MOBILE HOMES & RESIDENCE

[lebono]

I've just returned from a 4 month stay in France, investigating the possibility of moving to France. Despite this being a long-term ambition and having found a nice general location, I have decided not to make the move. As many others over the age of 60 will understand, time gets far more precious as one gets older and I couldn't bear the thought of wasting this valuable resource in exasperating trips to and from various administrative centres and dealing with possibly intransigent and unhelpful bureaucrats. I suppose I've just left it a bit too late. There are also inheritance tax issues as I have no blood relatives - 60%!!!!  - plus one or two smaller problems.

As a result, I had decided to just spend more and longer holidays over there in order to get my French fix, with the possibility of running a small UK based business aimed at the golfing hoilday market. However, having just got round to reading this month's edition of French Property News on the subject of mobile homes, I am starting to have third thoughts! I am hoping forum members can clarify some matters before I do anything further.

1. Is it the case in France that mobile homes already sited, have a set lifetime, after which one has to move on or buy another?

2. Do the same rules apply regarding French residence i.e. after 3 months one registers and becomes subject to French taxation laws (assuming one has a residence in the UK)?

3. Would I be able to spend just under 6 months in France without having to register?

Hopefully, you can see what I'm trying to achieve and I would be most grateful for any help.

[Bob T]

Not sure what you are trying to achieve, apart from running a business in France without paying French tax on that business.

[Polly]

1. Is it the case in France that mobile homes already sited, have a set lifetime, after which one has to move on or buy another?

No, where did you get this idea from?

2. Do the same rules apply regarding French residence i.e. after 3 months one registers and becomes subject to French taxation laws (assuming one has a residence in the UK)?

More than half the tax year in France, or GB, means you could be described as fiscally domiciled in that country. nb French tax year is the calendar year, not the odd-ball British one. Don't rely on me or anyone else on this forum for personal financial advice, especially if you are thinking of running a business. Plenty of professionals advertise in FPN and can give you legal & accounting advice tailored to your personal situation. Yes, it will cost you, but it will be worth it. Over the age of 60 you may well have pension matters to sort out as well as business income, not to mention investment income

3. Would I be able to spend just under 6 months in France without having to register?

Register for what, exactly?

Don't ignore healthcare issues either. http://www.exclusivehealthcare.com/presentation.html has lots of useful info in English

[PaulT]

[quote user="Polly"]

1. Is it the case in France that mobile homes already sited, have a set lifetime, after which one has to move on or buy another?

No, where did you get this idea from?

[/quote]

I presume he got the idea from UK sites where many require you to buy a new unit from them when the existing mobile becomes x years old

[Stan Streason]

[quote user="Bob T"]Not sure what you are trying to achieve, apart from running a business in France without paying French tax on that business.
[/quote]

Cant help feeling that comment was a bit unfair.If he is UK resident for tax purposes running a business in UK selling French golf holidays to Brits I am sure HM Revenue & Customs will believe whole heartedly that its a UK business not a French one.

[Doodle]

Hi Lebono,

I'm not sure what type of mobile home you are looking for, how much, or where but have a look at the Parc Mayenne website. I think the annual maintenance costs are quite high but then it depends as I said on what you are looking for. Also, it is not too far too drive from the ports or the airports. I have no association with this parc and do not know who the owners are so this is not an advertisement but it may give you some ideas.

Chris

[tinabee]

Have a look at this page to determine what constitutes residence for tax purposes in France;

http://www.french-property.com/guides/france/finance-taxation/taxation/liability-income-tax/residency-status/

From what you have described, it would seem that you can achieve what you want, i.e. to remain a UK resident whilst spending just under 6 months in France.

 

 

[lebono]

Thank you everyone for your replies. To clarify -

1. On many holiday parks in the UK, chalets and some caravans are sold new but with a limited life on the site of 20 or 25 years. After that, you either have to remove it or demolish it.

2. Yes the business would be UK based and subject to the UK tax regime.

3. What I'm trying to achieve is to spend long periods in France without having a legal requirement to register in any way with the French system.

[Mikep]

Nobody likes the bureaucracy, but it can be worth making the effort if your income is mainly pension. Because social charges are not levied on pension income, your marginal rate of income tax is only 14% up to quite a high level (40,000 euros plus for a couple). However, you pay an additional 12% on top for any interest or dividend income. The french income tax self-assessment form is horrific the first time (see other postings!) but much easier afterwards, as all information always goes in the same boxes. The nicest thing is that when you hear UK politicians bribing the electorate with "government money", it's no longer you having to foot the bill. Also, state health insurance is free once one of the couple receives UK state pension (you might want to pay for top-up insurance for the 25-35% of medical bills not covered by the state).

It may just be worth doing the sums before you rule out residence.

[lebono]

The main point is that I can cope perfectly easily with the UK bureaucracy because

a) I understand it &

b) I was in business for 25 years and had to deal with Inland Revenue and VAT on a regular basis and always found them straightforward and helpful.

I have read much about the French application of bureaucracy and it just doesn't cut the mustard. One always has the feeling that it's bureaucrat first and citizen a poor second.

To be perfectly honest, I have far better ways to spend my time.

[Sunday Driver]

You've clearly fallen into the trap of believing the old 'French bureaucracy' myth....

Over 300,000 ordinary French people started up their own small business last year through the simplified autoentrepreneur scheme and they seem to be coping fine.  You have 25 years business experience, so one would have thought that operating a small golfing holiday business out of France would be well within your capabilities. 

Still, you've read all the stories....

 

[Kitty]

I can understand where you are coming from Lebono.  It is easier to operate in a system of which you are familiar.  This is especially the case of your French is scratchy.

[Kitty]

Round our way, on the South West coast, the better caravan parks insist on mobile homes that are under 20 years old and if they are looking shoddy even before that time, they have to be replaced.  So the homes are a depreciating asset.  The site fees are around 2500-3000 euros per year for the better sites.  There is no security of tenure as occupiers on one site found to their cost last year.

The parks are filled with Brits, Dutch and Germans, who live there for long periods of time.  I suspect that many of them are not in the 'French system'.

[lebono]

If I was living in France, I wouldn't bother starting a business as I would be getting my French 'hit' merely by living there.

The small, essentially non-profit business, is just a way of spending more time in France with the added fun of running a small, part-time enterprise. I certainly have no desire to run a full-time business under the new auto-entrepreneur system.

It's pleasing that the French are now, at last, recognising the importance of encouraging small businesses but I'm afraid that they have a very long way to go to match the essentally laissez-faire British model. When I started my own business 30 years ago, I rented an empty shop, purchased some stock and opened for business. All I had to do then was to notify the tax, VAT and local authorities of my existence in order to pay my various dues. I needed no-one's permission to get started.