated in a steel box, suffocated en route?

When you first seized the opportunity to move to France, how many of you did so because, in your opinion, the UK (or "YUK" as I recall many preferring to describe it) was going to the dogs. And did you at that juncture opt to stay and do something about it?

Migration to another country seems fine if the colour of your skin and the size of your wallet conform to certain unspoken norms.
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Not the same scenario at all, for a start we came to France and contributed to society and were not refugees nor have we pumped out more mouths to feed. No vehemence at all, just making an observation that this sort of thing did not happen previously until the UK decided to make itself known as a soft touch to anyone who wanted everything free without putting in first, try doing that here! I feel very sorry for all these people who have been forced to flee but surely you can see that they must also take responsibility for their actions as well and not keep adding more mouths to feed from ignorance and lack of self control until they are settled.
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