tax on house sale

[Will]

I think that what Beryl is thinking of is a myth put about by certain sections of the media and some expat groups. As far as I am aware, anybody taking up permanent residence in Britain is eligible to join the NHS and receive free treatment. The confusion seems to have come as a result of people who have moved away, finding that after three months or more of absence, they may no longer automatically be eligible for free treatment if they temporarily visit Britain, and feeling aggrieved because they think that having paid into the NHS they should be able to still get something out of it. That seems to have been exaggerated through the Chinese Whispers principle to denying NHS membership for those returning permanently, which, of course, is not the case at all.

This explains things: http://www.dh.gov.uk/en/Policyandguidance/International/OverseasVisitors/Browsable/DH_074376

Of course, if you live in France, and belong to the French health system, and visit Britain then you will receive free treatment if you have a CEAM (the French EHIC). There is further scope for confusion here in that the E111, which is one of the forms replaced by the CEAM/EHIC, was not needed for visits to Britain whereas the CEAM is necessary.

[bigears]

allamb

If I decide I am french resident and fill out a tax return here will my local tax office ask me to prove I meet the criteria?  A friend went to the his local tax office a couple of months ago an said he was moving full time to france, the jist of what he was told was to inform them when he was officially 'resident' and there was some discussion about filling out a tax form, no questions about proving the criteria mentioned.  In practice is it not us retirees who decide or residency.

[Will]

Bigears, if you make a tax return in France then you effectively declare yourself tax resident as far as the French authorities are concerned. Of course, you may still qualify as a UK tax resident in which case the British will want, and may well be entitled to, their pound of flesh. Where you actually pay tax on any given sum will be covered by the double taxation agreement; you could well end up paying taxes in more than one country (though not on the same slice of income). The situation is further confounded by the fact that Britain has an 'ordinarily resident' status, which France does not have, and which can cover those who flit between countries.

Although my situation is not the same as yours - I work and am not retired - I do have houses freely available to me in both France and England, so have some experience. I am currently French tax resident, but thanks to where I actually work, and to the double taxation agreement, I actually pay my tax and NI in Britain. In fact health and social security contributions are an even more complicated subject than tax, though they only really affect those in work.

If you want to know more about tax residence and domicile then I recommend, as a bit of light reading, HMRC's publication IR20. Though that only gives the British side of the argument.

[Chancer]

Well it certainly wasnt a myth for me in December 2004. It can happen to you even if you have been on holiday for one day longer than a month.

I had left to backpack around the world in March 2004 with the intention of moving to france at the end of around 2 years travelling, unfortunately I contracted Falciparum Malaria in Vanuatu and was hospitalised in Australia when the symptoms became apparent after the incubation period. Cairns Base hospital was great but had to discharge me almost as soon as I reagained consciousness and made some recovery just before Christmas, this was because being a party town they knew that they would be under seige from drink related fighting and stabbing injuries.

I had travel insurance and when I tried to give them the details they said no need, there is nothing to pay as you are English, they did not want to see my passport. I was in no mood or condition to stay in Oz to recuperate as I was also then incontinent and had to wear a nappy I tried to book a flight back to my home in England, the airline would not let me travel without a letter from the hospital which they gave me stating that the Malaria was still present in my blood count and that I had to resume testing straight away under the suparvision of my UK Doctor. I in fact travelled home with the very first victims of the Tsunami, actually whilst they thought that they were victims there were just displaced holidaymakers.

I wont go into how the receptionist at my surgery told me that I had to wait 2 weeks to see the doctor and failed to see the significance of the letter to him from the Australian doctor (that would be another posting on its own) so i went directly to the hospital who did understand the letter, did the blood tests but said that I would have to go to the social security office to fill out some forms or I would have to pay.

These forms were a right to reside form and a habitual residency test, they were clearly written for people who have just arrived and are trying to claim benefits or asylum speakers etc, I had the choice of several different language interpreters if i did not undersatnd the forms.

What in fact I couldnt understand is why I had to do the forms at all having paid in to the system for 32 years as an employer and employee just because I had been away, without working for more than 31 days.

I was told that I had to answer very question fully and honestly so I started.

When did you come here and why? - I gave my date of birth and said that I had no choice in the matter.

What did you bring with you and why? or if no posessions why? - i answered that I came into this world with nothing as persons unknown had removed my placenta and umbilical cord.

Where are you staying and why? - I gave my address and said ITS MY HOME!

Do you have any family here, have you been in regular contact, if not why not etc etc etc.

Finally when she realised what I was writing she became human again and said "how about we start again, i will fill in the answers and you can just sign the forms at the end? - I hate having to conduct these tets as much as normal people hate doing them"

So that is the story of how I once again became eligible for National Health Benefits

[Sunday Driver]

How many of the members of this forum have bought a house in France with the intention of living permanently here, but retained a property in the UK just in case they don't get on with France?  They move over, start paying French tax and all the other 'residence' things.  Then after a couple of years, they find that France is not for them, so they sell their French house (now their maison principale) and move back to live in the UK.

This is the same situation.  Think about it....

 

 

 

[bigears]

hi

I really love france but in about three years time after having done europe in a camping car bought with the money the french tax authorities would have taken if our house was a maison secondaire, we will probably stay in nz for a few years

[woolybanana (ex tag)]

Jolly good idea. Got space on the luggage rack for me.