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How long for Compromis de Vente?


Jon 1
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As sellers, we feel that we should have received a copy of the compromis de Vente to sign by now.

It will be two weeks this Saturday since we verbally accepted an offer through the immobilier. We were told that the buyer wanted to move quickly.

The diagnostiques were done and submitted by hand to the notaire a week past Wednesday by the immobilier.

We were also told that finance was already in place.

There are two notaires involved ie for buyer and seller. The buyer's notaire is located in another city.

It is a good number of years ago since we bought, so cannot remember the time scale.

Should we have received the C d V for signature by now? What is the norm?

The immobilier said to contact the notaire, but as per standard practice, the notaire is not responding to our e-mail.

Another immobilier with an interested client has contacted us, and said that they want to offer and can provide an immediate C d V.

Should we be chasing this up?

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Theoretically a C d V can be drawn up on the same day an offer is accepted but in reality it would normally take a few day as a minimum. A C d V is of course a two way agreement and ideally it should be drafted between the two parties in front of one

Notaire. Have you done a draft with the buyer ?

Although there is nothing to prevent the buyer using their own Notaire

having two is likely to slow things down a bit as you can end up with multiple mail exchanges as this

point and that point is clarified/added/changed/deleted - then both parties have

to sign and initial each page - so it's easy to see

where the delays can creep in !

I'd be very cautious of entertaining other offers at this stage, especially if you have had a full price offer from the first buyer.

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Thanks for your replies.

We are getting a little anxious for a couple of reasons. The problems in the Euro zone are one of them. We don't want to potentially end up with devalued euros, if matters go pear-shaped. When we watch the escalating situation on the media, we feel we may be in a race against time to conclude the transaction and repatriate our funds.

Secondly we have been caught out in a property transaction before, playing with a straight bat, and somewhat naively placing our trust in solicitors we ended up substantially out of pocket.

We were told that the buyer wanted a quick transaction and that we would probably receive payment within a month. Here we are two weeks later with no C d V in sight. We remember when we offered on one property, over a decade ago, the immobilier immediately rushed us to sign the C d V at a nearby notaire's office.

An added problem is that we are dealing with this from the UK.

In addition when you are not absolutely fluent in French you don't pick up on the nuances behind your restricted telephone conversations.

I suppose that we are seeking assurance through others anecdotes, that over two weeks can be the norm.

Hopefully all will come good this next week.
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I would certainly chase them first thing on Monday - we had only 4 days between offer being accepted and C de Vente being produced.  Unless there is some basic paperwork missing, it should be a straightforward contract for them to produce.  It is usually the time between the siging of the C de Vente and the final handover that could take time, depending on circumstances.

Chrissie (81)

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[quote user="Anton Redman"]Recent experience : Case 1 signed offer made and countersigned Friday 5 pm. Compromis de Vente drawn up and signed 4pm Saturday at Immobelier's office. Case 2 offer signed and countersigned Wednesday 28th Sept. Compromis signed Friday 7th October despite two notaires being involved[/quote]

Anton Redman, those are good examples.  Nowadays, any agent worth their salt should get it all moving, compromis signed and deposit in the notaire's account without faffing about.

This was our schedule when we moved last year.  Viewed house on Saturday.  Price agreed, after a day or two of haggling, by Tuesday.  On the Tuesday, we took another view, just to be sure it was the house we wanted and drove around the area, including calling at the mairie to look at the Development Plan, etc.

Agent got all the diagnostics done in the next couple of days.  Because I was off to Spain for 6 to 8 weeks, the compromis was signed on the Friday afternoon after we went to the house and had that final inspection and had workings of the house explained to us. 

Whilst the diagnostics were being done, I arranged transfer of the funds for the deposit and arranged the insurance, etc so that all was in place on the Friday.

When I returned from Spain about 7 weeks later, the owners asked for an extra month to get their move sorted.  We agreed and, despite the delay requested by the owners, we had the house within 3 months.

That, to me was an ideal transaction:  no long drawn out messing about but we didn't feel unduly hurried either.

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Many thanks for all the replies.

Given the comments, I must admit that I am a little more anxious now.

I hope we are not being played, or the notaire is one of the more laid back ones.

As I said we had a previous really bad experience with an unscrupulous seller and solicitor, where we subsequently ended up tens of thousands of pounds out of pocket. This was due to us being naive in the cut and thrust of buying and selling. We vowed to be more hard headed next time, but have been just as docile and soft this time.

As I said another immobilier contacted us after our verbal acceptance of the sale and said they had an interested client who could possibly beat the offer, and provide an immediate C d V. Silly us said that our word was our bond, and here we are getting more anxious by each passing day, particularly as we were told that the buyer wanted a quick purchase!

I hope the delay is due to the notaires being in two different cities and us in the UK. However, I would have expected to have had sight of a C d V by now, given that our notaire has had nine working days to produce it, and the facility of instant electronic communication.

If we hear nothing by Monday afternoon, I may try to exert some pressure on the immobilier.

