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..... And Guests I Won't Let In!!!


Coco
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We've tried... but we just can't stand it any more!!!!   ENGLISH children under the age of SEVEN.  Just what has happened to parents' ability to discipline them??????

I'm afraid that next year, unless we find that by the end of July we are still empty in August, we will not be accepting English families with young children.  It may sound racist, but the facts are there for all to see.  They just don't know how to behave and the parents don't correct them.

We had a couple of horrors last year and my husband wanted to say no to such bookings this year but I told him that in a new business we could not afford to be so choosey.  A few weeks ago, following some AWEFUL experiences, we said that we wouldn't take any more in the future.  THEN.... last Saturday we had a family booked in for one night plus dinner - 4 year old and 7 year old.  We were both absolutely dreading it, and what a delight!!!  we would have missed out on a truly wonderful experience and meeting a delightful family - but....... they were WELSH, not English, so cannot redress the balance.  The French kids are lovely, the Scots kids who have stayed here have been lovely, but WHAT IS WRONG WITH ENGLISH PEOPLE????  Have they forgotten all manners and respect for other people's property?  Do they think that for a few euros they have bought the right to come in and attempt to wreck your home and spoil the enjoyment of anyone else staying here, who has also paid?

I suppose I am ranting a little more than I may otherwise have done because my nerves and patience are in tatters this morning, after the family from HELL  A five year old and seven year old who charged around the house, jumped on the furniture with trainers on, went tearing up a totally separate staircase to their own and went crashing into our other guests bedroom (who were fortunately out!)  I told them to come downstairs IMMEDIATELY but the mum just sort of whined at them that they should really come back down but in such an ineffectual voice that no one would have taken a blind bit of notice of her.  They then went marching into MY bedroom and when I told them NO they proceeded to ask why not, they could if they wanted.  Mum didn't contradict them.  SO, the net result, I had to lock myself IN my own bedroom when I went to change for dinner, and I had to lock the room when I came out of it.  And I refuse to live like that in my own home for ANYONE

Dinner was a nightmare!  Both kids DEMANDING our attention for the whole meal, then, even when they were sat down in front of the DVD player to watch a film they still kept interupting the adult conversation or turning the volume up so loud that we had to shout above it.

Fortunately, our Belgian guests, who had been with us for 4 nights had decided to go out to dinner but we had suggested that on their return they should join us for coffee and a nightcap, which being very sociable people, they were delighted to do.  However, when they returned and saw these two obnoxious little b******s laying across the two settees in the living room, with trainers on the cushions, they said they were tired and would go straight to their room.  Now my husband had a legitimate reason to turn the volume down again, but within seconds it was turned way up.  In the end he really shouted at the children (in front of their parents) and told them that they had to respect that there were other people in the house, who wanted to go to sleep.  Parents reaction:  nothing - no backing my husband up at all, they just seemed oblivious to the whole thing.

Now although this latest situation is probably the worst we have experienced, and is obviously foremost in my mind, it is not, sadly, that unusual.  This morning our Belgian guests, who until today, had taken breakfast at 9.30 each morning, were down at 8.30, having heard the English family request breakfast for 9.30 themselves.  I apologised for the behaviour, asked if they had been OK last night because of their hasty retreat and although the husband tried to be diplomatic the wife stated quite clearly that it was because she would not have been as tolerant as we were of the outrageous behaviour of these children.  These people had been with us for 4 nights and were here last August for 2 nights.  They have already recommended friends, who are coming in September and they have stated their intention to come back again next year.  I asked them, what if last night had been your first experience of our B&B, would you have come back?   A resounding NO came from both of them!!  Now that's a lot of business (and reputation lost) by such unthoughtful behaviour from our fellow countryfolk.

Just as dinner started last night I had an enquiry from a French lady for next Saturday night.  We have one room available for one night, for which she was very grateful.  She then asked about dinner.  When I checked I realised we had, horror of horrors, another English family with young children booked in.  So I have made it evident, in advance that she will have to eat with a young family - I felt it only fair to forewarn her,  but I really shouldn't have to do that!!!

