Travel in the EU for Brits next year

[nomoss]

Recently published guide:-

https://ec.europa.eu/info/sites/info/files/brexit_files/info_site/borders_seminar_ppp_final_public.pdf

Don't ask me what all the abbreviations stand for[:(]

I wonder if the EU are going to continue to use English for their communications? - maybe the UK should licence the use of it and charge them a fee, say a few million €'s per year.[:D]

Might be a useful bargaining chip in the negotiations.

[woolybanana]

The folk who write this stuff are probably plugged into the mains every night!

[[email protected]]

I didn't see any inexplicable abbreviations?

(OK go on - call my bluff and make me wish I hadn't set myself up as Clever Clogs !)

[NormanH]

It all looks reasonable enough to me. If you leave  the  club you no longer have the right to cheap drinks at the bar, even if you used to be a member...

[[email protected]]

Not even if the club needs you more than you need it?

[nomoss]

[quote user="EuroTrash"]I didn't see any inexplicable abbreviations?

(OK go on - call my bluff and make me wish I hadn't set myself up as Clever Clogs !)[/quote]

Page 2 - EES & ETIAS - deciphered on page 8, I had no idea until I got there

Page 4 - SBC & MS - I guess MS = Member State, SBC I have no idea

Page 12 - DDL - No idea

I think it's pathetic to use shorthand like this in an official document - Why???

It's not written for French people whose whole lives are filled with acronyms for outlandish titles.

I don't care anyway, stamps in passports provide a nice souvenir of one's travels. I put the dates and places of all the stamps on my previous seven expired or filled passports into a spreadsheet and sorted them by date, so I can accurately figure out where I was at any time.

I think WB is correct about them

[[email protected]]

DDL = deadline, quite common in bizspeak I think?

SBC = Schengen Borders Code, not common parlance but to be fair it is to these guys.

Now don't be crabby, nomoss. It's a routine summary of an EU internal meeting. It's not an official document published for public consumption. They put records of all their meetings on their website for anybody who is interested to look, because the EU has a policy of transparency. Whether HMG uses "shorthand" in its summaries of its own internal meetings,is anybody's guess because HMG doesn't believe in transparency. Folk have to make freedom of information requests if they want to read a report of a meeting and even then it blocks them if it can.

[pomme]

SBC - Schengen Border Code

DDL - Disclosure Authority Letter

This British in Europe document on the topic is easier to understand

https://www.britishineurope.org/articles/63738-travelling-into-and-out-of-the-schengen-area?fbclid=IwAR0zJNTWk_WfysVIjUpof8bj5X7yCg4pmkJUpUqnBSgSb_pO4HaSXirZ2Q8

and a shortcode version

https://tinyurl.com/y3y7jz8x

[Sprogster]

The Schengen rules for visiting UK citizens will be less flexible than for EU citizens visiting the UK. A citizen from the EU will be able to visit the UK for up to six months a year, all in one block if they wish. A UK citizen visiting the EU will be restricted to 90 days out of 180. So if you have a second home in the EU, if you stay there ninety days, you cannot return to anywhere in the Schengen area for 90 days.

So if you visit any EU country except Ireland, you are going to have to be careful you do not exceed 90 out of 180 days on a rolling basis.

[[email protected]]

Sprogster wrote: "So if you visit any EU country except Ireland, you are going to have to be careful you do not exceed 90 out of 180 days on a rolling basis."

Or, apply for a visa to allow you to visit for longer.

[BritinBretagne]

The visa details make interesting reading.

[NormanH]

Are  the Schengen  rules the same for other non EU citizens?  Have they changed  recently?

[[email protected]]

Schengen rules are the same for everybody except those with freedom of movement. AFAIK the rules have been the same for ages, if not since Schengen was invented, although advances in border technology has made the rules easier to enforce.

[AnOther]

[quote user="nomoss"]

Don't ask me what all the abbreviations stand for[:(]

[/quote]

MS had me foxed at first until I twigged that it means Member State.