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[quote user="Jon 1"]If we hear nothing by Monday afternoon, I may try to exert some pressure on the immobilier.[/quote]

You can say that again!

I would suggest the 'red hot poker' treatment, although I appreciate that it may have to be administered remotely.

"It's a quiet market, you're being well paid for this, go and sort it out. Tell me by lunchtime tomorrow that it's on or off".

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[quote user="Jon 1"]another immobilier contacted us after our verbal acceptance of the sale and said they had an interested client who could possibly beat the offer[/quote]

That is potentially quite significant. Clearly the offer you have accepted is below your asking price and that being so, as I understand it anyway, until you have both signed a C d V you are entitled to consider a higher or full price offer but must give your existing purchasers the opportunity to match it. You cannot ask for more than the full price but if the buyers themselves choose to enter a bidding war above that that is up to them.

I would say that your next move would be to let the other buyer make his offer and if it is higher tell the current one and also tell him to put up or shut up and that unless he cooperates in getting the C d V and deposit in place within say 7 days you will ditch him and accept it.

I appreciate that your word is your bond but it is only as good as the other parties respect of it.

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Tread carefully! There have been other recent cases on the Forum where a second agent miraculously found a notional second buyer just in time to claim his commission as well. The second buyer might be ficititious, but the second agent might still want a payout.

You might want to read your Mandat de Vente very carefully, and make sure that you give official notice to other agent(s) by the formal "Lettre avec Accuse de Reception", if it is required by the Mandat.

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There could be a very simple explanation for this situation.

As I understand it, a Notaire is under an obligation to ensure that all parties to a legal document understand what they are signing. You may have one, either or both Notaires with the paperwork sat on the corner of their desk wondering how the bl**dy hell they're going to fulfill this obligation when dealing with a) a foreigner and b) one that isn't even in the country.

Could be simples.

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Thanks again for the replies.

There are some thoughtful comments.

I chose a notaire who speaks English Benjamin, but translation of documents may take time as you imply.

A Lettre avec Accuse de Reception is difficult from the UK Mikep. I have found that UK

recorded etc is often disregarded.

"I appreciate that your word is your bond but it is only as good as the other parties respect of it". How true, AnOther!
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I was told that the reason for the delay was essentially the tardiness of the seller's notaire. They were slow in getting documents to the selling notaire.

We are still keeping our fingers crossed that all goes according to plan.

Can anyone advise on when you should contact all the utility companies concerning the actual date of sale?

We have been given a date of sale that states "it will be no later than". This makes it difficult to be precise and give adequate notice by recorded delivery letter.

The sale is going to be completed through power of attorney.

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Replying to your question about notifying the French utility companies - This can be left to the agent or notaire, who will take readings just before completion, so the buyers can take over the services (water, gas, electricity) without delay and there is no cut-off/re-connection. Exception is of course the telephone and related services (internet etc) which are optional, and you can notify cessation when you want. The compromis de vente and acte finale will also state how the property taxes (foncière, habitation) will be apportioned, and any management costs if a co-ownership building.

Hope this helps.

P-D de R.

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[quote user="P-D de Rouffignac"]Replying to your question about notifying the French utility companies - This can be left to the agent or notaire, who will take readings just before completion, so the buyers can take over the services (water, gas, electricity) without delay and there is no cut-off/re-connection. Exception is of course the telephone and related services (internet etc) which are optional, and you can notify

cessation when you want. The compromis de vente and acte finale will also state how the property taxes (foncière, habitation) will be apportioned, and any management costs if a co-ownership building.

Hope this helps.

P-D de R.

[/quote]

Yes it does. Thanks
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  • 3 months later...

[quote user="Jon 1"][quote user="P-D de Rouffignac"]Replying to your question about notifying the French utility companies - This can be left to the agent or notaire, who will take readings just before completion, so the buyers can take over the services (water, gas, electricity) without delay and there is no cut-off/re-connection. The compromis de vente and acte finale will also state how the property taxes (foncière, habitation) will be apportioned, .
Hope this helps.
P-D de R.
[/quote] Yes it does. Thanks[/quote]

 

The compromis de vente and acte finale will also state how the property taxes (foncière, habitation) will be apportioned,

 

we are completing at the end of feb, I am told, the  property tax is due in october, but is the responsibility of the seller as he owned the place in January.   I will pay him the proportion for feb to october,

what happens, come october and he decides he doesn't pay his tax,   I hope they don't come chasing me !

 

also reading this mail, looks like it is a good idea  for us and the sellers to read the meters together, and each to have a signed copy and to give one to the Notaire ? 

 

rgds

Bill

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The Tax Fonciere is billed in October for the year from 1st Jan to 31st Dec, so the notaire will apportion the bill from the completion date in February up to the end of the year. Tax d'Habitation isn't normally apportioned (ie it's paid in full by whoever had the house on 1st January). If the seller doesn't pay, there's nothing for you to worry about; it's the seller who will be chased.

I'd agree that it's a good idea to read the meters together, but if not, read them as soon as you get into the house.

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  • 2 weeks later...

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