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Speedferries Problems


BJSLIV
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It looks as though travel to and from Dover will be getting more expensive.

http://www.speedferries.com/

Arrest of SpeedOne by the Port Authorities in Boulogne

Yesterday afternoon, shortly after 17:00 UK time, the Port authorities of Boulogne arrested SpeedFerries’ SpeedOne during its turnaround. The arrest was made on the basis of SpeedFerries Limited’s debts to the port in relation to port dues and taxes.

The arrest was totally unexpected, as the authorities had given written confirmation that no legal steps would be taken prior to a meeting planned for 10:00 today. At this meeting SpeedFerries in consultation with its bankers and financial advisors, were to present a proposal for a resolution of the issues relating to outstanding dues and taxes, as well as disputes with the Port regarding:

A) Substantial counterclaims towards the Port which have been entirely ignored by the French authorities, and

B) Serious competition and discriminatory issues in relation to the Port’s dealings with a French ferry operator preparing to start-up a Dover-Boulogne service.

The authorities informed the SpeedFerries staff on site that the arrest was carried out despite the written agreement, as “this would strengthen the negotiating position of the Port against SpeedFerries”.

As the actions of the Boulogne Port authorities are now proven to be unpredictable and inconsistent with their given guarantees, SpeedFerries finds itself in a position where it is unable to inform its customers, employees or business partners, of a firm date for the resumption of services.

The company deeply regrets this situation and asks everyone affected to accept our sincere apologies. Further statements will be issued when more information of substance becomes available

SpeedFerries Limited
Curt Stavis
Chief Executive Officer

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Mmmm.............

Something was telling me to wait before lashing out £250 on another 10 tickets, the same niggling doubts that told me not to put all my savings in a British/Icelandic bank.

Its a pity that on both occasions I have chosen to ignore my gut instinct [:(]

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Is there a 'financial expert' who can answer. Does a book of tickets count as one purchase, thus refundable under the credit card. Or does it count as multiple purchases of less than £100. I am tending to fear the latter, as if say half the tickets have been used then there is less than £100 credit left. Tricky one?
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Thanks for pointing that out, it hadn't occurred to me there would be any chance of getting anything back. Would it matter if the voucher was purchased quite a long time back? I've never claimed anything back from a credit card, is it straightforward?

But hey, they haven't offically gone under yet have they?
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This is quite sad for many of us who have used this service since it first started and have not had many complaints about the way it operates. It was cheap and cheerful for me and I have used it at least 20+ times without any major complaints. Knowing that the company was in some sort of trouble would have been handy ( since I bought 10 tickets a month ago) but deciding to go to France to 'winter' the house and coming back last week was lucky for me , but there must be many out there who have paid and now have to find other ways of getting across. Reading other web sites etc it seems that they have been in some sort of finanical trouble (fuel prices come to the top) but also it has the 'LD lines' being favored for futher operations, this has been mentioned also. Good luck to them and I for one hope the service resumes as although it still takes me 6 hours to drive to our house, its better then paying £300+ and having a 8/10 hour ferry trip.
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[quote user="BJSLIV"]

B) Serious competition and discriminatory issues in relation to the Port’s dealings with a French ferry operator preparing to start-up a Dover-Boulogne service.

[/quote]

 

Is that LD Lines? I read that they plan a Dover- Boulogne service next summer.

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The trouble is, as I see it, that without Speedferries the other operators will be able to put their prices up, so not only will we lose the cheapest, the knock on effects will be long term. And I may have lost 6 out of my 10 crossing superticket! Over the 3 tickets (30 crossings) bought this way though I suspect I have still made significant savings so not too much to grumble about.
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[quote user="Marym2"]This is quite sad for many of us who have used this service since it first started and have not had many complaints about the way it operates. It was cheap and cheerful for me and I have used it at least 20+ times without any major complaints. Knowing that the company was in some sort of trouble would have been handy ( since I bought 10 tickets a month ago) but deciding to go to France to 'winter' the house and coming back last week was lucky for me , but there must be many out there who have paid and now have to find other ways of getting across. Reading other web sites etc it seems that they have been in some sort of finanical trouble (fuel prices come to the top) but also it has the 'LD lines' being favored for futher operations, this has been mentioned also. Good luck to them and I for one hope the service resumes as although it still takes me 6 hours to drive to our house, its better then paying £300+ and having a 8/10 hour ferry trip.[/quote]

 

why not use newhaven / dieppe ferry then  ......newhaven is the nearest port to most of London.....4 hour crossing .....as for the driving time the other side no idea....but a return crossing is £140

 

 

sheldon

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[quote user="sheldonrobbo"] 

why not use newhaven / dieppe ferry then  ......newhaven is the nearest port to most of London.....4 hour crossing .....as for the driving time the other side no idea....but a return crossing is £140

 sheldon

[/quote]

But Dover-Boulogne with Speedferries is a one hour crossing and some of my return trips have cost me just £40. I make at least 4 return crossings a year so if SF goes it will make quite a difference to both time and cost. I rather doubt we will see as many offers now on the tunnel, which would be the natural alternative for me, as sitting on a boat on the Channel for 4 hours each way (say 32 hours per year) holds little appeal.