I'd be interested to know how others deal with this kind of situation?  I really feel that by taking oung families, we are jeopardising any other business we may have here at the same time.

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There are children.....and then there are children!

I think its a little unfair to differentiate between English, Scottish and Welsh children, they are just people and I have certainly met families with very different types of family from all nationalities.

However - it is your home and you make the rules. You do not allow peoples feet on your furniture - thats the rule, end of story. You also do not allow guests in your bedroom - why not ? Because YOU SAY SO - no need to explain.

They may behave like hooligans at home but NOT IN YOUR HOUSE.

When I was a nanny onlookers used to think I had a lot of patience, the children knew better, they were told what to do in a tone that brooked no argument if they were misbehaving.

Practice your stern voice - less Mary Poppins and more Cruella Deville

With your next family at meal time perhaps you could make a little game of 'this is how we do it in France' Be very nice to them before they have the chance to be rude......(I am sure you are anyway) I hope you find they are lovely well behaved, delightful, children.

OTH I could send you my neighbors - 4 children and you really couldn't wish for more pleasant little individuals, I'd be happy to take them anywhere.....but come to think of it their father is ...ummm Irish

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I think its a little unfair to differentiate between English, Scottish and Welsh children, they are just people and I have certainly met families with very different types of family from all nationalities.

Well yes Gay, in theory you are absolutely right.  However, we can only speak from experience and sadly, very sadly, our experience has not been that 80%, 90% or even 95% of the English families that have stayed with us have been bad, it has been ABSOLUTELY 100%!!!  How many other nationalities have had children who play up?  ABSOLUTELY NONE.  They can be boisterous, they are often told by their parents to stop doing things, the difference is a) they take notice of their parents and b) their parents stop them before they have even begun to wind me up, after all, they are children, and they are on holiday!

Practice your stern voice - less Mary Poppins and more Cruella Deville

Something my granddad taught me when I was little was that a pet could not understand the meaning of the words but the tone of the voice.  When I was a children's nurse I found this to work perfectly - it's not what you say, it's the way that you say it.  When I am telling any children the rules I always use my stern, serious, step out of line and you're dead voice.  It's the looks that you get from the parents that let you know that they don't like the tone you are taking with their precious little darlings.

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Coco - you know you will find sympathy from me...

Only our experience was with American kids (don't get me started).  We don't get many children in our gite bookings.  I suppose we have been lucky.  Originally we stated no children under the age of 6.  After our experience this year, we decided NO CHILDREN OF ANY AGE.  Too much damage was done and the noise level, among too many other very unpleasant things - one of which was needing to lock myself in my own home too, was just too much.  Going out ONLY when they were out - which wasn't often enough.

We actually decided to take a break from the whole thing.  We do already have a couple of bookings for 2006 and we will, of course, keep those (no children).  But, have decided perhaps we are not cut out for this type of thing.

I don't know why parents are not more concerned about teaching their children proper manners and basic respect.  I have an 11 year old daughter and I can assure you she knows the rules.  When she was 4 or 5, I doubt I would have taken her to an establishment like a B&B.  We rarely took her out to restaurants (short of the family type).  It never bothered us.  We wanted to wait until she was more capable of handling it.  I have always been aware that other folks are not too keen on hearing your (or anyone else's except their own) kids running around playing/screaming, etc.

It is a terrible position to be in to have to discipline someone else's child.  But it becomes quickly evident when the parents don't care and leave you with no other choice.

If you find that you don't have all that many guests with children, then I doubt your business would suffer if you decide not to accept them.  If you get children very often, you could find otherwise.  I guess only time will tell.

Anyway, you have my sympathy.

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I hate to have to say this - but have to agree - we have 3 sons (21, 18 & 9) and have brought them up in probably a non PC slightly old fashioned way - they all knew as children that "NO" meant no and that bad behaviour had consequences, we did smack occasionally - but almost never because their behaviour was pulled up before this. We also took them all out socially with adults from a young age where they were expected to behave - and for the most part did.  Result - we have 3 extremely well behaved sons are according to many people we meet we're "lucky". Luck has had absolutely nothing to do with it .....!

