New Potager

[MisterC]

Hi

We are moving permanently to France at the end of April. A section of our French garden has in the past been used as a potager and we have asked our friendly gardeners who looked after the place when it was a holiday home, to rotovate it so we could start growing stuff as soon as possible. I know it will need more work on the soil which is clay based but what suggestions do you have for veg to plant in May on such a new plot? We are in the Charente between Limoges and Angouleme.

[Joe]

How about Runner Beans.If you sow in pots now you could bring them with you.Leeks would be good.Sow them now as well.Same goes for Broad beans.You cannot buy either bean here,certainly not runners.I bought mine in UK on my last visit.Hope this helps.

[Dog]

Get some aspargus rooty things in so you can be eating in two years time.

[Pierre ZFP]

Good idea and if you have space, globe artichokes.  They can get very big and spread so they need some controlling but spendid plants for the back of a big potager.

For this year, you could do courgettes, tomatoes, all sorts of salad stuff.  I always try to grow types that are not generally available or are expensive in the shops.  Oh yeah, beetroot and parsnips too.

[Tony F Dordogne]

[quote user="Joe"]How about Runner Beans.If you sow in pots now you could bring them with you.Leeks would be good.Sow them now as well.Same goes for Broad beans.You cannot buy either bean here,certainly not runners.I bought mine in UK on my last visit.Hope this helps.[/quote]

Sorry Joe but you can buy both runner beans and broad beans (feve) here but I agree, bestest time to get some in.  Mangetout are good also but mind the mice, they love to eat the tips.  And all the salad things too, if you're here now, look for the local plant fairs which should be coming thick and fast until mid May.

I'd be wary about rotavating the plot tho, one of the reasons that Joe Swift, the guy from UK's Gardener's World is giving up his allotment is that he rotavated the plot (against advice) and he can't get rid of the weeds that he generated by chopping up the weed roots.

[Gardian]

This isn't very direct advice I know, but there's a lot to be said for checking with the local folk. No matter where you are, there are some things that'll work and others that won't. For example here, I can grow flageolet beans, but not feve. Spring onions & leeks are fine, but not carrots. I've come to understand the reasons for some of the problems, but not others.

The same applies to shrubs & flowers & whilst soil makeup is the most obvious reason, it can often be something like the general temperature (i.e. its just too hot down here for most varieties of fuschia).   

[MisterC]

Thanks both of you - actually they're going to treat the patch (which has lots of nettles) with Glycosphate for two weeks before rotovating - will that get rid of the worst weeds? We wont be arriving until the 28th April and suspect we'll be a tad busy for the first week or so before we even look at the garden - will I still get seedlings from the markets in mid May?

[Pierre ZFP]

Oooo I fear you will get some flaming here for mentioning the 'G' word.  I will admit that I used to use it quite a lot but after finding the hidden horrors of the stuff I have foresworn it in favour of doing the weeding the hard way by hand.  Still, I do sympathise that you are in a difficult position and this might be the most expediant way to start.

[MisterC]

Oh my - I realise what I've done - might as well take a dose of G..... straight away. Sorry for any offence caused but as you say, I am in a bit of a quandary wiht my time scale or lack of it.

MisterC

[Tony F Dordogne]

You have to be practical about this and I would suggest, a tad less ambitious.  Getting a fully operating potager up and running doesn't happen that quickly, there's soil conditions to understand and all the techy gardening stuff too and even if it is rotavated, it still may need digging to clear any roots left behind.

What I would do is hit places like France Rurale and the other brico places, even if it means paying a few cents over the odds in your first year, buy the small barquette of plants and give yourself a flying start - and it's likely that there will be growers/greengrocer farmers on your local markets selling them also.

Do the easy stuff first, give yourself this year just to potter around with the easy stuff - toms, aubergines, courgette - and just a few seeds, get the soil sorted and think about planting up stull properly in the autumn, like onions, leeks and garlic to overwinter and then start properly in 2011. 

[NickP]

[quote user="MisterC"]Oh my - I realise what I've done - might as well take a dose of G..... straight away. Sorry for any offence caused but as you say, I am in a bit of a quandary wiht my time scale or lack of it. MisterC[/quote]

Look it's your garden, you do exactly what you want do. or what is necessary. If the "garden police" are prepared to come round and hand weed the plot for you then fine, but if you need to use weedkiller use it. Good luck enjoy your garden.

[mint]

We arrived April 1st (yes, I know a significant date) and, in our first year, we had haricots verts and haricot jaunes, tomatoes and courgettes.

OK, not everything was as we would have liked but we planted (around early May), knowing it was late in the year but we were still delighted with our crops.

