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Contact after Divorce.....


SS2002
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Hello

My ex husband now lives in the UK, my daughter and I have remained in France.

he is threatening to take me to court over contact, even though I have been more than accommodating. However, would he have to use the French courts or the English ones? Would an English court have jurisdiction over me? If in England, would I have to attend with my daughter?

has anyone been through a similar situation?

Many thanks

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It's difficult to make any suggestion without more details...

Was the divorce pronounced in the UK or France?

How was custody/contact awarded? (you say you have been more than accommodating, and this makes it sound as if you are the ones calling the shots re access.)

The matter of a child's residence, access, holidays, etc... is normally discussed during a French divorce.

If the parents live at opposite ends of the

country and cannot agree, the Juge des  Affaires Familiales (JAF) has the authority to fix

the child's official residence.

The JAF who deals with access, visits, etc... is usually the one in the area where the child resides.

Whether this is still the case when one parent resides abroad, I don't know. But I have a feeling it would very much depend on the original agreement, be it French or English.

THIS may help (it dates from 2006) - Translation.

The info is based on a divorce having been obtained in France, according to French law.

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You say that it is contact 'after divorce'.

Where did the divorce take place, in France or the UK, and in which legal system?

I have no direct experience of this, but it seems to me that a little more information is needed even if understandably you don't want to say too much.

PS sorry Clair posted as I was typing.

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Sorry, little more info!

He appplied for a divorce in England through the English system. On the divorce papers, he wrote that there was an agreement on contact which he is now trying to change.

By being accommodating, I meant that I have paid for us both to go over so she can spend time with him and have always agreed to his requests as I think it's important she sees him.  He agreed to pay me a monthly sum (not much) which he has withheld this month til we agree the new contact requests, which, on an e-mail, he has written are non-negotiable....

Thank you!

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Clair

The divorce was obtained by him in England. The papers I have say there is no issue regarding my daughter as he wrote that we had agreed contact - he is now trying to change this. They never applied a sum to pay, he agreed to pay it (having taken advice, I presume) - he has now withdrawn the payment for this month saying I need to agree to a new conatct system.

I have paid for her to go to the UK and accompanied her, I am now not doing this as she can be an unacccompanied minor as it was costing me a fortune both in flights and dog kennels - he, meanwhile, can afford holidays abroad etc.

I agreed she would spend 2 weeks with him this summer, he is now demanding 3 weeks, plus all Christmas so she will not get to see my family at all over Christmas.

Thank you :-)

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 From your post, it seems you accepted his terms and there was no discussion or mutual agreement.

I thought all divorces which involved children in the UK had to go through the CSA and access/maintenance were to be agreed/accepted by the CSA..?

In my opinion, you need to get some official agreement in your own (and

the child's) place of residence, regarding contact/access and maintenance.

I suggest you make contact with your nearest JAF.

The worst that can happen is that you are told that alterations to the agreement can only be made in the country where the agreement was originally drawn.

At best, you start your own procedure about contact/access and maintenance.

Tribunal de Grande Instance de La Rochelle

10 rue du Palais

17 000 La Rochelle

05 46 50 87 10

L’accueil est ouvert de 9 h 00 à 12 h et de 13 h 30 à 17 h 00

- Affaires familiales : 05 46 50 15 09

(more contact info HERE)

In France, as far as I am aware, travel costs for access/contact are decided by the JAF if the parents cannot agree.

Also, in France, at the age of 13, a child can express his/her opinion concerning residence with one parent or the other.

When I lived in the UK, a French friend of mine had her daughter living with her and her new husband in England. She would take her daughter on the ferry on a day-trip and meet her ex in Dieppe. He would do the reverse trip from Paris where he lived, over the ferry to Newhaven where she would meet them.

They had been divorced in France and had agreed their daughter would stay primarily with her mother until the age of 13, when she could decide if she wanted to live with her father or carry on living in England, as per French law.

I know her father was planning to apply for the child to live with him after her 13th birthday, in order for the agreement to be brough back to the table and renegotiated.

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Even if he never sees his child again, he still has to pay. He isn't paying for the priviledge of seeing the child, but to help towards his own child being brought up.

Not negociable? that is nonsense, everything is negociable.

 

Use Clair's links and contact the french family court ASAP.

 

 

I think that the laws changed last year, and the french courts can order him to pay via the UK courts, as the CSA can ask french court to make payment to someone living in the UK.