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[quote user="Alan Zoff"][quote user="sheldonrobbo"] 

why not use newhaven / dieppe ferry then  ......newhaven is the nearest port to most of London.....4 hour crossing .....as for the driving time the other side no idea....but a return crossing is £140

 sheldon

[/quote]

But Dover-Boulogne with Speedferries is a one hour crossing and some of my return trips have cost me just £40. I make at least 4 return crossings a year so if SF goes it will make quite a difference to both time and cost. I rather doubt we will see as many offers now on the tunnel, which would be the natural alternative for me, as sitting on a boat on the Channel for 4 hours each way (say 32 hours per year) holds little appeal.
[/quote]

 

hi alan

 

in your instance it may not be a good option to use dieppe....i was merely pointing out that in marym's case it probably is......hate to state the obvious but i think speedferries desire to undercut the competition has led to there impending demise......and i think you're right the special offers on the tunnel will be a thing of the past.

 

sheldon

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I have used Speedferries every 4 days for the last 3 1/2 years for my commute to and from work in the UK, so to say they would be missed is something of an understatement ! It was their low prices which allowed me to move here when I did, instead of waiting until I retired. I currently have about £800 in advanced bookings which I stand to lose if they fold (bought on a debit card as I wont have a credit card).

Yet I do not have any ill feeling towards them; whether you used them or not, whether you liked them or not, if you used any Dover ferry in the last 4 years you have benefited from the price war they started. I am watching now with trepidation for the other Pirates to start hiking their prices the moment SF goes under, as it could mean me having to move back to the UK . So thanks Speedferries for what you tried to achieve and let's all spare a thought for his employees who face losing their jobs, not only in the run up to Christmas but also at the start of a serious recession.

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Just to provide some clarity.

LD Lines are opening a route between Dover & Boulogne next June.  The ship currently ear-marked is the Norman Spirit from Portsmouth.  Crossing Time would be 1hr 45mins with four departures from each port per day.  LD Lines are a budget operator in my mind, similar to that of Norfolkline in the early days.

Alot has changed in the ferry industry since Speedferries arrived on the scene, not of it good for anyone.  All ferry companies have seen large increases in fuel cost, they are now required to use Low Sulpher fuels and a few weeks ago this was running at in excess of $600 per metric tonne.  (For reference Norfolkline use nearly 100 tonnes per day in each of their ships, this was nearer 150 tonnes under their old schedule - amended from 1hr 45 to 2hrs).  Not sure how many people have read about the changes to the way ports are taxed, and this would have hit Speedferries also, but it used to be the port paid tax and then the port charged the company concerned.  Now the Government have got involved and prices of been hiked considerably.  IIRC P&O have been landed with a £7.2million bill this year (£5million of that is backdated) and this is ontop of their extra £40 million fuel bill this year.

I think Speedferries whilst all well and good failed to adapt to the changes in the ferry market, in fact from what I have read they have never made a profit since beginning to operate.

Yes I believe ferry prices may rise, but they will not rise much as there is still plenty of competition out of Dover and consumers have little money.  Norfolkline who are currently offering £19 each way, earlier in the year it was £24. 

If for a moment I could ask you to look at it this way, if a company was to charge such low prices so that you are happy but this led to them being unable to fund new ships (P&O's latest are £148 million each) and that they were only able perform essential maintenance.  Would you be happy?  I suspect the answer is No in the long term. 

Just working the maths, the life expectancy of a ferry is 30 years. 

£148 million divided by 30 years would be: £4,933,333 each year to be recovered, add to this the fuel each year needed for an average of 16 hours at sea each day would bring the total to £18,912,833 at todays prices.  I think it is safe to say that is one large amount of money to be found (£51,816 per day!!) and that is before you take into account all the crew, port charges, port fees for you to use the ship and ongoing maintance, so that will put this up a considerable amount. 

Speedferries did not have bills of this size, their crew was a fraction the size you need for a conventional ferry, the port charges would have been less as it is done on tonnage and size, the cost of repairs would have been cheaper and fuel will have been also due to the different kind of fuel used.  The only things similar would have been port fees.

Having just had a look at P&O, they offer season tickets. Purchase 9 return tickets, any duration from £27 each way.  Seafrance are offering 6 crossings (3 returns) from £32 each way, 10 crossings (5 returns) from £30 each way, 14 crossings (7 returns) from £28 each way, 18 crossings (9 returns) from £26 each way.  LD Lines also offer a frequent traveller scheme on their Portsmouth route, not sure what the figures will be for the Dover route if it will apply.  All of these are available via their website.

Speedferries are only the latest and by no means I think will be the last in the line of companies to either cease or drastically cut their services.  In the last six months we have seen the end of Krystlink in Norway, DFDS to Norway from Newcastle & Superfast from Roysth to Zeebrugge. 

