Dinner Etiquette

[oscar]

At last!  I've found written evidence of etiquette that my grand-dad taught me and OH always moans about.  I invariably leave just a tiny amount of food of my plate at most courses and OH asks why I can't clear the plate.  My grand-dad told me it was good manners to leave just a small amount (too much may indicate you didn't like the food) to show that you had been given enough to eat.  BUt no one else ever seems to have heard of this one.  I now see that this is Russian dining etiquette.  Don't know where he picked that up from!

[odile]

miam miam - sounds like a great dinner..

French people always find it so funny that Brits pile peas on top of the fork and eat soup 'backwards' and with bowl lifted away from self!

The one real 'faux pas- always remembered from childhood is 'knife NEVER in the mouth- put if you live in rural France, it is often done!

[5-element]

[quote user="odile"]miam miam - sounds like a great dinner..

The one real 'faux pas- always remembered from childhood is 'knife NEVER in the mouth- put if you live in rural France, it is often done!
[/quote]

 

Miam miam from here too.[:)] I certainly wouldn't complain if someone served me that dinner...

Where I grew up in (very) rural France, the neighbours (subsistence farmers) had ways of eating which I used to find so cool, as a child.

Each of the 2 men (father and son) had his own sharp knife. When not in use, the knifes were kept planted in the middle of the wooden table. When it was dinnertime, after the vegetable soup (obligatory, and eaten with a spoon of course) more often than not, each individual knife was the only implement used. For cutting bread from the large "miche", for cutting saucisson and cheese, and then to be brought to the mouth with a piece of food balancing on it, skillfully held there by the thumb. They must have used forks sometimes, but I never saw it. I cannot remember if the "maitresse de maison" (the mother) used her own knife too as a multipurpose piece of cutlery.

 

[Clair]

A very accurate picture, 5-E and one which I witness frequently when my elderly neighbour has her mid-afternoon snack!

She carries one of her Opinel knives folded in the pocket of her apron wherever she goes and it's used indiscriminately to cut some rhubarb, open a bag of frozen food or unclog the rabbits feed-tray... [+o(]

They invariably have potage (veg soup) at mid-day and in the evening and had it even when the outside temp was reaching the mid-forties a couple of years ago!

[lorna]

[quote user="oscar"]At last!  I've found written evidence of etiquette that my grand-dad taught me and OH always moans about.  I invariably leave just a tiny amount of food of my plate at most courses and OH asks why I can't clear the plate.  My grand-dad told me it was good manners to leave just a small amount (too much may indicate you didn't like the food) to show that you had been given enough to eat.  BUt no one else ever seems to have heard of this one.  I now see that this is Russian dining etiquette.  Don't know where he picked that up from![/quote]

Hi Oscar, now that you mention that, I think my grand-mother used to do that as well, I have a vague memory of my grand-father telling her off for always leaving a little food. I think there was French ancestory but Russian is doubtful! Maybe the Victorians adopted the custom?

[Christine Animal]

And the knife is cleaned by wiping it on the trousers.   [:D]

 

[Clair]

Not in my neighbour's house!

She carefully runs it between her thumb and forefinger, which she licks before folding the Opinel against the palm of her hand and putting it back in her apron pocket [:D]

[lorna]

[quote user="odile"]miam miam - sounds like a great dinner..
French people always find it so funny that Brits pile peas on top of the fork and eat soup 'backwards' and with bowl lifted away from self!
The one real 'faux pas- always remembered from childhood is 'knife NEVER in the mouth- put if you live in rural France, it is often done!
[/quote]

Thank-you odile and 5-element.

I've come to think that the British soup thing is actually very sensible. Any spillage has more chance of going back in the bowl rather than on your lap or down your front!

Interesting about the knives. I noticed one guest at our dinner hanging on to his knife throughout. He balanced the end very neatly on a piece of bread.

[lorna]

[quote user="Clair"]Not in my neighbour's house!
She carefully runs it between her thumb and forefinger, which she licks before folding the Opinel against the palm of her hand and putting it back in her apron pocket [:D][/quote]

Hopefully not after using it in the rabbit hutch.[+o(]

[Clair]

Trust me!

You really do not want the gory details [:-))]

[5-element]

So it is still being done just as I remembered it! Very traditional and terroir.....

