Sunflower Posted September 14, 2015 Share Posted September 14, 2015 I wonder how many of those who supported Charlie Hebdo still feel the same after their latest, rather sick contribution?http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3234094/French-magazine-Charlie-Hebdo-facing-legal-action-publishing-cartoons-mocking-death-drowned-Syrian-toddler-Aylan-Kurdi.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idun Posted September 14, 2015 Share Posted September 14, 2015 That is what Charlie Hebdo does, it makes it's commentary via cartoons. It is what it has always done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunflower Posted September 14, 2015 Author Share Posted September 14, 2015 In other words, it has always been sick and twisted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YCCMB Posted September 14, 2015 Share Posted September 14, 2015 From today's Independent:"Maajid Nawaz, founder of the think-tank Quilliam defended the magazine's cartoon: "Taste is always in the eye of the beholder. But these cartoons are a damning indictment on our anti-refugee sentiment," he wrote on Facebook. "The McDonald's image is a searing critique of heartless European consumerism in the face of one of the worst human tragedies of our times."So, you pays your money...one person's "sick and twisted" is another person's "searing critique of heartless European consumerism in the face of one of the worst human tragedies of our times"I'd venture to suggest that the Daily Mail would err on the side of the former. But then Je suis toujours Charlie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunflower Posted September 14, 2015 Author Share Posted September 14, 2015 Not sure you'd feel the same if you were Aylan's father - but then who cares about such trivial things as a recently bereaved family.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chancer Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 There is also a cartoon mocking Aylan’s religion, with a caption reading: ‘Proof that Europe is Christian’. It shows a Jesus-like figure next to the words ‘Christians walk on water’ and a little boy upended in the sea next to the words ‘Muslim children sink’. They do not show that cartoon, probably just as well, if it is true then I am definitely no more Charlie and even if I were I would not have the balls (or stupidity) to have a "Je suis Charlie" banner on my car or T-shirt. I have a very uncomfortable foreboding about this.......................... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YCCMB Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 There are actually numerous cartoons like that all over the place. In fact I saw one on Facebook only this morning. And it wasn't from CH. I'd link to it for you but I would die of old age going through the 95 steps to get it from there to here.If the intent behind such cartoons needs explaining to you, as it appears it does, then you've missed the point. I'll just say that your indignation is wasted and misplaced.And, Sunflower, if you are suggesting that we should now somehow be glad that eleven people were killed and a further 11 injured, excluding the further 5 murdered and11 injured in Vincennes because they retrospectively "deserved" it..... I pity you. Or perhaps their recently bereaved families are somehow different? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoddy Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 Both of the Hebdo cartoons are shown in the Independent.Hoddy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YCCMB Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 ...Which manages a slightly more balanced view, as I quoted above, whereas the Mail and Sun....well, they've been clambering up onto the moral high ground from their usual position in the gutter with the rapidity of drowning vermin.http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2015/09/03/daily-mail-migrant-refugee-aylan-kurdi_n_8081424.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idun Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 [quote user="Sunflower"]I wonder how many of those who supported Charlie Hebdo still feel the same after their latest, rather sick contribution?http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3234094/French-magazine-Charlie-Hebdo-facing-legal-action-publishing-cartoons-mocking-death-drowned-Syrian-toddler-Aylan-Kurdi.html[/quote]And maybe, I would not have thought, there's a civil war here, let's have another baby!!!!!!!!! Why would any couple have a child in such circumstances? Don't get it, will never get it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idun Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 I believe it is a dangerous line to cross to censor or suppress satirists, or comedians. Never to everyone's taste, but that does not matter. IF I groan or disagree about something, then I do. I would not stop them or discourage them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickP Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 [quote user="Sunflower"]Not sure you'd feel the same if you were Aylan's father - but then who cares about such trivial things as a recently bereaved family....[/quote] Would that be the same man who it is alleged could well be involved with the people smugglers and indeed was driving the boat when it sank? Plus who was already living in a safe country? Therefor having no need to go to Canada to have his teeth fixed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunflower Posted September 15, 2015 Author Share Posted September 15, 2015 With the exception of Chancer I find your attitudes truly disgusting. Your comments say more about you than I ever could. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JandM Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 Well said idun.We all have to be with Voltaire on this. However offensive CH's latest cartoon offerings might be, Je suis Charlie is all about supporting the right to freedom of expression, which includes being offensive. That there are people outside the world of these Islamist maniacs who don't get that is worrying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chancer Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 What makes you think that I dont "get it" and why should that worry you? Just because I found the cartoon very distastefull does not mean that I cannot understand and/or respect the viewpoint of others, condemning those that dont "get it" seems to me to be no different to the way that ISIS, or extremists of any religion behave. Why should we all have to be with Voltaire or anyone on this or any other subject? I found one of the replies on this thread to be as distastefull as the cartoon but I still "get" where they are coming from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunflower Posted September 15, 2015 Author Share Posted September 15, 2015 Except 'the right to freedom of expression' is not universal: http://www.timesofisrael.com/rupert-murdoch-apologizes-for-netanyahu-cartoon/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickP Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 [quote user="Chancer"] I found one of the replies on this thread to be as distastefull as the cartoon but I still "get" where they are coming from.[/quote]Name names, don't be shy. Why is it that some people don't like the truth? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JandM Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 [quote user="Chancer"]What makes you think that I dont "get it" and why should that worry you? Just because I found the cartoon very distastefull does not mean that I cannot understand and/or respect the viewpoint of others, condemning those that dont "get it" seems to me to be no different to the way that ISIS, or extremists of any religion behave. Why should we all have to be with Voltaire or anyone on this or any other subject? I found one of the replies on this thread to be as distastefull as the cartoon but I still "get" where they are coming from.[/quote]Chancer, if it's my post that you're responding to... I've no idea whether you 'get it' or not. I wasn't referring to anything that you'd said. I was actually thinking of the OP's comments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JandM Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 ..and how do you post up other people's quotes without getting all that gibberish!!? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chancer Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 [quote user="NickP"][quote user="Chancer"] I found one of the replies on this thread to be as distastefull as the cartoon but I still "get" where they are coming from.[/quote]Name names, don't be shy. Why is it that some people don't like the truth?[/quote] Cant speak for "some people" but I have no dislike for the truth, I respect other people opinions and how they express them be it orally or the cartoons, that doesnt stop me from finding them distastefull. The Christians walk on water and Muslim children sink if that is what it was (I havn't seen the cartoon) is in my opinion very poor taste at a time when many people are drowning whilst trying to flee a murderous and oppressive regime, and its not a religious matter for me but one of common decency and respect, would people have been saying and printing similar things after the Hillsborough or Aberfan disasters? And what is "the truth" that you are referring to, your own posting used the word "alleged" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YCCMB Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 And if it was me, Chancer, I wasn't addressing you, either. I read an interesting article a few weeks ago after the sad death of this tiny child. It mentioned that his father took the bodies of his children back - to Syria - for burial. IF this was true, it does beg the question, well, several, in fact, why he felt safe enough to return to do that, yet not safe enough to remain there in the first place. I must add that the article, which was, like most, somewhat biased in its stance, may not be correct. If it is, that's slightly strange.Sunflower, you are entitled to your opinion, as are we all. However, beyond my ongoing support for freedom of expression, you know nothing about me. However, I am quite sure that, as you point out, I will be judged by what I have said on this thread. I am optimistic that few will reach the same judgment that you have, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunflower Posted September 15, 2015 Author Share Posted September 15, 2015 It's surprising how much you learn about people after ten years+ on a forum ;)PS Your 'freedom of expression' ends where it infringes on someone else's rights to peaceful existence. Anti-Semitism being a case in point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lindal1000 Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 But that was the whole thing about CH and the IS attacks wasn't it? They published a cartoon that, in the eyes of some Muslims, was offensive. I'd never heard of CH before and after the attacks I read some of their editions. It's not my cup of tea and I don't find them that funny or satirical myself.. however I also think that nothing they wrote justified them being murdered by a couple of nut case extremists..so, for that reason.. je suis Charlie, although I still don't have much interest in their publication. For me it represents solidarity in the time of suffering, not support for a comic strip. Incidentally the Je suis Charlie campaign has been very actively fighting the cause for the displaced refugees at the moment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickP Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 [quote user="Chancer"] And what is "the truth" that you are referring to, your own posting used the word "alleged"[/quote]It's alleged that he was involved with people smugglers. Fact 1, he was safe in Turkey and didn't need to get into a boat and by doing so endangered his family. Fact2, He was driving the boat when it sunk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YCCMB Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 I'll tell my lifelong best friend, Mrs Cohen, that you think I'm anti Semitic. She'll howl with laughter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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