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Do you care where your food comes from ?


Frederick
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WJT, Clair posted recently about veal with a label like "sous la mere" but I have not been able to find this type of veal.  I haven't eaten veal for at least 40 years and it's not something that I miss because I've forgotten what it tastes like.

Christine, you can make various burgers such as half chick peas and half lentils, spiced with some cinnamon, say, some shallots.  Mix in an eggs and gently fry.  In fact, this was a recipe given to me by Chris Head and they are seriously yummy.

Scooby, you're right about the Vit B 12.  I don't think there are actually any plant derivatives (but I could be wrong).  I suppose at least, if you took a pill, you don't have to taste the meat?

I know, I know, all life is a sort of compromise.  The important thing is to be sure of your own choices and feel able to live with them.

Personally, what I find really hard is throwing food away or wasting it in any way.  Where I grew up, I saw people digging in waste bins for food and scooping up the food that people left on their plates in restaurants.  I was really just a child then but those images have stayed with me through life, hurting something in me and making me feel guilty about not eating something just because I don't like it.

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Well,  what is often not respected is the stunning of animals that are going to be killed " alhal" .

 

In another survey conducted in 2006 and 2007 by OABA in 225 slaughterhouses, more than half of the schools visited reported that they regularly ritual slaughter (28% of adult cattle, calves 43%, 62% of sheep and goats, almost all slaughtered without prior stunning) .
A practice, remember, totally prohibited under French law, which requires so-called conventional slaughterhouses prior stunning of all animals before bleeding

 

I always take care not to buy casher or Hallal meat. 

 

 
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[quote user="Scooby"]I am an 'animal lover' but I do find it strange that some people seem to put kindness to animals above kindness to humans.  Animal charities seem to have more support than those supporting the elderly or mentally ill.  There are hundreds of posts on here about animal cruelty but next to nothing about the abysmal care of the elderly and sick in care homes.  When animals are sick and dying it is considered kinder to put them down - but living wills are frowned upon and those supporting the right of the seriously ill who wish to be able to end it are considered criminal?  Pets frequently get quicker and better care than their owners.  Perspectives are totally screwed.[/quote]

This thread is about whether you care where your food comes from.

Are you suggesting cannabilism as a source of food to humanely stop the suffering of elderly humans?

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B12 in meat comes from two sources 1) ingested B12 from the surface dirt on plant material 2) B12 produced in the gut of animals.  Humans cannot produce B12 in their gut and have to rely on ingested B12.  As an aside, there is some argument that the 'non animal' B12 is slightly different and works antagonistically to natural B12. 

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[quote user="Dog"]

[quote user="Scooby"]I am an 'animal lover' but I do find it strange that some people seem to put kindness to animals above kindness to humans.  Animal charities seem to have more support than those supporting the elderly or mentally ill.  There are hundreds of posts on here about animal cruelty but next to nothing about the abysmal care of the elderly and sick in care homes.  When animals are sick and dying it is considered kinder to put them down - but living wills are frowned upon and those supporting the right of the seriously ill who wish to be able to end it are considered criminal?  Pets frequently get quicker and better care than their owners.  Perspectives are totally screwed.[/quote]

This thread is about whether you care where your food comes from.

Are you suggesting cannabilism as a source of food to humanely stop the suffering of elderly humans?

[/quote]

It was about where your food came from - you turned it into a pro veggie rant. 

I'm suggesting that some peoples' priorities seem a tad screwed up.

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[quote user="dragonrouge"]

OK in Chateau Neuf du Pape Chateau Beaucastel is so very well known all over the world indeed and just down the road from them are two sisters who do not spray and do things in line with the moon but I forget the name of the Domain.

[/quote]

You are probably thinking of Bio Dynamics - they do spray but not with pesticides. It's all a bit like homeopathy and energizing things.

Ask the sisters if they eat meat?

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Used to buy B12 pills for OH but can't say I have been looking out for them here in France.