I have had to ban some of our youngest sons friends from coming over to play - because they simply will not behave appropriatly - and other close friends have there toddlers still running around doing as they please at nearly midnight..... I don't get it I would never allow this - it seems that in far too many households children are in charge - this is a recipe for anarchy.

We've also had to tell some very close friends that they cannot holiday in our house in France  - why because their kids are so awful they'd probably cause all sorts of damage and we're not prepared to put up with it.

Don't blame you at all....

 

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Coco, I have a great deal of sympathy for you. I love children but these days I would only want to stay somewhere where there is no chance having my time away dominated by the type of children (and parents) you descibe.

My son was a real handful, and I made mistakes with him, but he knew from a very early age to respect the fact that he was in someone elses house, and to adjust his behaviour to suit other peoples 'rules' informal and otherwise. He is 26 now and I am always really pleased to see him guiding the behaviour of his much younger cousins in this respect (unlike my younger sister, who thinks it's fine to let her boys run riot, verbally and physically in our elderly mums flat). I will not invite this sister with her children, but if they came with my son I know it would be fine. I suppose I am saying I Blame The Parents.

You will lose some prospective guests if you throw in the towel as far as young children are concerned, but you will gain others.

I am interested to know if you would say anything to these people before they leave?

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I am interested to know if you would say anything to these people before they leave?

I wish I could say that I had, especially when mum said she'd had such a lovely time that they'd like to come again!!! Yes of course she did, she totally abdicated any responsibility for the children or their behaviour.

I'm afraid I just smiled and said, yes love to see you.  When in my head I was making a mental note to be totally full for the whole of next August!  What I should have said was, "not on your nelly.  Or at least, not until your children have had a 500% improvement in their behaviour"  Perhaps if a few more people reacted like that people would be forced to look to themselves and their children and make the necessary improvements to make them socially acceptable.

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What I should have said was, "not on your nelly.  Or at least, not until your children have had a 500% improvement in their behaviour"

Or to adjust it slightly, 'not until you have improved your child rearing 500%'

I do think child rearing is very hard. I found it really hard to draw any kind of line in terms of what was acceptable behaviour with me, in our own home. Outside the home I found it much easier to be very firm and consistent about what was acceptable - and yet a much more fluid and sophisticated range of behaviours to 'match' situations is required beyond our own doorsteps.

Hope you get some peace now, and maybe even nice children (don't wince, there are still plenty out there:hehe), to restore you to some sort of equilibrium.

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Must put an add-on.Jersey children. The 15yr old daughter sulked in her room for 2 days,when we went to clear-up,the whole room/floor /bed etc were covered in broken crisps and strewn with the usual young girl mags.The main room had all the wet towels dumped on the duvet and they managed to stack up the tall candlestick they'd broken so when we started to clean up,itjust fell in bits on the floor. You can usually tell,as they are the ones who slope off to the car without a cheerio!!

Fortunately the French/Italian/AUstrian children we have had in;and their parents;have all been a pleasure.

French friends who have restaurants and shops say that the UKers seem to have such Attitude, we call it bad manners and making sure you get your moneys worth.

May I add that we expect a few breakages etc and we have the response:No problem:

Regards.Nr.St.Malo.

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This is interesting and I do feel sorry for you - I thought it was just me that believed parental control was a thing of the past.

We aim to have our B & B up and running for Easter next year but my biggest concern is exactly this problem. I was thinking of not allowing children but wondered if it would alienate too many prospective guests.

I hope that because of our location (63) most of our guests will be genuine outdoor sports enthusiasts and therefore there may not be too many kids in tow - but I may be just being a little naive!

I would be interested to know how many of the regular contributors to this thread do not allow children and if so, how much custom you think you may lose because of it. I've not seen any such restrictions on any websites but I'm sure there must be others thinking along similar lines.

 

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We have had some little horrors and I have to say they were English. Some may remember that in another thread I mentioned about the little girl who climbed on to the roof of another guests car and fell off requiring stitches. I can't but help notice that UK children are far less well behaved than French ones although I suspect the latter have their moments also.