 

 

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"I think that the laws changed last year, and the french courts can order him to pay via the UK courts, as the CSA can ask french court to make payment to someone living in the UK."

That sounds fine in theory; in practice the CSA is useless in my experience.

Hoddy
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Thanks all

The CSA didn't get involved at all, as there is a form to fill in regarding contact and the divorce court was satisfied that it was sorted amicably, which it was until recently!

 

At the age of 13, would my ex have to apply to the French courts for her to live in England as I am sure that is what he will do....regardless of what is best for my daughter!

I will contact JAF and see what to do.

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[quote user="SS2002"]At the age of 13, would my ex have to apply to the French courts for her to live in England...?

I will contact JAF and see what to do.[/quote]

My understanding is that this applies when an agreement has been made under French law, which is why I advise you do get it set ASAP in France.

the fact that the father is refusing to pay maintenance (for whatever reason) should be in your favour, as he is obligated to contribute, whether under French or UK law.

As I know it, with a French divorce, a parent can refer anything he/she wants to change to the JAF anytime. You can refer the travel costs; he can refer the residency...

At the age of 13, the child herself can express (not decide) a preference as to her residence (info / translation).

You need proper advice rather than the opinions expressed here.

Let us know how you get on with the JAF.

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[quote user="SS2002"]

Thanks all

The CSA didn't get involved at all, as there is a form to fill in regarding contact and the divorce court was satisfied that it was sorted amicably, which it was until recently!

 

At the age of 13, would my ex have to apply to the French courts for her to live in England as I am sure that is what he will do....regardless of what is best for my daughter!

I will contact JAF and see what to do.

[/quote]

The court accepting the details within the form regarding contact must make it legally binding?

Unless he is using your daughter as a means of getting at you and he genuinely wants to see her then that must be positive.

Does not the English court also take in to account a childs wishes providing they are at an age whereby they can make an informed decision?

Best of luck - but do remember that the child is the important one in this.

Paul

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When I divorced in UK over 20 years ago my oh at the time wanted contact with our daughter but she wanted no contact with him. She was aged 14 years old and a welfare officer was appointed by the Court to report. Aside from having interviews with us as parents and extended family members she herself was given a rigorous one to one with the Welfare Officer. I heard later that he had tried very hard to get her to have contact with her father but she firmly resisted. The case went back to Court under the Children's Act (I think 1991) and contact was limited to letters to be sent to her via her school headmaster. Needless to say she never had any letters. I think that often the children are used as pawns in divorce cases.
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Bias towards the father, is how I see the french courts. I only know of three awful divorces and that is how it has worked out. Also the avocats are horribly expensive, and as it has always been the father's with the most money, it has counted, them having proficient avocats.

 

I hear that in the UK the system is 'mother' biased. Although I have yet to actually see that myself.

 

I do have a suggestion though. As he is now playing dirty, as not paying the pension alimentaire, is just that. Write down every last thing, incident, the lot, even if you have done something 'wrong' an example ..........picking your child up or getting  them to see him a little late. It isn't who's fault it is, in this case, traffic can simply be jammed, these things have a way of being brought up as very negative later. So have a good think.What he's done and what you've done. I suppose just be prepared for every last thing being brought up and slung at you.

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Whatever you do, keep your "negotiations" to yourselves and please don't take your own differences out on the kid. 

My sister and I were on the receiving end of exactly this kind of dispute and it's no fun.  There was a thousand plus miles and two lots of sea between me and my father and everything imaginable was done to stop me seeing him or talking to him on the phone.  My sister never recovered and my relationship with my mother in adult life was completely destroyed to the point where I've now stopped seeing her altogether.  Just be careful, that's all - I'm sure you both will put your child's interests above everything else, won't you?

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Coops you have raised some interesting points. And when the power games are started, does the parent who starts them care about the effect on the kids, or about the kids at all? I know that they will say that they do and I never believe them. Getting one over on the ex seems to be the most important part of the game.

I really don't know what the other parent is supposed to do, my instincts say fight back, as the power merchants seem to get up to dastardly deeds....... seen it happen far too often.

Still, for all couples do break up and don't even like one another any more, I have seen the split work wonderfully. Money sorted, sometimes just visitation sorted, or even sharing the kids time between the homes. When it works, it can be very good, both parents, getting along reasonably well and the kids happy. It should always be like that.

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