Dog, I have just looked at the ingredients on OH's jar of Marmite and it says B12 so that should be OK, if he has some Marmite on his toast everyday?

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If you want to look at something really cruel then instead of going to the abattoir visit a home that cares for those in terminal stages of Huntingtons, PSP, motor neurone disease etc. Some of the patients my sister cares for are so desperate to end it they have tried to eat themselves - literally.  Then there are those with motor neurone disease, psp etc who die a long slow death usually by suffocating on their own vomit because they no longer have the neural / muscular capacity to swallow / breathe.  Then there are those in PSV - tracheotomies to breath, peg fed, doubly incontinent and having to be turned every hour to try to avoid bed sores - some of which can be big enough to put your fist into and have to be packed to prevent the bones protruding.

The abattoir's use of a stun gun and single shot to the head seems quite a humane end in comparison.  

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[quote user="ventodue"][quote user="Dog"] 1.2 million tons of Pollack were stolen from the sea the other year in Alaska - it may be considered sustainable????

But they also caught as a 'by product' many other endangered species. [/quote]

Different species, Dog.  The one I referenced is Atlantic Pollock, Pollachius pollachius, the one you're talking about is Alaskan Pollock, Theragra chalcogramma.

But you're absolutely right.  According to the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration  the population of Alaskan Pollock in 2008 was almost 50 percent lower than last year's survey levels.

I quote from their press release of 20 November 2008

NOAA has released new scientific information showing a decline in the biomass that has the agency recommending a cut to the pollock catch for 2009 in the eastern Bering Sea. "Although the pollock biomass was well above average in the 1990s, our surveys show a substantial decline in recent years," said Doug DeMaster, science and research director for NOAA’s Alaska Fisheries Science Center.

Amicalement

Craig

[/quote]

Interesting thread - I've just read it right through.

Is pollack the same as lieu noir? (pollachius virens) If so it's about the cheapest fish you can buy. Why is that if it's becoming so rare.

edit - just seen on the Intermarche report that it's not considered to be over-fished.

I know where our food comes from, most of it anyway.

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[quote user="Frenchie"]

I imagine you wear no leather shoes Dog.

Do not walk in the grass either, there are tiny insects you may kill there.

[/quote]

No I do not wear leather shoes - there are plenty of alternatives.

I would not purposefully kill any insect - though I do have a problem with mosquitos and horse flies.

I don't mind if they drink my blood but the annoying itching they leave behind is painful.

I was flying a kite two days ago in my shorts and didn't realise a horsefly had bitten me 6 times on my legs - I have now got some lovely supurating boils giving off clear liquid and they itch like mad.

If I meet that fly again he might need sending to his next life early.

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Oh, Scooby, the one does not somehow "balance" out the other.  The two things, cruelty to animals and cruelty to our own species are not linked in a straightforward way like that.

I don't like cruelty to either and we can certainly as the human race, if you like, do tons more to be kinder to animals and to each other.

Both types of situation require us to think and to make choices.  Sadly, not all choices are open to everyone and that's where we could usefully direct our thoughts and our actions and, in the hope that one day, we would be able to change some of the really horrific situations that exist in our midst.

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[quote user="Scooby"]If you want to look at something really cruel then instead of going to the abattoir visit a home that cares for those in terminal stages of Huntingtons, PSP, motor neurone disease etc. Some of the patients my sister cares for are so desperate to end it they have tried to eat themselves - literally.  Then there are those with motor neurone disease, psp etc who die a long slow death usually by suffocating on their own vomit because they no longer have the neural / muscular capacity to swallow / breathe.  Then there are those in PSV - tracheotomies to breath, peg fed, doubly incontinent and having to be turned every hour to try to avoid bed sores - some of which can be big enough to put your fist into and have to be packed to prevent the bones protruding.

The abattoir's use of a stun gun and single shot to the head seems quite a humane end in comparison.  
[/quote]

I think a better way could be found to put these people out of their misery than a stun gun.

You have your perspectives muddled as the living creatures you have told us about are old and ill.