We don't have children under 14 at the suggestion of GDF and BNB mainly because without a pool (we have the river Aude instead) and that there is little for young children to do in our area it would be unwise to take them. This to be honest suits me fine. We did have a Belgian family stay with two boys aged 12 and 8, their behavior was excellent through the whole 10 days, hardly notice them at all.

As to the effect of not taking children I don't know but I do know that we have only been asked a few times but this may be because our area is renound for sports activities and parents may know there is nothing for children to do.

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With the experiences of two summers now clearly proving to me that the path we intend to take next year is the right one for us, when starting this topic I half expected a tirrade of comments telling me that I wasn't offering a good service by excluding children, that I shouldn't generalise, that I would lose business etc etc.  I didn't realise there were so many like-minded people around.

Instead of being subtle about whether we are "full" or not next year, perhaps I ought to turn this into a positive marketing point.  After all, the main comment we get in our visitors book is about the beautiful tranquil location and how people have thoroughly enjoyed the peacefulness of the place.  So if I add to this by saying we have no "noise pollution" from young kids, I may actually INcrease the bookings dramatically!

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[quote]With the experiences of two summers now clearly proving to me that the path we intend to take next year is the right one for us, when starting this topic I half expected a tirrade of comments telling ...[/quote]

Actually we believe there is a market for child free zones. Although we have not had many asking to bring children we have had quite a few asking if we allow children because they prefer places that don't. You can always be 'full' for children, keep a note and see how you are at the end of the year. You may find you have not lost as much trade as you thought you might.

Anyway good luck with whatever you decide to do.

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I feel sorry for the children.

No! No!  I do.

It isn't their faults.  It is their blooming lazy want to be best friends with my kids idle fat arsed parents.

That and it being against the law to clout them when they are being tooooooooo much.

Believe me.  My daughters just needed a look.

As I did.

Bring back the guillotine.  Hanging.  Smacked bums.

Ban them from everywhere until they can be behave but first give the parents lessons in parenting as I think they need them.

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Coco, l totally sympathise and agree with all you said. l am in a very similar position, except that l let my main house and live on site in a small gite on the property. l tend to get families, usually two, they always have loads of kids,they never go out and up to now all have been English. The property sleeps ten and the average stay is two weeks. Yes, the English children are horrendous and yes the parents are in the main totally incompetent in controlling them. l have also considered a child free zone, but have been told that l will limit my bookings by choosing this option. l am not sure that this is true, but l for one would have no hesitation to do this if l was still able to get bookings. Like yourself and so many others by the sound of this thread, l have experienced so much damage from other peoples children. l am just constantly amazed at the total ineptness of parents who just allow these children to behave and do what they like, wherever they are. You certainly sound like you had an awful time with your guests and their kids but without being too negative it seems that this is what it is like at the moment. Have you seen the new series of programmes such as  Nanny 911 where a nanny is sent into a family home to try and restore order for the parents?  These programmes are quite unbelievable if you should come across them and seem to show the incredible lack of discipline that seems to have become a fashionable new from of parenting. Last year l used to wish that the skimmer on the pool was big enough and powerful enough to just suck most of them through the filter system!!  Good Luck for the rest of and as you say you do meet some really nice people in this business but then l've met some really nice people at bustops!!  Kind Regards Shauna
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I feel sorry for the children.

No! No!  I do.

It isn't their faults.  It is their blooming lazy want to be best friends with my kids idle fat arsed parents.

You are SOOOOOOOOOO RIGHT!!

That and it being against the law to clout them when they are being tooooooooo much.

Believe me.  My daughters just needed a look.

As I did.    AND SO DID I!!!!   God, that look from my mum

Bring back the guillotine.  Hanging.  Smacked bums.

Ban them from everywhere until they can be behave but first give the parents lessons in parenting as I think they need them.       Yet again, spot on, it's not the poor kids fault, it's the parents.