I take it that nobody wants to know about the same knife used as a toothpick and as a nail-cleaner.... And that's just for starters.[+o(]

[Gemonimo]

My OH used his couteau for all the above and for fixing his tractors[:)][:-))] He would clean it on a piece of bread after having eaten.  And on the subject of dinner etiquette, my MIL said it was very bad manners to cut salad on a plate.  Anyone heard of that?

[powerdesal]

What do you do?, put it on the table cloth and cut it there?

[Clair]

The salad leaves should be prepared small enough to be picked with the fork or folded onto it with the aid of the knife.

[Gemonimo]

[quote user="powerdesal"]What do you do?, put it on the table cloth and cut it there?
[/quote]

Oops! should have seen that one coming! 

[odile]

possibly the most difficult aspect of dinner etiquette, is what to talk about! When I first arrived in the UK, like most foreigners I found the obsession (sp?) with the weather a bit bizarre! I also found it hard that one was not supposed to talk about anything of importance, eg, anything which may be controversial, education, religion, politics, etc. Having been brought up in a family and community where discussions about all the above was part of everyday life - and where in fact one would be almost judged to be less educated or intelligent if you couldn't 'hold your own' and be au fait with local/national/world issues- I found it very hard. One of the things I always look forward to when I go to Europe is to have a good discussion to stimulate 'ze little grey cells' (Poirot) -

Dinner time in France is often the place to have a good old debate - it can get heated, but it's all forgotten by the morning. Any experiences of the kind out there?

[Just Katie]

Yes, I have an experience of a good old French debate about.....................................cake [8-)].

When I visit France, Twinkle insists on a nice lamb dinner with mint sauce.  On the occassion I invite all her French friends around too and, on the last occassion, Twinkle arrived with a beautiful dessert made by the local artisan.

The dinner went down well but I did notice someone left their cauliflower cheese but, being very british when it comes to food, I really did not mind.

Then came the dessert.  It was extremely pretty to look at but I found it a bit gloopy (like many French desserts) and not to my taste so, I had a mouthful and left it.

Twinkles old man asked why and I told him then all hell broke loose.  He could not understand how british people eat shit like apple crumble and spotted dick but leave a masterpiece such as this dessert made by the most famous 'cake maker' in the whole of the Midi.

He turned into a dictator over a bit of cake and I could not believe it.

But by the time the cheese was out, in true French style it was all forgotten about.  (well by him anyway [6])

[Clair]

I'm not sure I follow...

You had the cake before the cheese? [blink][8-)]

[Christine Animal]

Exactly what I was going to say Clair.   [6]   [:D]

(no wonder M. Twinkle was in a bad mood)

 

[Just Katie]

Sorry I meant cogniac [:)].  I did honest.[:D] 

Claire, as a French person, you do not seem taken aback by the bizarre antics of Mr Twinkle.  C'est normal?

God she is going to kill me when she sees this [:$]

[Clair]

1. I've lived in England and I've learnt to accept all such behaviour as normal

2. I'm not into creamy fancy cakes much

[odile]

my godfather was a very well educated and very well off business man - always took me to very good restaurants. He insisted on dressing casually as he had to wear suits all week long - and never let the waiter take his plate away after dinner - insisted on eating his cheese (no pud for him ever) with the gravy left over, mopping it up with bread. He had such confidence that he got away with it. However my dad couldn't believe it when we were invited to dinner in the UK and our host served cheese after pud!  He is now 96 and I have to make him a crumble every few days when I am there... (one of the reasons he can;t wait for us to go and live there). By the way Pierre, he still (cross country) skis but not right across the country

[Just Katie]

[quote user="odile"]- and never let the waiter take his plate away after dinner - [/quote]

Are you sure that is not Mr Twinkle?

I always do that to him.  He gnarls up and says "Zeez blody Breeteesh!"  Then he kind of raises his palm above his head as if there is a fly bothering him and he blows a sort of raspberry the same time.

He then gets some bread and mops up nothing off his clean plate.  What is this man about? [blink]

 

[powerdesal]

Hang on a minute.....Just because something is done one way in France and a different way in UK doesn't make either right or wrong, just different.

The Italians serve champagne after main course to 'cleanse' the palate, doesn't tend to be done in UK as far as I know, is it the practice in France, if not why not? Its just different innit.

[Just Katie]

[quote user="powerdesal"]Hang on a minute.....Just because something is done one way in France and a different way in UK doesn't make either right or wrong, just different.

[/quote]

I agree Steve, but it is always interesting to me to discover what and how things are done differently.