I would prefer young fit healthy creatures not to be killed.

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[quote user="Dog"]

You have your perspectives muddled as the living creatures you have told us about are old and ill.

I would prefer young fit healthy creatures not to be killed.

[/quote]

So it's ok for ill humans to be treated cruelly but not young cute animals?  As an aside many of those referred to above are in their twenties or younger.  The girl trying to kill herself is 18.

Having read what you have just written I'm horrified and feel there is no point continuing this discussion.

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[quote user="Scooby"][quote user="Dog"]

You have your perspectives muddled as the living creatures you have told us about are old and ill.

I would prefer young fit healthy creatures not to be killed.

[/quote]

So it's ok for ill humans to be treated cruelly but not young cute animals?  As an aside many of those referred to above are in their twenties or younger.  The girl trying to kill herself is 18.

Having read what you have just written I'm horrified and feel there is no point continuing this discussion.
[/quote]

 

Did I suggest humans should be ill treated???

Sorry I do not go in for anthropomorphism - and the fish spoken about on this thread can hardly  be considered beautiful by most people.

There is far too much sadness in the human world without making more just because you have certain appetites.

Why are these humans being treated cruelly - is the care home badly run or do you think that people shouldn't get ill or diseased.

You can tell a lot about a society by the way it treats animals.

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Wel, I wasn't aware that I was involved really, rather than throwing peanuts into the cage as the debate is far too bad sterile for my sensitive soul. But I am about to halal kill a nice suckling pig for some Muslim visitors to eat tomorrow. Dog, would you like the chitterlings.
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Suckling pig ! Dont mess about wooly get a big one ... You can chat  them up at the Marie in Apremont  and we could cook it on that spit thats already there in the big room fire place and we could all come ...I might even catch the starter out of their lake for you .......regards The Pescitorial Pervert 

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Scooby, you have gone completely off thread with the well known old story, why care about animals when there are so many humans suffering.  We all know that, but the subject on here is food not the elderly in their homes.

We could start a very good thread about that, something I also feel very strongly about, having suffered it through my mother-in-law who I took care of for five years with Alzheimer's.  I did all I could for her to have a quality of life and be respected as anyone should be.  It was very hard work, we had her in a gîte by us with someone living with her as she did not like it in the home, took her out to the restaurant, anything to keep her as normal as possible.  Everyone said how marvellous she looked.  But it was costing too much (of her own money) from my sisters-in-law's point of view.  There wouldn't be much left for them after all the expense.  So she was taken away from us and put in a very chic home in Chartres, where she was very badly cared for and where she gave in and died.  I went as much as I could, there was something very special between us, she completely trusted me.  She died in the hot Summer of 2003, while we were trying to move down here and I could not get to her enough.  We had hoped to be able to bring her down here with us.  Luckily J-P was there when she died. 

Now back on thread.   [:(]

 

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[quote user="Christine Animal"]

Scooby, you have gone completely off thread with the well known old story, why care about animals when there are so many humans suffering.  We all know that, but the subject on here is food not the elderly in their homes.

[/quote]

Not off topic - merely putting things into context given the comments about cruelty to animals.  Dog seems to find it traumatic to think he may have killed an insect.

It's interesting that you raise the point about the 'well known old story'.  The fact that you feel this issue comes up on a regular basis suggests that others find the contrast between the treatment of animals and humans difficult to understand too.  For some bizarre reason, British people donate more to animal charities than those for children, AIDS or mental health.  

I think I have a balanced view - like many of the above I choose what food I buy with consideration to the conditions in which the food may have been raised.  I hope, however, I can put animal welfare into context with some of the more difficult to handle issues regarding human life that most people seem to find more comfortable kept behind closed doors.

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Should I start to get paranoid that there is another Dog posting here and I cannot read the posts.

I see various posts stating I am a hippocrite and there has been no justification - now it has been stated that I am worried that I may have killed an insect.

I don't think it's me imagining things...

Seems people get very edgy if you don't share their views and wear their blinkers.

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