Still

not figured out exactly what DDL stands for but it seems to be a

reference to the end of the transition period on Dec 31st.

[[email protected]]

An0ther wrote: "Still not figured out exactly what DDL stands for but it seems to be a reference to the end of the transition period on Dec 31st."

See posts above.

DDL normally stands for DeaDLine.

Pomme had a different answer but I still think it means deadline here..

[betise]

Honestly, if by DDL they mean deadline, why not just write it in full? For one use of DDL they then say "In constitutive systems: until the end of the application DDL (grace period)

set by the respective Member State / after the end of the DDL + certificate of application."

[[email protected]]

deleted, double post

[[email protected]]

betise wrote the following post at 07/11/2020 11:32:

Honestly, if by DDL they mean deadline, why not just write it in full? For one use of DDL they then say "In constitutive systems: until the end of the application DDL (grace period)

set by the respective Member State / after the end of the DDL + certificate of application."

Well just think of all the keystrokes they have saved!

For DDL meaniing deadline:

https://webgate.ec.europa.eu/fpfis/mwikis/thinktank/inde

x.php/DDL#:~:text=DDL%20stands%20for%20deadline%2C%20often%20before%20COB.

For other EU abbreviations - fill your boots (but it doesn't include DDL)

https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/ramon/cybernews/abbrevi

ations.htm

But, I do think that complaining about the EU using shorthand in its internal documents, is rather missing the point that these are internal documents. I'm sure that if/when the EU decides to write a leafelt about this for release to the general public, they will spell things out in full.

[nomoss]

[quote user="EuroTrash"]betise wrote the following post at 07/11/2020 11:32:

Honestly, if by DDL they mean deadline, why not just write it in full? For one use of DDL they then say "In constitutive systems: until the end of the application DDL (grace period)

set by the respective Member State / after the end of the DDL + certificate of application."

Well just think of all the keystrokes they have saved!

For DDL meaniing deadline:

https://webgate.ec.europa.eu/fpfis/mwikis/thinktank/index.php/DDL#:~:text=DDL%20stands%20for%20deadline%2C%20often%20before%20COB

For other EU abbreviations - fill your boots (but it doesn't include DDL)

https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/ramon/cybernews/abbrevi

ations.htm

But, I do think that complaining about the EU using shorthand in its internal documents, is rather missing the point that these are internal documents. I'm sure that if/when the EU decides to write a leafelt about this for release to the general public, they will spell things out in full.[/quote]

I think they are using textspeak, combined with bizspeak and verbosity like "MS to deploy the necessary human resources at their Border Crossing Points or to adapt the infrastructure" to make it seem they are really busy people. I'm surprised, though, that they didn't call the meeting a "Town Hall"[:D]

ET. I don't think it shows transparency. It seems to me that they want to infer (send a message to say) that they are getting tough with the UK.

Returning to my OP. They're using English for reports to a bunch of people from countries where they don't speak it. I know there are Irish there too, but they ought to use their own language.[:)]

[[email protected]]

I'm baffled why people seem to be getting so upset about this unfortunate document.

They're not sending a message are they. It's not a press release. Simply, they held a meeting to clarify how their borders have to operate after Brexit, which seems quite an important thing to clarify when you think about it, and they produced a report of that meeting and put it on their website because that is their internal procedure.

Honestly I think they would probably be surprised at how many members of the public have found their way to this particular document and bothered to read it. Out of all the reports of meetings they post, probably most of them never get a single view from a member of the public.

Look at it this way: if a third party had read the Minutes of a departmental meeting at wherever you used to work, might they not have come across a few abbreviations that everyone in the department was familiar but Joe Public might not be? Didn't your Minutes frequently have action notes that read exactly like the bit you quoted in blue?

I'm sorry Nomoss but I think you've got a bee in your bonnet about this. Tongue sticky out emoji here (I can't do them on Chrome).