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[quote user="lazycyclist"]

I have used Speedferries every 4 days for the last 3 1/2 years for my commute to and from work in the UK, so to say they would be missed is something of an understatement ! It was their low prices which allowed me to move here when I did, instead of waiting until I retired. I currently have about £800 in advanced bookings which I stand to lose if they fold (bought on a debit card as I wont have a credit card).

[/quote]

You might be ok.

In this  article it explains how Visa debit cardholders were able to get their money back when Zoom and other airlines went bust.

Visa debit

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What ferry guru says is correct of course. In fact I made several of the same points on a certain other forum a couple of days ago, and got a pretty frosty reception. But what's the point of considering the true facts when there are conspiracy theories to propound and the cheapskates bemoan the loss of cheap fares that they never should have been offered in the first place?

Yes, that's right, Speedferries was great while it lasted, and the gamble may have paid off, but its initial business model was never sustainable. The ship was picked up on a very cheap charter deal, at a time when there was over-capacity in the fast ferry market, and the Australian builder, which had operated on building ships 'on spec' and finding buyers or charterers rather than the usual build-to-order practice, was on the verge of bankruptcy, having several very expensive ships available or being built, and no orders. One of the 'stock' ships was a former Australian navy vessel, known as Hull 045, the ex HMAS Jervis Bay, that had been converted back to commercial standards. This is the ship that Speedferries picked up on a bargain charter from the shipyard's administrators.

The yard, Incat, recovered and is still building ships. That proves that the market had turned round, and such a cheap deal would not be repeatable. At some time the charter would come up for renewal and the company knew that it would be faced with either paying proper commercial rates, buying its own ship, or looking elsewhere (it had already failed to secure its much-needed second vessel). When that happened, Speedferries arranged to purchase the ship from Incat. Whether or not it was a wise move is debatable - it cost Speedferries £13.5 million (see here) which obviously had to be repaid.

By then the company was stuck with its much-hyped policy of undercutting the competition: it had to either do this or become a 'pirate' itself. Combined with volatile fuel prices - which, for the reasons ferry guru says, have affected operators of conventional ferries in the area even more - and other costs, something had to give. Given Speed One's history, which wasn't the easiest of lives, I am not entrely sure I would agree with FG's observation that repairs may be cheaper for fast ferries - at least not in this case. Remember too the not-entirely-apochryphal tales of the early Incat ships carrying teams of on-board welders, who reattached the seams of the aluminium hulls as they came apart. Whatever, there was a maintenance budget for this ship that had to be accounted for alongside all the other capital and running costs.

There is a simple solution. Speedferries can pay the money it owes in port dues and taxes, the ship will then be released, and the service can continue. The fact that this has not happened does not engender confidence for the future, if there is one.

It was great while it lasted, and the gamble might have worked, however unlikely that seemed to those of us in possession of the true facts and with a bit of knowledge of the economics of operating ships.

At least Speedferries gave a few years of low fares. Don't forget that Hoverspeed pulled out, and the other recent proposed Dover fast ferry operations never even started. 

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There may a glimmer of hope, I saw Speed-one at its mooring today with all its lights on, an article in todays edition of "La voix du Nord" said that any resumption of schedule on Monday would be dependant on the outcome of negotiations being held today (Sunday). It was still there lit up like a christmas tree when I left Boulogne around 17.30.

If they were indeed having discussions on a Sunday then someone must be taking it seriously.

I too feel for the employees at this difficult time, some of them must have faced serious difficulties trying to return to their families on Thursday evening, probably some with very young children.

Despite feeling daft for buying a 10 ticket voucher only last weekend against a nagging doubt I also have no bad feelings, I can remember the prices in the bad old days after the loss of duty free and before speedferries and  I fear that they will swiftly return. The prices (including speedferries) have already recently shot up after the loss of capacity on Eurotunnel, this can only worsen the situation for the consumer.

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It would be great if finance could be found and the service restarted of course. Although Speedferries is clearly worried about the competition from the forthcoming LD Lines service, it should still be possible to offer cheaper passenger fares than LD. Don't forget that LD, which proposes to use the Norman Spirit vessel, is primarily a freight carrier, while the Speedferries ship can carry only cars, passengers and light vans. A return to a more realistic pricing structure may be a temporary shock, but would be better in the longer term if it aids the survival of the more competitively-minded ferry operators.

Comments on other forums suggest that if the advance tickets were bought by credit card (or even, possibly, debit card) there is a good chance that the unused tickets can be refunded.

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All this talk of 'shame if they have gone because they gave cheap fares' and others bewailing the fact that they have bought x number of tickets in advance'.

If Speedferries do not have the cash then it has been pricing incorrectly. Also, if this is the case it has been using the advanced ticket sales to subsidise the under pricing. Not a very good game to play.

Always a problem if you rely on one carrier because they are cheap. You need to consider what the consequences are if they go bust.

Paul 

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