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LOL I`ve got to laugh at your postings on here, Gastines, firstly you described our eldests bedroom to a tee!  but you know what.....she is an angel if we have company or go out for meals at restos or friends, and secondly about the long hair, both our two have long hair and I moult all the time.....I hate cleaning our lounge and bedroom rugs as it is but if it was a strangers hair uuuukkk!

As for little darlings, shoes on furniture,running riot,turning the TV up. Well in our house there is a no shoes rule,bums go on seats not shoes or knees , Ok I am sure it must be dificult to tell someone elses children of...and to get them to listen...but it is your furniture...as I said in Mikis thread about the daytime sleepers, I could not run a  b &b to save my life...I hate housework, do not much like other peoples kids and my face would be permanantly `on` as mr O calls it with obnoxious folks.

Mrs O

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We have 3 kids under 8 and they always take their shoes off on entering anyone's house and wouldn't dream of acting like this.  If they did, I would fully expect you to throw us out of your B&B!  If they broke anything, I would be horrified and would expect to replace it - and feel awful it it was something that was irreplaceable.  If they misbehaved in any way I wouldn't expect you to do or say anything, but tell me if I wasn't already aware of it and I would deal with it and you would get an apology from them.

On one of our recent trips an English owner of an Auberge commented that our children were very polite and well behaved - just like French children.  She explained how normally English children behaved awfully and just ran off into the garden and ran riot, and she was pleasantly surprised when our son politely asked if it was their garden and could they go and play in it?  She thought the difference was to do with them being homeschooled, but I explained they haven't been out of school that long - but they do have a strict (almost Victorian sometimes!) father and I'm quite firm with them too (tho not as firm as Dad!).  I was surprised to hear she perceived such a difference between French and English children but this thread seems to agree with her!

It must be quite embarassing for you as English abroad when fellow English families behave in this way!  Its not fair to have to discipline other folks' children and I can't understand the parent's accepting it in any case!  Next time I'd tell them to wise up and deal with their kids or you'll evict them!

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Just told hubby about this post and asked him what he would have done had he been the B&B owner.  His answer: he would have told the parents 'you get a grip of your kids or I'll get a grip of you AND your kids!'  Then changed the booking details from 'kids welcome' to 'well mannered and well behaved children welcome'!

Perhaps we're of the wrong temperament to run a B&B?!

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Just had 4 grown -up children in[and fortunately out] Members of a French band.Why do they always look so scruffy? Came in after their GIG at 1.30am and promptly decided to wake everyone up with door banging and showers,probaly the first for some time.At least they smoked out in the garden, not sure what brand but the blue-tits were a bit sluggish this morning.

As my wife say's"No gain without pain" but I can see an A'Vendre sign going up.

I may add on a lighter note that most of the guests are pleasant and a pleasure, just the odd few who want more than their pound of flesh and have no consideration for others.

My list of"Not Welcome" now takes up a foolscap page!!

Regards.Nr.St.Malo.
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Hey people, at least your horrible families with foul children are PAYING you something!!

Think of us poor non-gite owners who have "friends" (yes, I do mean that in inverted commas) who come with their ghastly offspring into your house and expect you to fall into ecstasies over the boorish, grubby, greedy, noisy, spoilt little darlings.  I'm afraid I now take the line that "we don't do that in this house" accompanied by what I hope is THE LOOK my mother used to use.  The kids tend to react as if I'm the wicked witch of the north, and are stunned at actually being foiled in their evil pursuits!  As a result I think I have lost a few friends but I can't say I regret it.

But how on earth do what seem like quite normal sensible people put up with this sort of thing 24 hours a day, 7 days a week?  Beats me.

Chrissie (enjoying a quiet non-visited weekend in 81)

PS Put them down the mines and up chimneys, that's what I say.....

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But , Chrissie, why did you allow them to visit in the first place ? Or had you never met the littlies previously ?

Why are the English so afraid of telling the truth lest someone be offended ?

Remember that there are only 2 rules that matter

1. this is MY house/car/cricket bat and you WILL do as I say

2. if in any doubt refer to rule number 1

John

not

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