Just try it...........might or might not work but the pleasure when some of the plants did come up!!!

[ViVienne]

the markets are great for buying trays of young veg plants and they are really cheap...just buy loads and see what does best!!

[mint]

Yes, there are trays of stuff but I don't find them "really cheap".  So, either I'm shopping in the wrong markets or I am a great deal poorer than you are![;-)]

[Joe]

I agree with you.We have all had gardens for years,but when we first arrive here its all a learning curve.I have tried to adapt to the condittions here.

[MisterC]

Thanks all of you for your encouraging advice - We'll keep it simple to start with but I have already sown some Runners and Broad Beans. So with Toms and Courgettes which I'll get when we get there that will be enough to start off with.

Trouble is when you are organising the move to your new country you (or at least I) tend to go into organisational overdrive to cope with the terror!!

Cheers 

[ViVienne]

Sweets, I live in the UK and was comparing the prices for veg plants here, they are still cheaper in France despite the exchange rate, we visit France for a couple of weeks in the spring and my son would probably kill off any seedlings!! so we bring some plants back with us. If I was in France full time I would grow them from seed but for a novice veg grower (or people who can't be arsed!!) the trays of plants are good

[mint]

Viv, pricing in the Vienne must be more sensible than in the Charente Maritime then.  The times, I'd picked up plants, even in nurseries, looked at the price and backed off!

There's only so much teeth gritting and forking out that you can do.............[:'(]

Now looking for flowers to put in the garden which don't require me to empty all the money I have in my purse.........

[Tony F Dordogne]

I think this is all about perception and prices.  I know that plant prices here are much cheaper than they are in the UK and on the flower/plant fairs, they are considerably cheaper than places like Jardiland.  Noticed that a lot of the bricos have had expensive tomato plants in for a couple of weeks now, forced and looking a bit leggy but crazy prices.

Our local plant fairs have locally grown plants, expecially veggies, which I buy for the basics and now concentrate on seeds for the less common types of veggies, like the greem tomatoes and white aubergines (and my rare breed/endangered seed scemes)  which you don't see but they're great (and cheap) for toms like marmande or the yellow pear type.

And for things that I like to grow like graminees, not a problem to pay a bit for them tho some of the brico places are way expensive, like a fairly small phormium for €48 when I bought one locally for under €20 the same size a couple of weeks ago.  Joy with having such a large garden and liking to 'specialise' is that if I buy graminees or plants like day lillies, I can split them, gro them on in pots and then have multiple plants the following year so the initial outlay is minimised by multiple plants from the same stock.

One of my fave places to buy plants is a veggie stall on St Cyprien market where they gro the veggie plants bio and then sell them on for a very small amount.

[dragonrouge]

Tony have sent you a pm as 'normal' email has failed?

[foxyloxy25]

Welcome to France, hope you settle in well. If you are talking about a large area for your potager, you could do worse than putting some of it down to green manure, until you settle in. You could sow beetroot successional sowings until June and July, French beans (think you will be too late for Broad beans) Runner beans(if you are lucky), climbing French beans, Winter cabbage (you might also get in a sowing of Summer Cabbage),Kohl rabi,Swede, Sweet corn (if you are quick, prepare to be laughed at if you do, my neighbours who are all farmer think this is really funny as they only grow maize ) you can buy Courgette and Melon plants etc always lots of lettuce. As it is a potager there are lots of flowers and herbs you will be able to plant as well. Good luck have lots of fun.

[MisterC]

Thanks that's helpful. we move in a week and the runner beans I sowed at the beginning of this thread are now 3 inches high and the broad beans just showing. With some haricots, leeks and butternut squash all in cheap plastic propogators, we're on our way I hope. As a completel;y separate question - are greenhouses much more expensive in France than in the UK?

Cheers

[Tony F Dordogne]

Greenhouses in France are not expensive, they're extortionately priced - saw a hard plastic (not even polycabonate) greenhouse in one of the publicity circulars a couple of weeks ago, 2.5 x 1.5m and it was over €900.  We used to sell something similar in B&Q just a few years ago that was under £300.

Glass houses here are very very pricey which is why most people go for the tunnels.

[Joe]

Welcome to France.I arrived last July.Before I left UK I made enquiries on this Forum and I received the same answer as you.As a result I purchased a 6x4ft greenhouse before I left and had it shipped over with the household furniture and a flat pack kitchen.

[MisterC]

Thanks for that advice - have just seen a 6 x 8 greenhouse on Ebay available in my own town! - needs dismantling but at £112 at the moment must be worth it. Bidding ends tomorrow so I'll think I'll try for it!