Funeral & Wills query

[jay55]

Would anyone be able to give up to date info on the following queries we have -

Have read that funerals must take place within 6 days, is it possible to delay this? We would be terribly upset if our family were not able to arrange to attend in time.

We also need to write our wills, We understand that French wills divide the estate between spouse and children, but we want to leave everything to just the remaining spouse and was thinking of the handwritten form of will. Can this be written in English? And does anyone have a good link for the wording. Also does it have to be lodged with a notaire?

[parsnips]

[quote user="jay55"]Would anyone be able to give up to date info on the following queries we have -

Have read that funerals must take place within 6 days, is it possible to delay this? We would be terribly upset if our family were not able to arrange to attend in time.

We also need to write our wills, We understand that French wills divide the estate between spouse and children, but we want to leave everything to just the remaining spouse and was thinking of the handwritten form of will. Can this be written in English? And does anyone have a good link for the wording. Also does it have to be lodged with a notaire?[/quote]

Hi,

  I'm fairly sure the 6 day rule is quite strict , but best ask an undertaker.

As for Wills , the only way to be sure to leave everything to the spouse , is to find a good notaire, and have him draft a will for you both to copy in your own hands.You can write what you want in English , but the notaire may translate it into french, in the correct legal terms.  The Will should start by your opting for UK law for all of your assets, using the following words (unless the notaire changes them into french) " I wish the disposition of my assets rights and shares to be under the law of my nationality (English) as provided for under the EU succession regulations 650/2012 Article 22."   Be advised by the notaire , but satisfy yourself that he knows what he is doing -some notaires are not up-to-date.

[idun]

As has been said, there is the EU regulation now.

 Didn't exist when we did this, so we copied a hand written 'will'  that friends had done at the notaires. It is simply signed and not witnessed. It is called a donation entre epoux or dernier vivant.

In french, ofcourse, it's a french will.

These can be registered via the notaire in, or it used to be,  Aix en Provence. But does not have to be, just kept safely.

[idun]

 6 days, yes, that is the rule, but it is only working days, not ferie or weekends.

If you live in France, like french people you will have to make your arrangements taking the 6 days into account.  I never knew of this rule being a problem, to french people at least.

[grumpyaudeman]

Hi

Speak to a local notaire its free if he just gives advice

[jay55]

Thanks for the advice, going to see Notaire next week.

[mint]

Will these things hold good if you died after Brexit or 2019, whichever is the soonest?

Not applying to you, jay55, just generally!  I wish you and your OH a long and happy life[:)]

[Hereford]

You may find a Notaire not helpful about a Will under this new regulation. The one we used when my mother died (and then asked about my father making a Will under this rule) said "it will never work as I cannot probate a Will in the UK".

He is probably wrong about it not working but I would love to hear from anyone that it has actually worked!

The six days can be a pain but is the rule.  The French often have a Mass later as a memorial service if family cannot get there quickly.

[Loiseau]

Would it not be best for the OP and their OH to make a "donation entre époux" for now (which basically leaves everything in France to the survivor during their lifetime), and then it is up to the survivor to make a Will.

It was a very simple process, at the notaire's office, when we did it - and certainly smoothed the path later. It does not cut any children out, though. Just defers the moment they inherit till the surviving spouse dies.

In fact, I remember the notaire saying that I - as the survivor - ought to buy the children out of their eventual shares right away if I could. Because although they could not turf me out of the house, or grab the furniture, one of them might either pressure me to sell the house or, conversely, refuse to agree to my selling it if I had wanted to.

But you need to discuss your particular situation with a notaire; take someone along with you to do the translating if necessary, because you do need to understand all the implications.

[parsnips]

[quote user="Hereford"]You may find a Notaire not helpful about a Will under this new regulation. The one we used when my mother died (and then asked about my father making a Will under this rule) said "it will never work as I cannot probate a Will in the UK".

He is probably wrong about it not working but I would love to hear from anyone that it has actually worked!

The six days can be a pain but is the rule.  The French often have a Mass later as a memorial service if family cannot get there quickly.

[/quote]

 Hi,

    First , the notaire I use is keen to get me to do a UK Law will - I am not so keen , as I can do better things in french Law; I also assisted a friend to have a testament authentic drawn up under UK law by the same notaire.

 Secondly , there are notaires in France *who are also registered solicitors in the UK , and can record the oath required by the UK probate dept.  I helped another friend to obtain probate using such an oath by post and internet.

*search on line for your area.

[nectarine]

We had our wills done by the notaire who did our house purchase en tontine, and he included the EU Directive bit in our wills. It was very easy. As we have property in the UK he was very insistent that our wills in the UK must state the same wishes as our French ones as he had no experience of who would probate this (UK and French property) but if the two were in any way dissimilar it would be impossible to manage.

I recently had to organise a funeral for a much loved friend. We were told the six day (excluding weekends and jours ferie) rule but it turned out the crematorium would be closed for a period so the funeral was delayed further which benefitted us. The funeral director got a special licence from the Prefecture to allow that delay. As it turned out, the UK contingent alll had plenty of time to organise their flights and sort out coming over ...... but to be thwarted by air traffic controller's strike on the day which meant none of them came! But yes a delay is possible in exceptional circumstances.

[Blodwyn]

A French friend wes able to get a delay when his mother died, but it was exceptional circumstances. He was in Tahiti, mother died in Paris but had requested to be buried in our village, 400 miles away. I must say, when my sister in law died in London on 10th December, we were relieved that the funeral was not until 5th Jan. It could have been difficult for us to get over from France just before Christmas..

[Blodwyn]

I'm still struggling with this! I was told a 'donation entre epoux' would not apply to a house. Certainly not to one in the UK. Our French house is en tontine, but we have a UK one also and I assumed that under French law UK property would still be inherited by the survivor and the children. So the notaire told us we'd have to revoke the Tontine and do a 'communauté universelle'. She thought doing an English will could be even more expensive as the solicitor would have to translate everything into French for the Notaire to deal with.

[Daft Doctor]

Couple of things. Firstly Brexit does not affect a UK citizen's right to have the inheritance laws of their country of birth to apply to their estate under EU reg 650/2012, you could be Brazilian and would have the same rights. It is only relevant that France is in the EU, so the only fly in the ointment would be Frexit......

Secondly, if you have a will which is valid in the UK (wording, signatures, etc), it will be valid in France (many online resources make this clear), and the will does not have to be in French.

Mrs DD and I have newly drafted valid UK wills covering all worldwide assets, complete with a clause invoking rights under EU regulation 650/2012 (similar to the one given in a post above). It is for individuals to take advice and make their own minds up, but I am very confident that our wills are both legal and valid here in France. It is true that as habitual residents in France the estate would have to be administered here, and a notaire would have to be involved. That it might be difficult for them to deal with assets other than those in France would be their problem, but not insurmountable in this day and age and with a bit of help surely.......